Best budget player for SACD?

Discussion in 'Blu-ray & DVD Players & Recorders' started by Hamslay, Apr 27, 2007.

  1. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Having renewed my interest in classical music I've just placed my 1st orders for a few classical SACDs. Only thing is, I don't have an SACD player. I'd really like a dedicated CD player for my £250 like the Cambridge Audio 640C but haven't found anything with SACD.

    That leaves me looking for a DVD player, which is annoying with a hi-def upgrade on the horizon too. I know both the Denon 1930 and CA DVD89 have SACD. Are they any others worth considering? SACD quality is my major consideration, but if I have to get a new player, video quality is also relevant if the best SACD player is poor at video!

    Feel free to mention a dedicated CD player with SACD too if you think of one! :)

    Thanks!
     
  2. yetanotherbob

    yetanotherbob
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2007
    Messages:
    637
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    London
    Ratings:
    +55
    Oppo DV-981HD :thumbsup:

    Bob
     
  3. jchm

    jchm
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    156
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    South Notts.
    Ratings:
    +18
  4. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Can anyone confirm that the Oppo is able to output multi-channel SACD over HDMI?
     
  5. yetanotherbob

    yetanotherbob
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2007
    Messages:
    637
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Location:
    London
    Ratings:
    +55
    Here are the audio specs:

    High-resolution multi-channel digital audio output through HDMI supporting CD, DVD-Audio, SACD, Dolby Digital and DTS sound tracks.

    Individual analog 5.1-channel surround and down-mixed stereo outputs

    24-bit, 192kHz high resolution audio D/A converters

    Optical and coaxial digital audio outputs with DTS, Dolby Digital, Dolby Pro-Logic II and Linear PCM support

    3D Surround (Virtual Surround): Concert, Live, Dance, Techno, Classic, Soft

    Built-in equalizer, channel trim and channel delay functions

    You can find the full specs here:

    http://www.oppodigital.com/dv981hd/dv981hd_features.html

    Bob
     
  6. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Turns out that the Oppo, like the Denon 1930, is only HDMI 1.1 and hence SACD over HDMI would not be true DSD but converted to 88kHz PCM :(

    Looks like I'd need an HDMI 1.2 player to send DSD to my receiver. I don't know of ANY 1.2 players at the moment :(
     
  7. heyess

    heyess
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2006
    Messages:
    287
    Products Owned:
    1
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +11
    I believe HDMI SACD is not favoured due to Jitter issue's. Have you considered a second hand player that has ILink/firewire or Denon Link (depending on your amp)?

    Steve
     
  8. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Sounds like maybe I should just go back to the age of cable spaghetti then and go with 6 analogue cables. If I'm relying on the DACs in the DVD player then, I wonder whether the DV89 would be better then than the Oppo. :confused:
     
  9. Smurkenstein

    Smurkenstein
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2006
    Messages:
    525
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +28
    I use SACD over multianalogue from the Oppo981 :thumbsup: Also DTS music is good over analogue.

    I was so impressed with sacd I was considering upgrading to all Linn surround equipment - then I realised there isnt a huge supply of sacd music - theres much more classic available, but my point is that I couldnt justify the expenditure just for sacd with limited available titles
     
  10. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    I think my problem is just that I recently spent a good few hundred quid to get a new receiver with HDMI repeater, and in doing so reduced my total input to the receiver to two HDMI's and one optical. If I replace the DVD and use the HDMI, great. But now it seems that to get SACD I've got to spend £200 on the player, £30-£40 on 6 reasonable interconnects, and live with more cables than I ever had with the old receiver! :rolleyes:

    Now I know I'll be using the DACs on the DVD player it makes the choice of player even more important. I still sort of trust the DV89 more knowing Cambridge Audio's hi-fi pedigree, and can't believe the £189 Oppo has all the Faroudja stuff AND good quality DACs. I know the Oppo gets great reviews but I suspect 99% of users are commenting on the quality of the image and the audio over optical or HDMI, and not the analogue outputs.
     
  11. digriz666

    digriz666
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2006
    Messages:
    509
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    46
    Location:
    Bettembourg
    Ratings:
    +109
    dvd89,better sound than the oppo. Have just recently listened to Avalon by Roxy Music and it was sublime!
     
  12. Crustyloafer

    Crustyloafer
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2003
    Messages:
    9,577
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Edinburgh
    Ratings:
    +1,269
    The new Marantz DV6001 is a pretty good player for multi-channel SACD, it sounds quite a bit better than the similarly priced Denon 1930.
     
  13. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Cheers Crusty. How about compared to the DV89? After all, it is £100 more.
     
  14. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Has anyone actually got a Marantz DV6001? At £300, I'd hate for it to have the same lip-sync problems as the Denon. After all, Denon and Marantz are part of the same group now and undoubtedly share some components.
     
  15. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,152
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,276
    Why is that an issue, either your player or you reciver will convert it to pcm anyway? The number of native dsd dacs is small and even then not always better. The high end estoeric stuff is quite happy with pcm conversion that is HDMI 1.1 friendly but they are many £s thousands.

    I like the cheap Opplo 981.
     
  16. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    Nic

    I already have a DVD player which is fine at playing DVDs (I only play one or two per month, and that's normally for my 3 year-old!). I play all my music over the Squeezebox so I no longer have or need a CD player. I have a 1080p TV and will get an HD player once the format war is decided. So I have very little reason to spend £300 or even £200 on a new DVD player unless the SACD playback is a good implementation. I don't know much about how the format works, although I'd like to understand more about whether a DSD output over HDMI 1.2 is better, analogue output is better, or PCM output over HDMI 1.1 is better, but the main thing is if I'm going to spend that money on a solution for only a dozen discs, I don't want a half-baked or compromised solution. If no player under £1000 is going to give me "true" high resolution SACD then so be it, I won't buy anything. To me, a solution where the player converts the data down to a resolution not significantly beyond that of a normal CD so it could put it over an older HDMI implementation just sounded like a fudge. I could be wrong, but my initial though was "Why convert a 2.8 Mhz stream to 88 kHz? Surely that defeats the whole point of a high-resolution format?".
     
  17. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,152
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,276
    DSD output over HDMI 1.2 is not better but just different. The absolute quality is really down to the digital and analogue engineering involved here which is difficut to predict. If you are comparing 2.8 Mhz stream to 88 kHz then I think you are not looking at what effect sound quality. There is much more to this hence Esoteric / Teac have no worries converting DSD to PCM on the very good high end kit. If you are expecting high end kit for £200 just because it is digital (whether pcm or DSD) then you will be disappointed however for £200 then the Oppo is very good. If your budget is £1k for SACD you will get better again. I made the mistake in the early SACD years of buying a middle range SACD player, it was bettered by my very fine CD and DVD players at the time when they payered CD / DVDs compared with SACD. It was all about digital engineering and who does it well. Give me high end 16 cd over budget 24 bit any day. It is how you do things that matter. There is no point in having a sports car with 0 - 60 in 3 seconds if it can't go around corners :)
     
  18. Hamslay

    Hamslay
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2006
    Messages:
    351
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Ratings:
    +13
    OK, let me ask a simple question then. It seems all the players listed (DV89, 1930, DV6001 and Oppo 681) will play the SACDs via both analogue and HDMI. So, is there a significant difference between DSD converted to PCM over HDMI 1.1 and analogue, or is that impossible to answer without knowing the DACs in the DVD player and in my receiver? I'm just trying to figure whether or not to order 6 more interconnects when I order the player, or to stick with HDMI. Also, if people who have compared the two say there's little to be gained from analogue, I can go for a cheaper player. If I'm going HDMI, I'd go for the Oppo at £190. If I'm going analogue, I'd probably be tempted to go for the Marantz at £300 on the basis that reviews seem to suggest it has the best "budget" DACs.

    Thanks. :thumbsup:

    P.S. Sorry if I'm still spouting nonsense. :D
     
  19. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    17,152
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Location:
    Cumbria
    Ratings:
    +1,276
    There are several things happening here. First the DSD to pcm conversion. Then there is the HDMI transmitter interface. Next you have the HDMI receiver interface and then the signal gets sent to DACs or; conversion internal DACs and analogue outputs. Without knowing partnering equipment it is difficult to say, 6 leads all mounts up on the money front however...
     

Share This Page

Loading...