Biamp with 4 P1s?

mpmct

Standard Member
Current kit : CD36 + C31 + P1s (2) + MA GS10s.

Considering adding two more P1s, passive biamp.

Anyone had experience with this scenario, or similar?

Bang for the buck? Caveats? Free advice?
 

p203557

Novice Member
I've got cd23 + c31 + 2 x p1's with PMC OB1's and am considering the same so if anyone has any experience I too would be interested.
 

p203557

Novice Member
btw to answer the question a bit I know 'unrealdave' has played about bi-amping with a p35 and 2 p1's and has posted here before so try checking his previous posts although I don't think he's actually posted anything about 4 * p1's.
 

mpmct

Standard Member
Thanks p203557 ... yes, I had searched on 'biamp'
in the Arcam Owner's Forum, and read 'unrealdaves' posts regarding
his biamping experience, with great interest.

I also noted that Crusty's ultimate Arcam system would be:
CD36 + C31 + 6 ( six ) P1s. :)

I've even gone so far as to biamp *one* speaker, one channel,
with the two P1s I own, and made lame attempts to judge
the difference. :rolleyes:

If only my local dealer had two P1s on demo ...
he would happily let me try them at home over a weekend. But alas, no.

Hope someone has been here, done this, and will share their thoughts!
 

Arcam_boy

Distinguished Member
HI,

I don't knwo where abouts in the country you are based as it doesn't say but I just noticed that the Exeter SevenOaks store has two ex display P1's in its clearence section maybe you could leave a deposit and borrow them for the weekend if your from that way :rolleyes:
 

rkb

Member
heir today, gone tomorrow:)

I'm selling my three P1's but this thread has got me thinking that I should buy another one instead!

Cheers

rkb
 

mpmct

Standard Member
heir today, gone tomorrow:)
Good one! :smashin:

Heir today, but gone many many years ago.
Has left us all wondering over here,
what might have been, over there.

Now, with what would one replace three P1s?
The curious want to know. And to what end?
 

rkb

Member
Hi there Heir!

I have two Arcam FMJ systems- was thinking of selling the P1's, getting a AV8/P7 system to do all.

presently have:
music:
CD23
C30 pre-amp
2x P1's
(3rd P1 in storage!)

movies:
DV27
A22 + DAVe 5.1 board
P25 3 channel amp



Or maybe I should use the A22_DAVE as a 5.1 pre-amp, use 3 P1's for the front 3 channels and the P25/3 for the rears. That way i just have to sell the C30- and maybe the CD23 as the DV27 is very good with music anyway.
Any thoughts?
 

mpmct

Standard Member
Hi there Heir!

(3rd P1 in storage!)
A 3rd ... in storage?

You need a 4th. ;)

I hope someone with experience might be bored enough
by this thread to have mercy and share their P1s biamping
experience(s). I have nothing to offer by way of advice,
having only a measly two P1s. :rolleyes:
 

unrealdave

Active Member
Hi

I have a C31 with 2 P1's on the LF of some Celestion A3's and have used a P35 for the HF but I now use the P1's on the HF and 2 P25's for the LF (each with the link in to make them mono).

I do know this as fact -

Celestion A3 speakers sound fantastic when they are biamped.

I have biamped them with

AVR350 on HF and 1 P35 on LF

AVR350 as pre only and P35 on HF and P25 on LF

AVR350 as pre only and P35 on HF and a P25 on each LF (with mono link in)

then

C31 pre and

2 P1's

2 P1's on LF and 1 P35 on HF

2 P25's, one on each speaker so not biamped - with mono link in

2 P1's on LF and 2 P25's on HF (with mono link in)

There is a big difference to my ears between biamping and not. The different combinations I have tried have all sounded fantastic, but different. Which is best is difficult to say because it is sometimes a bit of a sideways move, or so it would seem. More power seems to be the way to go for me and as soon as I can pick up some more P1's around the £500 mark (about the going rate on the auction sites) I will and then I will report back.

Any one who has a couple of P1's and wants to come over with them is welcome to - after Christmas :D

I have also biamped the front speakers on my movie systems (A4c and C4c), a set of celestion 7000 with 2 foot ribbon tweeters, and some A2's - in every case biamping makes a big improvement.

Biwiring does not do it for me at all, I could not tell the difference.

What does ‘passive biamp’ mean?
 

rkb

Member
Hello Unrealdave- I had 3 P1's and had considered a fourth to bi-amp, but ended up selling a pair today. One left here if you fancy treating yourself for xmas?
http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=437920&page=4

After some renovations I'm leaning toward merging my two FMJ systems into one movie based set-up.

I loved the P1's but I don't have the space to use lots of P1's in a 5.1 system- so I'll be looking for a P7 instead.

Cheers

rkb
 

mpmct

Standard Member
... Biwiring does not do it for me at all, I could not tell the difference.

What does ‘passive biamp’ mean?
Thanks for the info unrealdave.

I too have found little or no benefit in biwiring my MA GS10s.

Here's an explanation of 'active' versus 'passive':

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_9_4/feature-article-active-speakers-12-2002.html

Since my speakers are 2-way, with a built in crossover
( of course ), biamping in this case would be 'passive', at least
as I understand the term. I hope I'm using it correctly.

Linn, Meridian, PMC/Bryston, to name the ones that come
to mind, all offer some models of active speaker systems.
Bryston, for one, makes an external crossover unit that splits the signal
frequencies before they even hit amplification.
I'm pretty sure I have that right. I hope someone will correct me if I've erred. :)
 

unrealdave

Active Member
Hi mpmct

I read the article - I think passive / active refers to the speakers, not the mode of biamping - not that it matters :)

If you do get another couple of P1's then let me know how you get on.

cheers

Dave
 

mpmct

Standard Member
Hi mpmct

I read the article - I think passive / active refers to the speakers, not the mode of biamping - not that it matters :)

If you do get another couple of P1's then let me know how you get on.

cheers

Dave
Hi Dave,

I think active is a combination of:
one amp per speaker coil, and the crossover earlier in the chain,
so 1) the amps each push a smaller range of frequencies,
and 2) the speakers are minus crossovers at the 'speaker level',
which, as I understand it, are always a compromise
at that spot in the chain.

Thes articles might interest you:

"Benefits of Bi-Amplification - Not quite magic, but close (Part I)"

"Benefits of Bi-Amplification - Crossovers, tri-amping, etc. (Part II)"

both, here:

http://sound.westhost.com/articles.htm

Some questions ...

Your P1s on HF and P25s on LF, sound better than the inverse?
Or only different? Can you take a stab at describing the difference?

Have you had any problems with 'balance' by using a
combination of different amps?

I hestitate to ask this question because I know
an answer might be tricky, or necessarily a little vague, but here goes:
Would you attempt a description of the sonic difference
between biamping and not, from your experience with your various gear?

Thanks again.

Michael
 

unrealdave

Active Member
Your P1s on HF and P25s on LF, sound better than the inverse?
Or only different? Can you take a stab at describing the difference?

Slight difference that way round, but I have 51 year old ears. I like the P35 on the HF with the P1's on the LF - I'm gonna get another P35 when one comes up cheap and try 2 on HF.


Have you had any problems with 'balance' by using a
combination of different amps?

No

I hestitate to ask this question because I know
an answer might be tricky, or necessarily a little vague, but here goes:
Would you attempt a description of the sonic difference
between biamping and not, from your experience with your various gear?


Greater and more distinct sound from individual instruments/voices, sounds are more involved, or I am more involved with them –I am further inside the music (without a spliff).

When you biamp you are effectively listening to 4 speakers instead of 2 as the LF and HF are separated. Maybe this is what improves things – but I say Biamping is the way to go and if I had the ability I would change the crossovers on my A3’s and Triamp them :D – just to see!

Anyway go to go

Dave
 

The latest video from AVForums

Podcast: CES 2021 Special - Sony, LG, Panasonic, Samsung, TCL and Hisense TV news and more...
Top Bottom