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best quality TV's for game consoles?

Discussion in 'Nintendo Forums' started by markyh, Feb 8, 2003.

  1. markyh

    markyh
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    Does anyone know what type of TV's are best for running game consoles, for picture quality etc, I cant have HDtv cuz they arnt out in the UK.
    Thanks
    Mark...
     
  2. NeoBlade

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    This should probably go to either Gaming Hardware or to the TV forums... But since you're here ^_^

    You should disclose us with a suitable budget first off... Because I could recommend a seriously top spec TV but it would be out of your reach. Good news for you though is that Progressive Scan is now a buzz word in the world of TVs so expect the major firms to support it.

    For those who don't know what progressive scan is, have a lil gander at this superb site - http://www.progressivescan.co.uk/interlaced.php

    This will tell you what is interlaced and progressive scan is with examples. Consoles that support Progressive scan are the PS2, GameCube and Xbox.

    ATM I have a 36" Toshiba Strata... One of the first UK TV that supports NTSC Progressive Scan and its a very nice one at that ^_^ If you can wait a little longer Panasonic should have updated its own TV that supports PAL and NTSC prog.scan but it suffers from moiré in NTSC...

    I would expect Sony and Philips to roll out prog.scan capable TVs as well so you should look out for TVs that support such a feature. Remember, for progressive scan to work you need Component Cables or a VGA connection (technically speaking) so don't be fooled by staff saying a TV has progressive scan when it doesn't have the appropriate connections.

    If that fails make sure that the TV supports RGB of course and don't worry if it only has one RGB socket... You can split that into three with a suitable splitter. I can't really give you any models to look at until you've given me a suitable budget to work with sorry... Hit us back and we'll see what we can do for you.
     
  3. markyh

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    Cheers for the reply,,
    i've got a limit of about £1100, is that enough for a TV that has progressive scan, not to sure what that is , i'm gonna check out that link,, i've got an xbox by the way!!.
    Cheers
    Mark.....
     
  4. NeoBlade

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    Its best to check out that link Mark since it basically gives you the low down on what progressive scan is and what it can do for you.

    I've had a very brief search on the net and this might be a little over your budget (okay, its an extra £177.96 to be exact) but this is the same make as my TV. In terms of sounds its no frills (no intergrated 5.1) but the image on this baby is superb.. I do have to warn you though that every single TV made on earth has faults... Some people can recognise them and some can't and this TV is no exception. Thus far the major faults have only been found using an NTSC Gamecube and thus far there are no bad reports from Xbox owners.

    Providing you have the right cables you have the ability to play videogames in progressive scan with this Toshiba Strata. A decision like this shouldn't be rushed though so keep on doing some research on any models you like. Also the chances are that you have a UK Xbox... Imported Xbox's can display videogames in progressive scan out of the box (with the right cables). UK and European Xbox's however cannot without the aid of a modchip.

    So really if you don't plan to modify your Xbox ever, nor do you plan on buying a prog.scan capable DVD player then you can save a bit of cash and opt for another TV. If you take prog.scan out of the equation you have a fairly wide choice of TV screens... If not then IMO the Strata is the one to get.

    Note: The Toshiba Strata can only accept NTSC progressive scan signals... That means that progressive scan will only be available with import products from Japan or the USA. PAL progressive scan was only made legal last september so TVs with both PAL and NTSC progressive scan have been slow to roll out.

    Again just do your homework or just post your questions here on the forum for us to help you out. Just remember not to rush all of this because at the end of the day you want a sound investment just like anyone of us.
     
  5. markyh

    markyh
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    The TV's with PAL and NTSC prog-scan, i take it even these wont allow prog-scan with my uk Xbox, why is this anyway, Is it worth getting it chiped, is the differance in quality that much better. America seems to have all the good fortune: HDtv's etc.

    Thanks
    Mark.............
     
  6. markyh

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    So if i dont get it chiped then i cant enable Prog-scan, so where does this leave me, forgetting about prog-scan for the mo, would a rear projection tv be better on quality than a normal 100mhz widescreen or is there very little differance..
    (on xbox)..

    Mark..........
     
  7. markyh

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    what do you rek to this one: £1149,,
    Panasonic TX32PB50


    - TAU 16:9 Widescreen Television With DTS
    - 76cm V Quintrix F Flat CRT
    - Advanced 100hz Super Digital Scan
    - Advanced Progressive Scan
    - Motion Estimation
    - Dolby Digital
    - Digital Theatre Surround
    - Acoustic Feedback Sound
    - Multiwindow PIP/ POP/ PAP/ PAT
    - Level 2.5 text
    - 0.5W Standby power consumption
     
  8. NeoBlade

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    markyh, I would be very wary of the PB50. During my year long research for a new TV (I have over £2k to burn) the PB50 was a contender for a while. Reasons were that personally I think the Panasonic has a cracking picture tube with true RGB support (If you enable RGB and alter the colour settings with no effect then thats true RGB). Bad points for me was moiré in NTSC mode and the TV itself is not, I repeat, not a true progressive scan TV. Instead it has an internal de-interlacer which ups the resolution and thats about it. To me it was buyer beware material and I went off to look for a different TV.

    Remember... To have true progressive scan you NEED at least a component connection or VGA. There are technical workarounds but if the monitor itself does not support true progressive scan then its a no-go.

    With a UK and European Xbox the feature to have progressive scan was disabled because Microsoft believes that there are not enough people in Europe with capable displays to have it there. The same applies with Nintendo's Gamecube.

    The quality difference between an interlaced and progressive scan image is immense IMO and is worth having if you can get it. That website pretty much illustrates the advantages of it clearly. Once you have your Xbox chipped you have to then effectively turn your Xbox from a PAL console to an NTSC one. Once you have done that (its simple) you can then have progressive scan if you have the right cables.

    If progressive scan isn't within your reach then it doesn't really matter. RGB is Europe's image standard and its very sweet indeed. I would personally choose a 100Hz over a plain 50Hz set because the image will be a lot sharper and flicker free. However there is a little snag with 100Hz TVs... You will not be able to play any lightgun games at all with it.

    As for Rear Projection... I would stay away from it for any serious gaming. Sure the screen is large but you will have to slap down the brightness and contrast settings to prevent "Screen Burn". This happens when there is a static image on screen (like a Sky Digital Logo) which is left there for a few hours... Turn off the TV and you will see a ghost of that logo imprinted on your screen. Permanently.

    Videogames have plenty of static images like health bars, scores etc so personally I would stick to a CRT for gaming. There are others that like rear projection TVs for gaming and I respect their views. Its just for me that to turn down the contrast and brightness to play a videogame equals less detailed and vibrant graphics. For any amount of cash I want the best I can get and to downgrade (to me) is a step backwards.

    Hope that helps mate. Keep on asking questions if you are unsure about anything.
     
  9. markyh

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    Wow! you certainly know your stuff,, so buy changing my xbox to ntsc and getting the right cables, i guess you mean the xbox High definition advanced pack which has component fittings, then i can play in prog-scan providing the telly is true prog-scan( like yours) i must admit i saw that Tv in comet and it did look nice, it was a 36 inch tosh so i guess it was yours "strata", bloody pricey in there tho £1800 ish. This one is £1300 is this ok: Toshiba 36ZP18Q 86cm Visible Screen Size
    - Widescreen
    - Face Flat
    - Microfilter
    - Invar Mask
    - 100hz Dynamic Frame Scan
    - Digital Picture Processing
    - Super Scene Control
    - Dark Tint
    - Selectable Picture
    - Picture size adjustment
    - Optical Audio Terminal
    - Co-axial Audio Terminal
    - 3 SCART sockets
    - Front AV sockets
    - External front speaker terminals
    - S-Video compatible
    - 3.5mm headphone socket
    - Dolby Digital Surround
    - Dolby Pro-Logic Surround
    - Dolby 3 stereo
    - NICAM digital stereo
    - Digital Surround Processing (DSP)
    - Sub Woofer
    - Rear Speakers
    - Front extension speakers
    - Selectable sound
    - Auto Set-up
    - 100 channels
    - Text with Fastext
    - 500 page Megatext
    - Widescreen Signalling
    - NTSC Video Playback
    - Off Timer
    - Open cabinet stand
    - Text Sub-page Control
    - Silver hand held remote control unit

    If i chip to ntsc can i still play my pal games?
    Thanks
    Mark.......

    P.s where did you see yours for a good price?
     
  10. markyh

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    So i suppose chipping is definately the best thing to do but i'm gonna need it to be able to play pal and ntsc games and be able to play on XBL and be able to play it progressive scan, so many things i need, is there a chip that can do all this!!

    Mark............
     
  11. NeoBlade

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    The ZP18P/Q is dogged with problems... I should know since it was my first choice TV lol. It performed superbly but within a few weeks of solid testing some major faults started to appear so really I would advise anyone looking at this TV to look elsewhere. Shame really because the "Picture Frame" ZP18 has a nice slim design. Also this TV is not progressive scan complient... Sure it has Component connections but the picture tube itself is not capable of handling progressive scan. If you pop over to the TV forums on this website you might see my name pop up a few times on the Strata thread. Me, Oblivion, Bilbooo, Fuzzybee and a good few others debated like hell on this TV and still continue to do so helping out others in the process.

    As for the Xbox cables you are indeed correct. The official High Definition Pack is really the only piece of kit you'll need providing you have the right TV of course.

    You don't have to get a 36" Strata of course... For £1,100 it'll be hard to recommend a very good 36" TV anyway but there are plenty of stella 32" TVs about at that price range. Have a look at the 32" Strata for example, I'm sure I posted a link previously. Pricewise... I overpiad for mine >_< Because I wanted the 36" version I basically had to pre-order the TV about 2 months before its launch. The 32" model was released first but it was a loooong wait for the 36". I believe I was amongst the first bunch of peeps in the UK to own the 36" version and generally everyone has been very positive. There are minor faults as with every TV but I'm really happy with my TV. I really couldn't ask for more... Okay thats a lie ^_^;; But then if I keep on being anal about certain minor points, I wouldn't be able to enjoy the superb picture produced.

    As for the Xbox mod chip... Theres plenty of choice available. I went for the X-Ecuter II Lite which cost me about £35 inc. shipping. This chip has about 512k of on-board memory so you can run multiple BIOS depending on the situation. For example you have a modified BIOS to run EvoX but still want to keep the original Microsoft BIOS intact. It will run un-signed code like all the other mod chips so you can add DVD Region X to the Xbox (multi-region DVD playback) and enable import gaming. You can still play PAL videogames once you have modified your Xbox.

    As for Xbox Live this can be tricky. The easiest way around this problem IMO is to disable your mod chip when playing XBL, but enable it again when you are not. Of course that could lead to further complications i.e If you are playing an import game with XBL in the first place.

    I'm personally not interested in XBL at this moment in time so my knowledge of a true workaround isn't complete. However you can check out sites like www.xbox-scene.com to find out more about it. There are other good members on this forum now that are running modified Xbox's with XBL so just run a search and I'm sure the answers will be there.

    Happy hunting ^_^
     
  12. markyh

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    Hi again,, Does the base cabinet on yout TV remove?, i've seen tha 32" one for £1099.79 which looks good, but i have a cabinet for it to sit on therefore i'd need to be able to remove the bottom section,, can this tv except 5.1 sound if i decide to get an amp etc ion the future.. it does say in the spec that it comes with rear speakers and front and woofer, is this not 5.1?..
    Thanks for all your help, much appreciated,

    Mark..
     
  13. fuzzybee

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    Neoblade

    Showing off your knowledge again i see;)

    Nice to see you posting again how are you?
    As for the Toshiba 36ZP18 it certainly has it's faults but it's a great tv but sadly only interlaced component.
    Even so Metroid prime still looks Jawdropping on it so i'm happy,
    It will certainly do me until my plasma purchase early next year with a bit of luck(and overtime):smashin:
     
  14. Jeff

    Jeff
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    I'm using a 10 year old Panasonix 25" TV, to this day its the best sounding TV I've ever bought, miles beter than my 32" Loewe Aconda. Picture quality is also very nice, perfect for close up video gaming action.
     
  15. markyh

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    Just goes to show that these new 100mhz wide screen prog scan TV's are not nesessarily the best..
    And all this new stuff is definately more bloody complicated..

    Saying that i really do need a wide screen if its not just for DVD's i hate them black lines at top and bottom of screen.:confused:
    I think i might get the extra cash and go for the same TV as Neoblade, i just need to know if it can be seperated, it looks like a RVP. Its gotta fit on my Tv cab other wise i haven't a clue what to get.. There not alot of prog scan tellys about as far as i can see.. I have noticed a online site(no names mentioned) offering really cheap TV's but boy does it get some really bad reviews for customer service etc..
     
  16. NeoBlade

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    Hi fuzzybee, LTNS mate, how's tricks? Its nice to be back to be honest because this is a top forum with plenty of good members contributing to the cause ^_^ I've been alright thanks, just really busy. Over my flu now at last so its time to finish off networking my flat - Almost all of the rooms will have an internet and entertainment connection. Should be smooth, esp. for LAN gaming ^_- Metroid Prime is indeed a stunning looking game and it looks even better in Prog.scan. I was thinking about a plasma myself until I saw a certain Sony HS10 projector. Kramer I believe over on the projector forum has creamed over its performance so hopefully there will be a powerbuy on this baby ^_^

    markyh, the base for my TV can be removed alright yeah. Not too sure on the 32" version but I believe its the same case. Right now nothing is in my cabinet since I found it a bit too inconveniant to house my equipment there other than my Sky Digi box... Even then that box heats up a fair bit and theres no real ventilation available. As of now I've got my amp, DVD player, sky, CD player, 2-channel amp, VCR etc on seperate shelves above the TV. It makes a nice focal point ^_-

    As for 5.1 sound... If you have an amp that will handle all of the audio properties while the TV will just display the image. Much better with an amp IMO especially as the quality has improved drastically within the last 6 months with lower prices.

    For 5.1 audio you need a suitable decoder (amp/receiver) and speakers - 2 front, 2 rear, 1 centre and a subwoofer. If you need any help on this just ask again since I did plenty of research on this as well during my buying time.

    As for 100Hz TVs.. They are worth the effort IMO since the pro's outweigh the cons once you get used to the higher definition. Just do your homework thats all since these TVs are hardly going to run away and sales staff are all too happy to take away your cash.

    Its good to see that you've looked around though, just stay away from the websites that have a bad rep. Wherever you buy the TV from though make sure they accept refunds or a swap if there are any problems.

    Jeff, pick up a 5.1 amp mate... Then you'll know what great audio can be like ^_^ Top TV though as the Loewe Aconda was 2nd on my list... Bar the fact that theres slight moiré in NTSC mode and prog.scan is only in VGA = No widescreen which is a mixed blessing actually...
     
  17. fuzzybee

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    Neoblade

    As always good advice, your flat sure sounds like a gamers multiplayer heaven.
    I'm in the recovery process myself, had a Hernia operation last wednesday and i'm looking forward to atleast eight weeks off work.
    I'm in bloody agony though at the moment and drugged up to the hilt with painkillers.
    Anyway happy gaming ;)
     
  18. NeoBlade

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    Sorry to hear it Fuzzybee but it sounds like you are on the road to a full recovery. Hopefully within a few weeks the pain would have eased a fair bit so you can do something to take your mind off things. As of now I'm waiting on my modchip for the Xbox... It hasn't been delivered after one month and I just found out that they sent it back to the USA >_< Can't wait to modify the poor ol' Xbox to death since it'll act as a true entertainment hub rather than just a games console.

    As for now the flat is in a right mess now that the carpets are ripped up >_< I just hope I haven't forgotten to connect something since it'll be a pain to do it all again. Anyways take it easy mate, I'd best be off to work.
     
  19. Jeff

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    You mean that if I route the consoles sound through my Denon A1SE it will sound better? ;)

    Actually I find playing games on a 72" screen and full surround sound a bit overwhelming. It is fun to do it occasionally though.

    Sorry what did you mean about no widescreen with VGA? It does it just fine, ran mine at 848x480.
     
  20. markyh

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    I think i'm gonna go for that 36" strata, its got excellent reviews and its about the only one that enables NTSC prog scan for my xbox,, its typical tho, bloody out of stock,, i can can wait:rolleyes:

    I just need to upgrade my xbox now, anyone know of any reputable chip fitting services?,, Anyway thanks for your help Neoblade, :D

    P.S i blagged the extra money from my g/f,, its going for £1620 and free delivery.. :rolleyes: "it seems like alot of money when i type it out"... It'll be worth it tho..

    CYA..........................
     
  21. NeoBlade

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    You can get widescreen with the Loewe Aconda Jeff and I almost forgot who you were... You and a few others almost made it your mission to get widescreen on the Aconda and to make the screen as perfect as possible. I just remembered now after looking at your avatar >_< My bad. I remember reading through one of your threads a while back and it almost convinced me to buy one since its design is also pretty sweet. I should have remembered really >_<

    I did say it was a mixed blessing though since on the Strata and on every other TV with prog.scan it automatically reverts to a 16:9 ratio, regardless of the original aspect ratio. Very annoying for me anyway since I like to keep everything in its original state. If theres anyone out there that knows a workaround for the Strata I'd love to hear it please ^_^

    Good man markyh, its a top TV but just remember that there are some minor faults with the set, some obvious, some less so. Just make sure that your retailer of choice will allow a refund or an exchange without hassle. As for modding services I don't know of any I'm afraid. I do my console modifications myself and I would advise you to do the same if you can be careful. The Xbox modification is the easiest of the whole lot as its only 8 soldering points and one wire. You'll have more difficulty opening the Xbox itself than do modify it. Maybe Groundy or another member could chip in with a location to have your Xbox done though.

    If for some reason you don't like the Strata (give it a chance though!) then I would recommend the Loewe Aconda. I can't remember the exact model you should get along with the right chassis but I'm sure Jeff could fill in the details for you. Just make sure you pick up the additional VGA card to enable the prog.scan display as well.
     

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