Broken Britain.... is this country too soft??

Should the UK bring back Capital Punishment

  • Yes

    Votes: 62 59.0%
  • No

    Votes: 43 41.0%

  • Total voters
    105

Bill Hicks

Banned
We really need to stop using the United States as our yardstick to compare/measure ourselves against.

The US is not the only country that still uses capital punishment, and I'll be interested to see those other countries statistics concerning crime levels and re offending!

Maybe we should start thinking that it's our obsessive fascination with America and it's capitalistic "Get the money by all means necessary" culture that could be the route cause of most of our social ills!

After all other western European countries that don't follow the US's example don't seem to have the same amount of social/crime problems affecting their youth!




Edit.

Just announced on Sky news....

Members of an animal rights group have been sentenced to 4 to 11 years for attempted blackmail of scientists at Huntingdon life sciences research laboratory.

4-11 years for an attempted blackmail, but 4 to 9 years for gang raping a child who has learning difficulties, then destroying 50% of her skin by throwing caustic soda over her to cover their tracks!

Absolute disgrace!

This countries laughable judicial system should start looking after the little people as well as the companies, institutions and the wealthy!
 
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johntheexpat

Distinguished Member
"I've heard" that many criminals are not scared of doing the time because A) sentences are lenient and B) It is part of the job, i.e. an acceptable risk but I wonder if this would be the case if sentencing was more appropriate.

That has been the case for many years. The beginning of 'Porridge' with Ronnie Barker and others was along the lines of 'Norman Stanley Fletcher, you are a habitual criminal who views prison as an occupational hazard....'

I think making prison a more uncomfortable place would be a start. As someone mentioned earlier, it's not right that they have TV, games consoles or anything else that could be described as luxury. ......


The other problem now is not just the lean prison sentences, but too many people now see jail as an acceptable way to spend a few years. To some it means 'street cred', others an occupational hazard, others a form of enducation.
While nobody claims that anti-social behaviour is 'a good thing', very few people actually do anything about it. We all moan about it, but tolerate it.
How many people do you ignore or openly condemn for speeding?
...or stealing stuff from the office
...or knocking about with convicted criminals

Being an ex-con is now socially acceptable, so the crime that is commited along the way is of less sgnificance.
Its time, IMO, that people started cranking up the 'peer pressure' and started making criminal behaviour anti-social. It more or less worked for drink driving and smoking in public, now its time to not tolerate law breaking.
 

Sonic67

Banned
I was told that no "English" regiments fought in the Falklands.
My 'Midlands' Regiment includes a Jordanian, Malaysian, Liverpudian, Gambian, 2x Pakistanis, a guy from Hong Kong, a few Scots, and I'm co located with a Scottish regiment with about 20 Fijians in it.
 

Kwman

Well-known Member
Who cares if capital punishment deters or not. At least those criminals are not wasting tax payers money in prisons and having day trips and what not.
 

eric pisch

Distinguished Member
Edit.

Just announced on Sky news....

Members of an animal rights group have been sentenced to 4 to 11 years for attempted blackmail of scientists at Huntingdon life sciences research laboratory.

4-11 years for an attempted blackmail, but 4 to 9 years for gang raping a child who has learning difficulties, then destroying 50% of her skin by throwing caustic soda over her to cover their tracks!

Absolute disgrace!

This countries laughable judicial system should start looking after the little people as well as the companies, institutions and the wealthy!

total disgrace the eco terrorist scum should have got 10-15 years and the sicko rapists 25-life, vote for me for 5 years of glorious but balanced jail sentances
 

andykn

Well-known Member
total disgrace the eco terrorist scum should have got 10-15 years and the sicko rapists 25-life, vote for me for 5 years of glorious but balanced jail sentances

...and higher taxes.
 

stepneg

Well-known Member
Make jail a real hell hole like it should be, tiny single rooms with no windows and a bucket, regular beatings, nothing but bread and water. Provide all the cons with an option of voluntary suicide to keep the numbers and costs down. If they actually make it out I'm fairly sure they won't want to go back and to make sure make it clear that a repeat visit will be permanent next time.
 

eric pisch

Distinguished Member
...and higher taxes.

id save billions by removing all the speed camera, traffic calming, crayon coloured in road ways nonsense.

and trillions by sacking the army of middle management and senior management the government created
 

gandley

Well-known Member
Capital punishment may not deter, but i guess it stops reoffending.

Its a tricky one though as any system will be flawed and some poor guy who never commited the crime will be lynched. case in point that guy who was accused of killing Jill Dando, had there been a capital punishment system and considering the public pressure i guess he would of bought it.


But if you cant discipline your kids you got no chance of them ever letting anyone hang/inject etc someone.
 

andykn

Well-known Member
Make jail a real hell hole like it should be, tiny single rooms with no windows and a bucket, regular beatings, nothing but bread and water. Provide all the cons with an option of voluntary suicide to keep the numbers and costs down. If they actually make it out I'm fairly sure they won't want to go back and to make sure make it clear that a repeat visit will be permanent next time.

Like they used to be? Didn't stop crime then, wouldn't stop crime now.
 

andykn

Well-known Member

Miyazaki

Distinguished Member
and trillions by sacking the army of middle management and senior management the government created

Then spend the trillions creating new prisons when the white collar crime starts back up, or spend the trillions giving the people you sacked dole money. :D
 

nvingo

Distinguished Member
Then spend the trillions creating new prisons when the white collar crime starts back up, or spend the trillions giving the people you sacked dole money. :D
Or give the jobs of building and staffing the new prisons to those redundant middle and senior managers :smashin:
 

loz

Distinguished Member
talk about soft.

Seems like you only risk getting a caution this days for even serious offences. (well, I guess they cant be that serious then...)

Four in 10 serious criminals let off with a caution - Telegraph

In some police force areas more than half of offenders who could expect to face a crown court are instead handed a "slap on the wrist".

The number of cautions being given to violent criminals has risen by 82 per cent in just five years.

Cautions given to burglars have increased by a quarter over the same period while cautions for robbers and sex offenders have gone up by almost half.

The number of cautions for violence against the person went up by 82 per cent between 2003 and 2007, from 28,760 to 52,335. Some 56 per cent of violent offenders now escape a court appearance in this way.

Similar disposals for sex offenders increased by 45 per cent over the same period, from 1,359 to 1,966, and resulting in more than one in four now being given a caution.

The same rise was seen in robbery, from 422 to 614, representing seven per cent of those guilty of the offence.

And 23 per cent of burglars are now dealt with in this way as the numbers given out rose by a quarter from 5,568 to 6,972 over the five-year period.

According to the mail, even rapists and paedophiles can expect just a caution
JAMES SLACK: Even rapists and paedophiles are let off with a slap on the wrist in a grotesque parody of justice | Mail Online

Those cautioned included 30 people guilty of rape - up from 20 a year earlier - four attempted rapes and nearly 300 people who admitted having sex with under 16s.
 

Wild Weasel

Distinguished Member
That's a metaphorical 'slap on the wrist'. A real slap and they'd sue for assault. ;)
 
D

Deleted member 92943

Guest
This country is a soft touch when it comes to most stuff. Immigration is one that gets me wound up
 

johnny-17

Active Member
No messing around in China, as it's been announced that two men have been sentenced to death over the 'milk' scandal.
We on the other hand would keep them in a life of relative luxury at great cost - at least some justice does still exist.
Mind you, they don't have a very good human rights record on the whole though.
 

loz

Distinguished Member
No messing around in China, as it's been announced that two men have been sentenced to death over the 'milk' scandal.
We on the other hand would keep them in a life of relative luxury at great cost - at least some justice does still exist.
Mind you, they don't have a very good human rights record on the whole though.

They wouldn't even have been convicted in the UK.

CCA | Press | New Manslaughter Offence Delays

... the new Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007 - which technically comes into effect after 6 April 2008 - contains strict retrospective clauses that mean not only must the death take place after 6 April 2008, but all the evidence supporting the allegation must also taken place after that date.

David Bergman, Executive Director of the CCA said:

.. The new offence will only probably start applying to large organisation in relation to deaths that take place quite sometime after 2010.
 

ldoodle

Distinguished Member
Well all I know is that judges are obviously uneducated... how can they knowingly hand down a life sentence, then follow that by saying "to serve no less than x years".

Err, if he hands down a life sentence, the prisoner should surely die in prison, should they not :eek:

I also agree about getting rid of reduced sentences for good behaviour etc... does the victim of a drink driver only become disabled for x years, or a murder victim become alive again after x years.... nope! :mad:

Although I said yes to bringing it back, it should only be used in 100% clear cut cases. Too many times do innocent people get convicted... know it's fake, but just look at Prison Break.

I do think though, that public punishments should be back.. ie stoning, whipping etc.

I can fully understand why some people take justice in their own hands, and I certainly wouldn't hold back if the worst ever happened!

Oh yeah and stuff them all in one big place in sleeping bags, that would make more room! I'm talking proper squashed up. Not 5 star bloody prisons - what a joke!
 
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andykn

Well-known Member
Well all I know is that judges are obviously uneducated... how can they knowingly hand down a life sentence, then follow that by saying "to serve no less than x years".

Err, if he hands down a life sentence, the prisoner should surely die in prison, should they not :eek:

I also agree about getting rid of reduced sentences for good behaviour etc... does the victim of a drink driver only become disabled for x years, or a murder victim become alive again after x years.... nope! :mad:

Although I said yes to bringing it back, it should only be used in 100% clear cut cases. Too many times do innocent people get convicted... know it's fake, but just look at Prison Break.

I do think though, that public punishments should be back.. ie stoning, whipping etc.

I can fully understand why some people take justice in their own hands, and I certainly wouldn't hold back if the worst ever happened!

Oh yeah and stuff them all in one big place in sleeping bags, that would make more room! I'm talking proper squashed up. Not 5 star bloody prisons - what a joke!

So you think it's a good idea to give prisoners no incentive to behave in jail?

And you want to raise our taxes to keep old people in jail who are no danger to anyone.

And crime was no better when jails were worse and punishment physical, I'd prefer rehabilitation to reduce crime myself - of course, if you're not interested in reducing crime, carry right on.
 

johntheexpat

Distinguished Member
It constantly amazes me that if you kill people in or with a car, then no matter how bad the crime(s) you get off very lightly. This story

...was driving too fast and his vehicle was not roadworthy.

..The Land Rover had many "ill-judged" modifications designed to improve its off-road performance (Although when it went off road ...)

..his Land Rover "should not have been on the road".

."The vehicle was in appalling condition, its many and various defects were plain from the expert evidence given at trial."

..blindingly obvious that driving the Land Rover in that condition would be dangerous, but you also drove it in a dangerous manner.

So him, the missus and seven kids in this wrecklessly driven death trap, four killed and two years in prison.

Why didn't he get 4 life sentences? Oh yes, because he was driving a car and killing someone with a car is borderline acceptable. Unbelievable.
 
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eric pisch

Distinguished Member
It constantly amazes me that if you kill people in or with a car, then no matter how bad the crime(s) you get off very lightly. This story

...was driving too fast and his vehicle was not roadworthy.

..The Land Rover had many "ill-judged" modifications designed to improve its off-road performance (Although when it went off road ...)

..his Land Rover "should not have been on the road".

."The vehicle was in appalling condition, its many and various defects were plain from the expert evidence given at trial."

..blindingly obvious that driving the Land Rover in that condition would be dangerous, but you also drove it in a dangerous manner.

So him, the missus and seven kids in this wrecklessly driven death trap, four killed and two years in prison.

Why didn't he get 4 life sentences? Oh yes, because he was driving a car and killing someone with a car is borderline acceptable. Unbelievable.

its not acceptable but its also a completely different thing to plan to go out and kill someone and to be involved in a road traffic incident which ends in a fatality, did this guy deserve to get life no, was 2 years to little of course, although in this case i doubt any sentence will make any difference in that he now has to spend the rest of his life knowing he killed his own family, not many could live with that.
 

stepneg

Well-known Member
So you think it's a good idea to give prisoners no incentive to behave in jail?

The incentive to not misbehave should be not receiving a beating or lashes, jail is jail after all.

And you want to raise our taxes to keep old people in jail who are no danger to anyone.

If jails were a damn sight tougher there shouldn't be many older people in them, as I have previously said allow voluntary suicide in jails, would solve a lot of problems with crowding and costs.

And crime was no better when jails were worse and punishment physical, I'd prefer rehabilitation to reduce crime myself - of course, if you're not interested in reducing crime, carry right on.

I would rather punishment first then rehabilitation thats if they make it through punishment without messing up. Rehabilitation should be a privilege if a crim has an exemplary record whilst in jail not an alternative option. The amount of repeat offenders there are show that as it is it doesn't work, make it tougher it will make some think twice about risking going back.
 
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