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Best camera resolution

Ogbeni

Novice Member
Hi all. I want to get a new camera for use in the Church. The auditorium houses up to 300-400 people and the camera will have to stay in one place to capture all with zooming most times. I need suggestions:
1. The resolution to go for.
2. Zooming requirements.
3. Other expert advice.

Thanks.
 

Terfyn

Well-known Member
Do you want to go HD or 4K?

If the camera is isolated then you will need one with a NFC operated from a Smartphone App. Example the Panasonic HC-V770
 

Ogbeni

Novice Member
Thanks for the reply TerTerfyn. Foremost, I was referring to camcorder not camera. It was a mistake.

Now, would you mind breaking HD and 4K down for me? I am a novice here. And please give me other expert advice. I will appreciate it.

Thanks.
 

Terfyn

Well-known Member
First you should give more detail as to how the camera is to be used. Hand held or remote mounted? If remote mounted, do you need a live feed to a monitor?

Without going into detail (which others will - no doubt - supply) HD gives good pictures and 4K better. You probably have a TV that is HD, most current flat screen TVs are. 4K gives brilliant pictures but requires the latest TVs and PCs to get best value. My guess is, that for recording services, HD will be very satisfactory.

The latest consumer cams have a Wi-Fi facility and some have Near Field Connection. This means that with an App on your Smartphone you can control Recording, Zoom, (and with an add on for Panasonic cameras - Remote Pan Tilt Cradle VW-CTR1) you can also control pan and tilt. You need to be within a reasonable proximity to use this App.

You will also need to consider Audio. Assuming you are recording sound on a separate system, you will need a video editor to sync the sound and vision together. I use Corel VideoStudio Pro X8 to do this and it works OK but can be a bit fiddly.

Next what do you intend to do with the video when completed? Is it for distribution to the housebound? Or is it for archive?
If for distribution you will need a DVD burning facility. Most current PCs will have this built in and the best route is through your video editor. I normally create a file on my PC and then burn a DVD from that file - this two stage process allows me to check the video before committing it to DVD.

Finally what is your budget?

So please give us more detail and we can give more help.
 
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Ogbeni

Novice Member
Thanks once again for your readiness to assist. I really appreciate this.

The camcorder will be stationary mostly but will have to move about sometimes to cover the back and outside of the Church but it is needed mostly to focus on what goes on on the altar. The feed from the camera will go to a monitor in the studio then to a projector and some HDMI-supported TVS.

May be you should download below (attached file) the schematics of how we want to use the camera along wcomponents.

Please note in the downloaded schematics that the TV/Monitors are without HDMI ports.

Note that you can rewire the schematics for me as an expert. Your inputs are strongly welcome.

Thanks. Please download diagram below.
 

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Terfyn

Well-known Member
I am no expert on distributed systems, others may help. What I can tell is that only a few camcorders will output a live HDMI signal WHILE recording!! Most switch off this output while in record mode, one that does not is the Panasonic HCV770 (I have the older 750) and this puts out a signal on both HDMI and A/V when in record mode.

Your schematic suggests to me that a decent CCTV system may be a better option. To install a proper studio system could prove expensive.

I was under the impression that you were recording the services to allow the parishoners, who could not attend he church, to see and join in the worship. My Father provided this service for the housebound in the form of audio tapes.
 

Ogbeni

Novice Member
Thanks for your replies. They have opened my eyes. You have helped to take me a step further!

Thanks. God bless you sir.
 

rogs

Well-known Member
Please download diagram below.

I see from your sketch that you are looking at a 40 metre HDMI run. That simply will not work. As Terfyn says, you may need some specialist network advice there.
Running HD video over 40M not an simple task -- and I think with those kinds of cable lengths you can probably rule out using 4K altogether.
Something like THIS may suffice - although I'm not sure if any of our forums members have tried anything like this over that kind of distance?.....
 

Johnmcl7

Distinguished Member
I see from your sketch that you are looking at a 40 metre HDMI run. That simply will not work. As Terfyn says, you may need some specialist network advice there.
Running HD video over 40M not an simple task -- and I think with those kinds of cable lengths you can probably rule out using 4K altogether.
Something like THIS may suffice - although I'm not sure if any of our forums members have tried anything like this over that kind of distance?.....

I've used similar products to extend VGA over around 20-30m of Cat5E, they worked well although it was important at least with the VGA sender/receivers to get decent quality units as otherwise the transmitted picture was generally unusable with a lot of ghosting and degraded colours.

I'd also agree with getting some specialist help from a local AV company or similar to come in and check the area and give a quote, while it wouldn't be particularly cheap I think it would be a waste of money to make a half-hearted cheap attempt.

John
 

12harry

Distinguished Member
I can't help but think you may have someone in the congregation that could help. This should be explored before you spend any money.
First you need to resolve a Budget . . . and what you would like from the installation . . .and if it could be done on a tight budget to see how it goes and expand as funds allow.
-You haven't said you are improving an existing system so presumably you don't really know what Q's to ask.

You need to have some idea of what is required as a viewing Output = on the screen - and whether it's to be Edited, or shown live, perhaps around the village, - or somewhere where the service can't be seen - is that what you meant by "the altar" - So parishioners at the back can see? -

The definition of the camera should match the definition of the screen ( although if you are making a historical recording, then the camera should maybe as good as you can afford... which probably means 4K and a 50% increase in Budget ).

Moving the camera is bound to be difficult during a service, so it probably needs cabling and a motorised Pan/Tilt head - this is then rather a specialist area that few amateurs will have experience of . . . hence the suggestion you try yr congregation - they may know someone in that line of Business....
Audio is a difficult aspect, although many churches have distributed / wireless microphones and someone that knows how to mix them to the loudspeakers - in which case that is likely to be far better than any camcorder can produce.... and helps to restrain the Budget and complexity.... you will need to consider the Organ / Music as well since churches are difficult spaces as the echo is quite long.

Do keep the vicar involved as the use of cameras can be very intrusive and not everyone will accept them without a fight.

Lastly, CCTV cameras are usually only good enough for crime-stopper duty ( and not good either ), but your Budget might consider using cameras to protect the Church and contents, so that could raise the Budget .
Good luck.
 

Ogbeni

Novice Member
Thanks for your comments and suggestions Johnmcl7 and 12harr.
"Altar" was referring to a TV on the altar. And the camera is just for recording and sending live feeds. No editing. Its also to make those at the far back focus on the activities on the altar.

Also, we already have a studio in place but all wired using AV cables. Its the need to go HDMI that prompted this.

Your further comments are appreciated.
 

12harry

Distinguished Member
Thanks for additional comments, although I can't understand why there's a TV on the Altar, other than the Priest can see what's being output, perhaps?
-You've not made this clear, IMHO.
As to the existing set-up ... it seems to me you have to ask "Why" you want to change... Is it poor resolution ( but presumably OK up to 2015 ) - or is it a desire to Update?

Why is the cabling "not suitable" - whoever installed it can advise - I suspect ( but don't know) that there are many place to improve the quality before you rip out wiring . . . camera positioning and lighting being especially important... would be top of my list..

So, it's folk at the back of the Church...need to be watching what's going-on... is that it....hence the No-Editing . . . .?
I think you'll find that HDMI will be lacking over any lengthy cables - it works at 5m but then you may need to interface it properly and that means an expensive box + Power supply.

Can you wait another year?
4K is soon upon us and that means there will be lots of "very good" HDMI cameras out there with SDI output ( used by Pros...DYOR ) and that should be far more suited to longer runs . . . . but a church is an especially long-run, as it also needs to be tucked away neatly, etc.

Then tell us the Budget.


Good luck.
 

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