Can I outperform and build a BK XXLS400 for the same money??

[Arcam_boy]

Hello.

Its the first time I've posted in here so please go gentle on me.

I went to demo a fellow members home cinema yesterday (DrGekko) with another avforums members (kbfern) and we got on to the subject of subwoofers which turned to IB subwoofers and building your own etc etc.

I'm normally a 2 channel lover although my present system in the lounge is currently geared up to be 5.1.

The rooms 17ft x 12ft, 2 largw sofas, thick curtains and acoustic panels on one wall. The floor is laminated wood and we have one half deaf neighbour who we still get on well with

Anyway enough of the rambling on to the sub.....

I've been eyeing up the Monolith but I've got no where to hide it and wouldn't want to use a £500 gloss black sub as a coffee table I'm afraid. So I've settled for a XLS400 in gloss black which is a bit more pleasing to the eye and should still offer enough ooommmph for film watching without upsetting the neighbour. The sub itself obviously costs £460 from BK.

I was wondering what could I build that would out perform the XLS400 (outperform may of opened up a can of worms ) for the same budget. This would mean the complete package. Building the cabinet, the driver, the amp and getting the case finished in gloss black.

I don't have the first clue where to start but I'm first seeing if its a viable option??

Thanks for any help....Moonfly....Russ etc

 

[Member 639844]

For the money you will struggle to beat it. Take something like an AE AV 15 (£250 ish), and a pro amp (£150 ish) then a basic sealed cab raw will be about £70 assuming you already have tools. You then need to get it finished which means filling (£20) and primer and gloss paint (many many hours of effort) and for about £500 you can beat the XLS 400 nicely in a pretty compact size sub (90 litres). If that is really worth it for you depends on if you want to spend time on the build. You will end up with a pretty high end sealed sub for your efforts though that will be very musical and have excellent performance given its a single driver sealed cab.

Me personally, I would build the DIY sub myself all day long. I built one for Tyler (member on here) and he's never been happier, and he replaced a Monolith with what is basically the same as described above. Feel free to ask Tyler about it :T

 

[swiftpete]

With some hunting for components, a bit of luck and some generosity
from another member I managed to build a sub that outperformed my monolith for less than your budget. It's a bit bigger than the xxls400 though, but takes up the same amount of floor space, it's just taller.
So the answer is, yes, it's possible!

Thread here

http://www.avforums.com/forums/diy-subwoofer-build/1248017-diy-monster-cylinder-subwoofer-ahoy.html

 

[Member 639844]

Dont forget though Pete, you had a lot of luck. To build what you have is basically impossible if you buy everything new for under £500.

 

[micb3rd]

At your price point £400-£500 it is hard to beat the retail offerings.

DIY really makes more sence when you want value on the midium to high end segmant of the subwoofer market.

 

[Arcam_boy]

Thanks for the replies.

I'm just looking in to it at the moment. I've not even had a half decent sub yet so anything that sounds reasonable would be a huge bonus.

As I said in my first post if its going to be too much effort or cost to much for little to no improvement over the xls400 then I will just get one on them.

One day once I've got the other bits of my system in place I may look at something higher end but for now spending a £1000 + on a subwoofer is a

 

[Member 639844]

At your price point £400-£500 it is hard to beat the retail offerings.

DIY really makes more sence when you want value on the midium to high end segmant of the subwoofer market.

Its hard to beat the BK offerings, not so much with the rest of the market. A AV15 would still outperform an XLS 400 though, at least IMHO.

Thanks for the replies.

I'm just looking in to it at the moment. I've not even had a half decent sub yet so anything that sounds reasonable would be a huge bonus.

As I said in my first post if its going to be too much effort or cost to much for little to no improvement over the xls400 then I will just get one on them.

One day once I've got the other bits of my system in place I may look at something higher end but for now spending a £1000 + on a subwoofer is a

I think the xls 400 will suitably impress you and serve your needs. If DIY is something your interested in pursuing, then I say this build is worth while. If your not really that bothered and are just trying to get the most from your money, you can do that, but the effort required probably wont be worth it over the BK sub. If you need to buy any tools as well, then its just not going to be worth it from a VFM POV and the XLS 400 is the sensible choice.

 

[micb3rd]

Its hard to beat the BK offerings, not so much with the rest of the market. A AV15 would still outperform an XLS 400 though, at least IMHO.



I think the xls 400 will suitably impress you and serve your needs. If DIY is something your interested in pursuing, then I say this build is worth while. If your not really that bothered and are just trying to get the most from your money, you can do that, but the effort required probably wont be worth it over the BK sub. If you need to buy any tools as well, then its just not going to be worth it from a VFM POV and the XLS 400 is the sensible choice.

Yep the AV15 sealed would beat an XLSS400 on output by a fair margin but from a responce point of view you would likely need seperate EQ (at further cost) on the DIY AV15 to match shelf filter and boosted the bottom end on the XLSS400's Linkwitz transform.

 

[Member 639844]

Yep the AV15 sealed would beat an XLSS400 on output by a fair margin but from a responce point of view you would likely need seperate EQ (at further cost) on the DIY AV15 to match shelf filter and boosted the bottom end on the XLSS400's Linkwitz transform.

Its worth noting that if you have Audyssey multi eq or higher built into your AVR, it will perform this task for you Tip of the day that one.

 

[Arcam_boy]

From reading the replies, it may be the sensible option to just buy an XLS400. As I stated in the OP I'm limited by space and funds so if I'm not going to see a huge benefit over the xls400 then its not really worth the fuss getting everything together and working properly seeing as I have little clue what I'm doing.

Maybe one day I will have a go at building my own when I have some spare time and cash and see what I can achieve.

Thanks for all the replies.

 

[Member 639844]

You can do it, you just have to want to really. The XLS 400 really is a good sub for the money though, you could do a lot worse.

 

[Arcam_boy]

Thanks Moonfly for all your help. I know I could build one but already the budget is getting pushed with £250 for a decent subwoofer £150 - £200 for the amp. Maybe £100 to get a decent cabinet built with binding posts etc and then I would still need to get it finished in high gloss black.

On top of that I would then need to get it all set up properly and no one on this thread has really said that a self build £500 subwoofer will blow an xls400 out the water so as things stand I'm swaying towards simply paying £460 and having a ready made, well finished subwoofer that works.

If I had your skills and knowledge and maybe even if you only lived down the road I would be much more inclined to give it a bash.

Thanks
Mark

 

[Member 639844]

A 1000 watt sealed 15" driver AE sub will comfortable outperform an XLS400, make no mistake, but its the effort involved in building it that is the difference.

For reference, go google sealed 1KW+ commercial subs with 15" drivers and just take a look at what they cost . Like I say, the last one I built was to replace a Monolith and the owner is more than happy that this was achieved.

 

[swiftpete]

Thanks Moonfly for all your help. I know I could build one but already the budget is getting pushed with £250 for a decent subwoofer £150 - £200 for the amp. Maybe £100 to get a decent cabinet built with binding posts etc and then I would still need to get it finished in high gloss black.

On top of that I would then need to get it all set up properly and no one on this thread has really said that a self build £500 subwoofer will blow an xls400 out the water so as things stand I'm swaying towards simply paying £460 and having a ready made, well finished subwoofer that works.

If I had your skills and knowledge and maybe even if you only lived down the road I would be much more inclined to give it a bash.

Thanks
Mark

Mine blows my monolith out of the water and cost me less than £500, admittedly I did have some luck getting the bits for that money, but you could source the stuff yourself and make one without too much trouble. You can make one that'll be better than the 400, but it's certainly easier to just buy one. It depends whether you want a little project or not.

 

[Member 639844]

Your forgetting size pete. You have size on your side as your sub is huge, which the OP is trying to avoid. This is why its not quite as easy for him to get the gains you have enjoyed. With keeping size down, you force costs up.

 

[Boink!]

Arcam boy, get some cardboard (& sticky backed plastic) and make a box the size of the XXLS400, that way you can work out if and where it could fit in your room.

 

[Arcam_boy]

Hi,

I can fit both subs in my lounge but the xls400 is a little easier to live with than the huge monolith and I just couldn't bring myself to use it as a coffee table.

 

[Charlts]

Hi,

I can fit both subs in my lounge but the xls400 is a little easier to live with than the huge monolith and I just couldn't bring myself to use it as a coffee table.

I'm having some black glass on mine to protect the top of it.

 

[Member 639844]

I'm having some black glass on mine to protect the top of it.

You can get all sorts of materials for this kind of use now, you can buy gloss black (or various colours) kitchen door panels from Ikea for about £40. The can be used for just such a use.

 

[ab1385]

Bear in mind though, that these will protect the surface from any spills/scratches, but won't stop anything from falling over on a powerful sub. I had a chess set on my Monolith DF and during transformers, at -25dB, the whole lot jumped off the sub. Wouldn't fancy my chances with a glass of red wine or a cup of coffee, especially if it's on carpet.

A dual opposed design would definitely be fine, I'd imagine a forward firing design might be better than a DF design but I'm not sure on that.

 

[swiftpete]

Your forgetting size pete. You have size on your side as your sub is huge, which the OP is trying to avoid. This is why its not quite as easy for him to get the gains you have enjoyed. With keeping size down, you force costs up.

It's true, mine is huge but as I've tried to convince my OH enough times, the floorspace it takes up is no larger than a normal sized sub, its just tall. Admittedly though, it probably would look a bit out of place in most normal lounges though and the floorspace argument never really worked that well on her either..