Britain's HGV Driver Shortage.

Wez68

Distinguished Member
Wasn't much in the pay packet per month but there was other perks such as laundry so it was a very nice job till they decided to job evaluation it and guess where that went......
Yes I can imagine ,they never were the best paying
 

av addict

Active Member
Hi guys/girls been looking into possibly trying to get a Hgv class 2,,been looking at the government boot camp skills,as don't have the fund's to pay for it , Dont mind paying it over time,but Hgv is not listed,does that mean all places have been filled no longer available, cheers
 

raduv1

Distinguished Member
Love it , limited or no investment from big business and companies for the sake on profits and share dividends to keep wages low .

It comes back and bites them in the arse and these fudgers now want help.

Fudge them, greedy funts.

Burn it down , burn them down .
 

GBBooze

Well-known Member
Hi guys/girls been looking into possibly trying to get a Hgv class 2,,been looking at the government boot camp skills,as don't have the fund's to pay for it , Dont mind paying it over time,but Hgv is not listed,does that mean all places have been filled no longer available, cheers
Might be filled because the government hasn't made nearly enough training places.

Might be worth getting in touch with your local office for national careers service. They might be acting like middlemen for gov funded HGV training, as they will be able to filter those who are serious about the work and those who aren't.

Are you on Universal Credit at all? I know Jobcentre Plus has various training/ finance/courses, at their discretion. That will have increased under UC and in light of skill shortages.

Only other option I know of is training through a company where you sign up to work for them for two years.
 

av addict

Active Member
Thanks GBBooze,will try to contact local careers service to see if they have any info,and no,no benefits , working full time
 

Pugs1

Well-known Member
I had my C+E revoked when I hit 50 since I wasn't in a HGV job and didn't fork out the £150 odd for a doctors note. I notice now that my licence doesn't have the C + E anymore. So, if I consider taking a HGV job, do I have to do the whole test again or just the medical?

Plus, if I remember rightly (or not so) on top of the licence you also required further certificates which costs a fair penny if hauling?

It is companies own faults IMHO, they didn't invest in drivers, pay for getting licenced\certificates and once in the EU relied on cheap labour (and bad driving). HGV drivers were once all professionals but standards slipped and that is the company fault for getting cheap labour.
 

Grandad1943

Well-known Member
Thanks GBBooze,will try to contact local careers service to see if they have any info,and no,no benefits , working full time

Having worked in and alongside the road haulage industry all my working life I would strongly advise anyone who is thinking of training to be an HGV driver not to sign any agreement that ties them to a company for a number of year's.

Those persons will find themselves getting all the rubbish work and journeys that others who are free to leave anytime they wish do not want to do.

HGV driving always is very hard work over many long unsocial hours even without the added stress of being on poor journey work without the option of being able to leave the company you are employed by.

So, think twice before signing any such agreements.
 

Wez68

Distinguished Member
I had my C+E revoked when I hit 50 since I wasn't in a HGV job and didn't fork out the £150 odd for a doctors note. I notice now that my licence doesn't have the C + E anymore. So, if I consider taking a HGV job, do I have to do the whole test again or just the medical?

Plus, if I remember rightly (or not so) on top of the licence you also required further certificates which costs a fair penny if hauling?

It is companies own faults IMHO, they didn't invest in drivers, pay for getting licenced\certificates and once in the EU relied on cheap labour (and bad driving). HGV drivers were once all professionals but standards slipped and that is the company fault for getting cheap labour.
Pretty sure you will have to do the full test again , and you would also need to do your drivers CPC (just a money making racket imo , as its based on you completing the hours , not the content , you could for instance do the tacho module 5 times to get your hours in and bingo you have passed).
You would need additional certs if hauling hazardous chemicals/Gas etc
 

Pugs1

Well-known Member
Pretty sure you will have to do the full test again , and you would also need to do your drivers CPC (just a money making racket imo , as its based on you completing the hours , not the content , you could for instance do the tacho module 5 times to get your hours in and bingo you have passed).
You would need additional certs if hauling hazardous chemicals/Gas etc

Yep thought so. Did have ADR once upon time.

So, guess even if i wanted to help, I couldn't, not at those extortionate prices and I aint retaking my licence...lol
 

password1

Distinguished Member
What a lovely gesture. This will help on a small way to value and think of the truck drivers.


IMG_20211014_095040.jpg
 

Wez68

Distinguished Member
Yep thought so. Did have ADR once upon time.

So, guess even if i wanted to help, I couldn't, not at those extortionate prices and I aint retaking my licence...lol
Well you would of thought that the government would have looked at the option of reinstating the licence of people just like you ,ie gave up licence on non medical grounds ,as that would make sense ( obviously certain criteria would need to be met ) !!
 

Grandad1943

Well-known Member
I had my C+E revoked when I hit 50 since I wasn't in a HGV job and didn't fork out the £150 odd for a doctors note. I notice now that my licence doesn't have the C + E anymore. So, if I consider taking a HGV job, do I have to do the whole test again or just the medical?

Plus, if I remember rightly (or not so) on top of the licence you also required further certificates which costs a fair penny if hauling?

It is companies own faults IMHO, they didn't invest in drivers, pay for getting licenced\certificates and once in the EU relied on cheap labour (and bad driving). HGV drivers were once all professionals but standards slipped and that is the company fault for getting cheap labour.

You would not be required to take your heavy goods vehicle driving test again to reclaim your vocational licence. You would however have to pass the medical requirements to hold the licence and achieve the CPC training hours needed to be able to use that vocational licence for commercial purposes.

I know a person who did not renew his HGV licence for several years as he went to work for an undertaker driving a hearse.

Six months back he was contacted by one of his former employers offering him an HGV driving job with much better terms than they offered formerly. He accepted that job by going through the above process with the company then providing update training on the latest vehicles and operating methods.

However, after eight weeks which brought back to him all the reasons why he left the haulage industry, he was again back working for the undertaker.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
Shane B raising the issue of supply chains, cabotage and employment.

The government continues on it's own clueless road.

 

MrsArcanum

Distinguished Member
Shane B raising the issue of supply chains, cabotage and employment.

The government continues on it's own clueless road.

All it seems to have achieved is to get the Unite members wound up.

Cabotage only really works if they can get shipments to the EU as easily as from the EU. As long as there is massive amounts of red tape involved in exporting out of the UK, this seems like no more than the usual ill thought out Tory soundbite.
 

noiseboy72

Distinguished Member
All it seems to have achieved is to get the Unite members wound up.

Cabotage only really works if they can get shipments to the EU as easily as from the EU. As long as there is massive amounts of red tape involved in exporting out of the UK, this seems like no more than the usual ill thought out Tory soundbite.
Cabotage is just doing domestic shipments fully within another country. At the moment, the EU companies will ship goods into the UK and look for a return load - not easy, but if they can do some domestic work while they are here, it makes the trip more worthwhile.

This could add about 5% more capacity, but of course all the UK hauliers are now concerned that this will drive prices back down, just after they've increased driver pay...
 

Grandad1943

Well-known Member
Unless European based hauliers are allowed to obtain regular contract work within Britain while operating here I cannot perceive that there will be any great increase in the total freight moved by them.

Many of the freight clearing houses are long gone together with the vehicle spot hire offered by hauliers in past years. Therefore only regular contract work would probably be beneficial to European hauliers.

However, those contracts will not be offered unless those offering the work are assured those EU based hauliers will still be allowed to carry out that work over a substantial period of time, for example, two years.

In the above, it is probable that this government would not wish to place a long time frame on allowing EU hauliers to undertake large amounts of work while in Britain as that would amount to an admission that the UK remains dependent on the European Union for essential services despite Brexit.
 

noiseboy72

Distinguished Member
Unless European based hauliers are allowed to obtain regular contract work within Britain while operating here I cannot perceive that there will be any great increase in the total freight moved by them.

Many of the freight clearing houses are long gone together with the vehicle spot hire offered by hauliers in past years. Therefore only regular contract work would probably be beneficial to European hauliers.

However, those contracts will not be offered unless those offering the work are assured those EU based hauliers will still be allowed to carry out that work over a substantial period of time, for example, two years.

In the above, it is probable that this government would not wish to place a long time frame on allowing EU hauliers to undertake large amounts of work while in Britain as that would amount to an admission that the UK remains dependent on the European Union for essential services despite Brexit.
Not strictly true.
Spot work accounts for about 20% of all freight movements in the UK, and I work for a Digital Freight Platform that coordinates around 4000 loads each day within the UK. I can confirm that our European Brokerage Team has on boarded a large number of EU carriers specifically because of the cabotage rule changes. They can therefore bid for both the fixed price and offer work on the platform.

As some contracted work is going unfulfilled at the moment, there's plenty of opportunities for carriers to pick up ad-hoc work. We're managing this for over 160 businesses currently, with more wanting to join the platform.
 

Grandad1943

Well-known Member
Not strictly true.
Spot work accounts for about 20% of all freight movements in the UK, and I work for a Digital Freight Platform that coordinates around 4000 loads each day within the UK. I can confirm that our European Brokerage Team has on boarded a large number of EU carriers specifically because of the cabotage rule changes. They can therefore bid for both the fixed price and offer work on the platform.

As some contracted work is going unfulfilled at the moment, there's plenty of opportunities for carriers to pick up ad-hoc work. We're managing this for over 160 businesses currently, with more wanting to join the platform.

Spot hire work in the haulage industry accounted for well over half of the road freight moved in Britain prior to the widespread adoption of Just In Time delivery and collection schedules (JIT). Therefore, a reduction to twenty percent (if indeed spot hire accounts or even that) is a huge drop in recent times.

Prior to the mid-1990s many Haulage companies survived very well on open cargo port work for outbound loads, and spot hire for loads to return them to home depots. indeed I was a HGV driver from the mid-1960s until the Mid 1990s with the Transport Development Group (TGD) and that is very much considered to be the "golden age" of road transport in Britain for both haulage companies and their driver. employees. Throughout that period all TDG group companies ran almost entirely on that above open cargo port work and spot hire.

However, in my post @ #1292 I was making the point that I believe that European based hauliers will not wish to increase their share of UK transport work unless they have a guarantee of continuous loaded running while their vehicles are in Britain. To achieve the foregoing can only mean that those EU based companies will need to secure firm regular contract work to run alongside their regular freight services into and from Britain.

In the above, anyone has to wonder what companies will wish to offer firm time based contracts to EU based road transport companies running in the UK when the British government could stop those hauliers carrying out that work by the reintroduction of the cabotage regulations at any time?????
 

noiseboy72

Distinguished Member
Spot hire work in the haulage industry accounted for well over half of the road freight moved in Britain prior to the widespread adoption of Just In Time delivery and collection schedules (JIT). Therefore, a reduction to twenty percent (if indeed spot hire accounts or even that) is a huge drop in recent times.

Prior to the mid-1990s many Haulage companies survived very well on open cargo port work for outbound loads, and spot hire for loads to return them to home depots. indeed I was a HGV driver from the mid-1960s until the Mid 1990s with the Transport Development Group (TGD) and that is very much considered to be the "golden age" of road transport in Britain for both haulage companies and their driver. employees. Throughout that period all TDG group companies ran almost entirely on that above open cargo port work and spot hire.

However, in my post @ #1292 I was making the point that I believe that European based hauliers will not wish to increase their share of UK transport work unless they have a guarantee of continuous loaded running while their vehicles are in Britain. To achieve the foregoing can only mean that those EU based companies will need to secure firm regular contract work to run alongside their regular freight services into and from Britain.

In the above, anyone has to wonder what companies will wish to offer firm time based contracts to EU based road transport companies running in the UK when the British government could stop those hauliers carrying out that work by the reintroduction of the cabotage regulations at any time?????
What is happening is that overseas drivers are spending more time in the UK before returning home. This is proving more profitable than just doing inbound to the UK and then returning empty - which is the current norm.

They tend to be bringing in fresh fruit and veg, so are using reefers and curtain siders. These are suitable for general haulage, so they can move everything from car parts to chocolate bars around the country for a couple of weeks before hopping back on the ferry home.

We're seeing significant interest from EU hauliers, as UK rates for shipments have jumped up. Even the Irish guys are looking to come over for a bit of the action!
 

SyStemDeMoN

Well-known Member
My agency is trying to tempt me back onto the containers.
But this fridge work is too easy and clean !
 

Grandad1943

Well-known Member
What is happening is that overseas drivers are spending more time in the UK before returning home. This is proving more profitable than just doing inbound to the UK and then returning empty - which is the current norm.

They tend to be bringing in fresh fruit and veg, so are using reefers and curtain siders. These are suitable for general haulage, so they can move everything from car parts to chocolate bars around the country for a couple of weeks before hopping back on the ferry home.

We're seeing significant interest from EU hauliers, as UK rates for shipments have jumped up. Even the Irish guys are looking to come over for a bit of the action!

Even if the above scenario turns out to be correct, I cannot see any medium or long term benefits for consumers, the UK haulage industry or British commerce in general

The British road Haulage industry has been highly efficient in the past two decades. However, that efficiency relied on a critical percentage of European Union HGV Drivers which in January this year were suddenly no longer available.
That scenario has brought about the supply chain situation Britain finds itself in now

Therefore to encourage a predicament where Brexit Britain becomes even more reliant on European Union HGV Drivers and EU registered vehicles is courting disaster for the British road haulage industry and the many thousands of companies that rely on heavy road transport for their very survival.

British Hauliers are one hundred percent responsible for the situation they find themselves in now. However, the solution is not to allow that British industry to be destroyed by EU based competition at a time when it cannot respond to that threat. It is however to rebuild and reshape British road distribution based on new regulations, in house operation of transport by the large supermarket retailers and other ancillary supply chain industries to those retailers and manufacturers.

It has been the reliance on cheap EU based HGV drivers that have produced shortages on our supermarket shelves, containers not being moved through our ports and a threat to the Christmas supply chain that means so much for Britains retailers and those that sell their products to those retailers.

The UK also has a government that was elected to "Get Brexit Done" and that government will not be allowed by Tory backbenchers to see one of Britains most essential industries to become even more dominated by the European Union.

In that, an even more unstable situation in our road transport industry may well develop than we have all witnessed over the past eight months.

Time for those who appear to be celebrating the removal of the Cabotage regulations to think again, I believe.
 
Last edited:

noiseboy72

Distinguished Member
Even if the above scenario turns out to be correct, I cannot see any medium or long term benefits for consumers, the UK haulage industry or British commerce in general

The British road Haulage industry has been highly efficient in the past two decades. However, that efficiency relied on a critical percentage of European Union HGV Drivers which in January this year were suddenly no longer available.
That scenario has brought about the supply chain situation Britain finds itself in now

Therefore to encourage a predicament where Brexit Britain becomes even more reliant on European Union HGV Drivers and EU registered vehicles is courting disaster for the British road haulage industry and the many thousands of companies that rely on heavy road transport for their very survival.

British Hauliers are one hundred percent responsible for the situation they find themselves in now. However, the solution is not to allow that British industry to be destroyed by EU based competition at a time when it cannot respond to that threat. It is however to rebuild and reshape British road distribution based on new regulations, in house operation of transport by the large supermarket retailers and other ancillary supply chain industries to those retailers and manufacturers.

It has been the reliance on cheap EU based HGV drivers that have produced shortages on our supermarket shelves, containers not being moved through our ports and a threat to the Christmas supply chain that means so much for Britains retailers and those that sell their products to those retailers.

The UK also has a government that was elected to "Get Brexit Done" and that government will not be allowed by Tory backbenchers to see one of Britains most essential industries to become even more dominated by the European Union.

In that, an even more unstable situation in our road transport industry may well develop than we have all witnessed over the past eight months.

Time for those who appear to be celebrating the removal of the Cabotage regulations to think again, I believe.
I don't disagree. It's a short term sticking plaster at best. I don't think it will particularly affect the UK hauliers in the long term, or drive down prices, but a better long term strategy needs to be developed.

It's all very well building the UK as a "High Skill, High Wage" country, but we still need people to work in the supply chain and service industries. These jobs are never going to be as well paid as management and so called "skilled" jobs and the government needs to allow for this in their planning.

Too many "UK" businesses are actually owned by overseas companies, so the profits end up being shipped abroad. I'm no fan of nationalisation, but we do need to keep UK profits this side of the channel.
 

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