Cambridge cxn v2

clevs121

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I wonder if anyone could help me i recently brought a cxn v2 streamer and I have an issue with it, now on the main display im not getting any bit rate information and im pretty sure I should be? Any one could enlighten me i would be grateful
 
Info button?
 
Try a factory reset then
 
Yes my thoughts exactly ive done a factory reset and hey qubuz is showing up kbps now but not on Tidal... or Spotify but we all know Spotify rocks a 320kbps so not so bothered with that but brand new out the box was expecting better... thanks for your input. I seem to be the only one affected by this as couldn't find any threads on it.
 
I'd blame Tidal as they have lots of albums in aac.
 
Yes my thoughts exactly ive done a factory reset and hey qubuz is showing up kbps now but not on Tidal... or Spotify but we all know Spotify rocks a 320kbps so not so bothered with that but brand new out the box was expecting better... thanks for your input. I seem to be the only one affected by this as couldn't find any threads on it.

Ironically, bitrate info is totally meaningless as far as audio quality is concerned when you are streaming Qobuz's lossless (FLAC) tracks. For lossless files, the audio resolution (bit depth/sample rate) is a more meaningful measure of its audio quality.

What extra information about the streams from TIDAL & Spotify do you believe you'll get if you did actually see the bitrate? Bear in mind that:
  • Spotify Connect's (lossy) streams are always at a bitrate of 320 kbps on a premium account (uses lossy Ogg Vorbis audio format)
  • TIDAL streams are supposed to be lossless FLAC (even the ones whose PCM contents are encoded with lossy MQA) at CD-res (16bit/44.1kHz) on a TIDAL HiFi quality connection (which is the best that the CXN can do given that it doesn't support MQA & therefore not licensed to receive TIDAL's hi-res MQA encoded PCM containing FLAC tracks on the TIDAL Master quality connection).
 
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Tidal hifi streams are either flac 16/44, or mqa, or aac. Yes, tidal has lots of aac, sometimes even something like 96kbps.
Another thing about the tidal hifi is that this service streams different quality depending on the device vendor. When I upgraded the streamer, on the same subscription I got more flac.
 
Ironically, bitrate info is totally meaningless as far as audio quality is concerned when you are streaming Qobuz's lossless (FLAC) tracks. For lossless files, the audio resolution (bit depth/sample rate) is a more meaningful measure of its audio quality.

What extra information about the streams from TIDAL & Spotify do you believe you'll get if you did actually see the bitrate? Bear in mind that:
  • Spotify Connect's (lossy) streams are always at a bitrate of 320 kbps on a premium account (uses lossy Ogg Vorbis audio format)
  • TIDAL streams are always lossless FLAC (even the ones whose PCM contents are encoded with lossy MQA) at CD-res (16bit/44.1kHz) on a TIDAL HiFi quality connection (which is the best that the CXN can do given that it doesn't support MQA & therefore not licensed to receive TIDAL's hi-res MQA encoded PCM containing FLAC tracks on the TIDAL Master quality connection).
Hi and thanks for replying. As far as I'm aware the cxn v2 should show what format its playing in so bit concerned it wasn't doing as it should. After resetting unit it now shows qobuz playing as it should and must say it sounds amazing. Tidal well not sure about why its still not showing bit rates.. Will contact cambridge audio tomorrow to see if they can shed any light.. Even Spotify sounds good on this cxn v2 but not a spot on qobuz. Thanks for taking time again to reply.
 
Tidal hifi streams are either flac 16/44, or mqa, or aac. Yes, tidal has lots of aac, sometimes even something like 96kbps.
Another thing about the tidal hifi is that this service streams different quality depending on the device vendor. When I upgraded the streamer, on the same subscription I got more flac.

Firstly, thanks for pointing that out (l've now changed the 'always' in my post to 'supposed to be'). I should have been more careful, as TIDAL can't really be trusted to always do as they say - the TIDAL HiFi audio quality connection is advertised as being lossless. I have actually seen verifiable evidence on other forums of some lossy file tracks (320kbps AAC & 96kbps AAC+ included) unexpectedly appearing on the TIDAL HiFi (lossless) audio quality connection, eg (one that I actually participated in):



The other thing is that you need to be careful as to exactly what you mean by 'TIDAL HiFi' and therefore your expectations of it. I was referring specifically to the TIDAL HiFi audio quality connection setting, not a TIDAL HiFi membership account subscription - they are not the same thing, see:
1644164368506.png

BTW, it's not mentioned, but in case you haven't already inferred the TIDAL Normal audio quality connection setting is the one that's only supposed to provide the 96kbps AAC+ streams.
 
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I wonder if anyone could help me i recently brought a cxn v2 streamer and I have an issue with it, now on the main display im not getting any bit rate information and im pretty sure I should be? Any one could enlighten me i would be grateful
Hi Clevs

I am not sue what you see when listing via a music network, but when listing via my own hard drive
this is what I get.

Pressing the info button.
Screen 1. Yes you see the sample rate & bit rate to the right of the art work in small text
Screen 2. Image only.
Screen 3. Full track details (no art work) with the sample rate & bit rate on the left once again small text.

Keith
 
Hi Clevs

I am not sue what you see when listing via a music network, but when listing via my own hard drive
this is what I get.

Pressing the info button.
Screen 1. Yes you see the sample rate & bit rate to the right of the art work in small text
Screen 2. Image only.
Screen 3. Full track details (no art work) with the sample rate & bit rate on the left once again small text.

Keith
Thanks Keith, I did a reset and now Qobuz is showing kbps and I'm very happy 😊 Does Tidal show kbps ? Because its still dosent on mine? I would be interested to know.
 
Thanks Keith, I did a reset and now Qobuz is showing kbps and I'm very happy 😊 Does Tidal show kbps ? Because its still dosent on mine? I would be interested to know.
Hi Clevs

I gave tidal a try when I first got it and to be honest cant remember if it does or does not show the the sample rates and as I do not use it no longer have it. Mine does show the Kbps rate on all the radio stations although that's not what you asked.

I don't listen to music via the streaming services I bought my CXN V2 as it was very good hi-fi quality for the price as I have a very large record collection and I make my own digital copies at 192,000 Khz @ 24 bit no compression full dynamics and it sound great. The only thing I don't like about it is the fact you can't search for a track in your library you have to scroll through to find what you want.

Keith
 
Hi Clevs

I gave tidal a try when I first got it and to be honest cant remember if it does or does not show the the sample rates and as I do not use it no longer have it. Mine does show the Kbps rate on all the radio stations although that's not what you asked.

I don't listen to music via the streaming services I bought my CXN V2 as it was very good hi-fi quality for the price as I have a very large record collection and I make my own digital copies at 192,000 Khz @ 24 bit no compression full dynamics and it sound great. The only thing I don't like about it is the fact you can't search for a track in your library you have to scroll through to find what you want.

Keith
Hi Keith,

Thanks for replying 🙂 I've been listening to both qobuz and Tidal to compare and me personally will be keeping qobuz as Tidal dosent seem any better in my opinion. Yeah I cant get a stright answer from anybody about Tidal showing bit rates on tge cxn v2 so I'm going to Cambridge audio direct to find out. So question when you transfer your records to digital does it lose anything?
 
Like I said in my first post, I'm not sure what you'll be getting out of knowing the bitrate in those specific cases (Spotify & TIDAL - never mind the bitrate that does happen to be displayed by the CXN from Qobuz's lossless FLAC tracks), anyway and I'd imagine it's Cambridge Audio's reasoning too:
  • For lossless uncompressed audio formats (WAV, AIFF, etc), bitrate does not give you any additional information (if you know audio resolution, which the CXN does display), ie, bitrate = bit depth x sample rate x number of channels (eg 2 for stereo);
  • For lossless compressed audio formats (FLAC, ALAC, etc), bitrate does not give you any additional information plus it could even be misleading because it varies from track to track since it actually depends on the characteristics of the music itself (how complex it is, how loud it is, etc), and the lossless uncompressed audio formula therefore no longer applies;
  • For lossy compressed audio formats (MP3, AAC. Ogg Vorbis, etc), bitrate is an indicator of audio quality. However, the fixed lossy audio bitrates are already advertised by those online streaming services you mentioned, so I can't really blame Cambridge Audio for choosing not to display them. As the bitrates are fixed for each lossy audio format by those particular music streaming services, perhaps what might be more important to display would be the (lossy) audio format of the stream to remind you that you've selected one of the lower quality stream connections of the service.
 
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I have a very large record collection and I make my own digital copies at 192,000 Khz @ 24 bit no compression full dynamics and it sound great.

Nice to have a large collection of records in decent enough nick to make such needle drops from!

Just to be clear (for the benefit of anyone reading this) "no compression" here is referring to the "24 bit" for the "full dynamics" rather than you having chosen to use an uncompressed (lossless) audio format to have the full dynamics. Of course compressed lossless audio formats, such as FLAC can also be used to preserve the same uncompressed full dynamics.
 
Hi Keith,

Thanks for replying 🙂 I've been listening to both qobuz and Tidal to compare and me personally will be keeping qobuz as Tidal dosent seem any better in my opinion. Yeah I cant get a stright answer from anybody about Tidal showing bit rates on tge cxn v2 so I'm going to Cambridge audio direct to find out. So question when you transfer your records to digital does it lose anything?
Hi Clevs

The digital copies I make are 100% the same as the record as I am lucky to have a reasonable set up, there will be many who will say that the samples rates I use are over kill but there is a difference so worth it.

The down side is how much storage space they need for example an average 12" takes up around 500/550 Mb I have one 12" that is 820 Mb but I use large T/B hard drives so not a problem.

There are some all in one systems that turn your vinyl into digital copies but none that I have seen so far do it justice most do it the same as a CD 44.1 & 16 bit.

So for me my own digital copies are better than even the best Hi-res you can buy but most of the new tracks I want are only available as a download so have no choice, plus if I start buying vinyl again the wife will kill me, as spent a number of years getting my collection down to just under 4000.

Keith
 
Hi Clevs

I gave tidal a try when I first got it and to be honest cant remember if it does or does not show the the sample rates and as I do not use it no longer have it. Mine does show the Kbps rate on all the radio stations although that's not what you asked.

I don't listen to music via the streaming services I bought my CXN V2 as it was very good hi-fi quality for the price as I have a very large record collection and I make my own digital copies at 192,000 Khz @ 24 bit no compression full dynamics and it sound great. The only thing I don't like about it is the fact you can't search for a track in your library you have to scroll through to find what you want.

Keith
Hi Keith,

I also have my entire music collection ripped and use JRiver media software on my Mac to steam everything. I then use the JRemote app on iOS which gives me full control, artwork, abilty to add pdf scans for booklets etc., and also full search functionality for albums and tracks, artists etc. Sound quality via the CXN v2 is excellent, up to and including 192Khz / 24 bit. JRiver as a one off software purchase is about £25, plus a few quid for the App. The software itself is also really usful for media tagging and editing 👍🏼

Mark
 
So for me my own digital copies are better than even the best Hi-res you can buy
mmm that's a contentious point there for sure. Vinyl is an inherently compromised medium for storing music, bass and treble has to be rolled off at the extremes, and RIAA curves need to be used to equalise the levels too. These compromises don't exist with digital audio.
And at about 70dB of dynamic range that can be had from Vinyl, that falls far short of even CD at 96dB (plus more with dithering), and way short of the 144db offered by 24bit digital.

By the simple fact you're digitising the Vinyl to 24/192 you are of course converting to PCM, which then immediately negates any argument of 'analogueness' to the music playback. As once converted to PCM it needs to undergo playback exactly the same way as will be needed for the digital downloads.
So in comparing your digitised versions to natively high-res digital files - the chief difference is your workflow has additional layers of processing/conversion to it, your equipment chain will be imparting a certain level of degradation too, and then lastly you're also reading from a compromised media type with less dynamic range to begin with! (not to mention surface noise either!).

Compared to the plethora of garbage 24/48 'high res' audio downloads, maybe your versions do sound better. But if talking apples vs apples, so comparing to a pukka 24/192 high-res download - then it doesn't make sense that they would be better. All your doing is essentially compromising things with additional destructive processes.
I understand people want vinyl (I will probably buy a deck soon), but it's for the inherent ability to play back as analogue to the end. And this post is certainly not a vinyl vs digital post, but rather as soon as you digitise a vinyl source to PCM, you're back into the realms of DACs, filters, noise shaping, etc - so what's the point?

To sum it up, going from vinyl to PCM, you're essentially imparting the compromises of both formats in to the final product. You're simply best off to grab from source an inherently less compromised (high-res) file in the first place.

If you had a track you thought really demonstrated your better processes though, whack it on drop box or something and happy to have a listen! :)
 

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