BlueWizard
Distinguished Member
This is more of a general information post, sort of an F-Y-I.
In another group the discussion of crossover frequencies came up, and that led to a discussion of exactly what is bass, which in turn lead to a discussion of what is bass, midrange, and treble. What frequency is bass, and what frequency is it not.
Since we used these terms all the time, we would assume they are pretty clearly defined. But, not so. You would have been surprised at how differently various people defined the frequency ranges.
I think in the end, there is no precise definition; they are more just concepts we use.
So, let's consider some models -
- Human Voice is generally regarded to be in the range of 80hz to 880hz. Now certainly singers can probably go higher or lower, but in general, the stated range is something of the accepted range.
So, do we consider human voice to be midrange?
- Music in general. The standard piano goes from 28hz to 3951hz. I think we can safely say that the extreme notes on each end of the piano are out of the Midrange.
Now there are certain large Pipe Organs and Synthesizers that have response outside this range, but rarely are those ultra deep and ultra high note used.
- Audible Frequency Spectrum. The audible range covers 10 octaves, and that allows us to divide up the spectrum with ease.
.....20hz
1.) 40hz
2.) 80hz
3.) 160hz
4.) 320hz
5.) 640hz
6.) 1,280hz
7.) 2,560hz
8.) 5,120hz
9.) 10,240hz
10.) 20,480hz
As a suggestion, let's assume
20hz - 80hz = ........ Low Bass
80hz - 320hz = ...... Hi Bass, also referred to as Midbass.
320hz - 1280hz = ... Midrange
1280hz - 5120hz = .. High Midrange/Low Treble
5120hz - 20840hz = . High Treble
Finally, what does it sound like? At what frequency, does a low note stop sounding low? Using the very basic Sony 5" speakers on my computer, in my subjective opinion, tone stop sounding bassy around 315hz.
The tones I have available on my computer are upto and including 200hz, 250hz, 315hz, and 400hz. While not really low, a 200hz tone does have some bassy undertones, 250hz, while sounding less like bass, still have some bassy weight and depth to it, but it is becoming more subtle. At 315hz, I can hear a very definite shift away from bass, and at 400hz, there is no way I would consider that remotely bassy.
So, using the Octaves listed above, 320hz seem a pretty good shift between bass and midrange.
Next, where does a mid-tone stop sounding like a mid-tone and start sounding like a high-tone? Again, this is subjective, and a test performed within the limits of my ancient hearing and my so-so speakers.
However, this is an altogether more difficult test. It seems clear when a bass tone no longer sounds bassy. I can, in my mind, clearly define and understand bass, but what is midrange? That's not so clear. So, again, I went on pure subjective impression alone.
Clearly there is a shift between 2000hz and 2500hz, but I'm not sure it is enough to push it over the line. At 4000hz and above, there is a definite shift, that would allow me to say we have crossed the threshold into High Frequency.
Above 5000hz at the modest volume I'm listening at, my high frequency hearing doesn't fade completely, but it starts to falter. Again, these tone are played at modest volumes. If I crank it up, I an certainly hear well above this range. And, even at this modest volume, I still heard well above this range, just compromised slightly.
But, in the 4000hz to 5000hz range, I clearly hear a change in the characteristic of the tone, that lets me confidently push it up into the next catagory; mid to high.
Just as 320hz represented the border between Bass and Mid, I would say that 3200hz stands on the border between Mid and high. Again, 4000hz has clearly crossed the line into high.
This second threshold at about 3200hz, is near the middle of the Hi-Mid/Low-Treble range, and again seems somewhat consistent with my division of the octaves.
If by chance, you would like to conduct your own test, to see if your perceptions are consistent with mine, here is a link to source of several sets of test tone. I used the 1/3 octave test tones which provide 31 tones between 20hz and 20,000hz.
http://www.avforums.com/forums/speakers/925527-audio-test-tones-several-sources.html
Now, one last point, while it is possible to hear up to 20,000hz, if the tone is loud enough and you are young enough, there actually aren't any fundamental musical notes up that high.
- The Piano ends at 3,951hz.
- Lead guitar encompasses 82hz to 1397hz, if we don't count stretching the guitar strings.
- Bass guitar encompasses 31hz to 440hz.
- All the standard orchestral instruments are somewhere within the frequency span of the piano.
So, while we can hear above 5,000hz, there is not much up there to hear. Just harmonic 'echoes' of lower frequencies. Though these harmonics are vitally important to giving an instrument its unique voice.
The first harmonic of the highest note (assumed 5,000hz) is 10,000hz, and the second harmonic of the fundamental is 20,000hz. The ultra-high notes aren't so much heard at a tone or note as perceived that the unique tone, timbre, and voice of specific instruments.
Back in the 'old days, when the science of acoustics and speaker design was in its infancy, it would not be uncommon to see top of the line Altec Lansing speakers with response from 60hz to 12,000hz, or possibly 14,000hz, that, despite the limited frequency response, sounded fantastic. Though, they were ultra efficient horn designs.
Also, keep in mind that when speaker design was in its infancy, so was amplifier design. They were limited to low powered, often noisy, tube amps at the time.
So, what does this all add up to? Well, nothing really.
But, I thought it might be worthwhile to get some idea of what we mean when we say bass, midrange, and treble, and to also point out the differences between available fundamental notes in music, and the range of human hearing.
So, this is just 'for your information'; accept it, reject it, take it or leave it, agree or disagree, or try to prove me wrong. I just though it presented an interesting perspective on the audible frequency range, and how that apply to speakers (primarily).
Steve/bluewizard
In another group the discussion of crossover frequencies came up, and that led to a discussion of exactly what is bass, which in turn lead to a discussion of what is bass, midrange, and treble. What frequency is bass, and what frequency is it not.
Since we used these terms all the time, we would assume they are pretty clearly defined. But, not so. You would have been surprised at how differently various people defined the frequency ranges.
I think in the end, there is no precise definition; they are more just concepts we use.
So, let's consider some models -
- Human Voice is generally regarded to be in the range of 80hz to 880hz. Now certainly singers can probably go higher or lower, but in general, the stated range is something of the accepted range.
So, do we consider human voice to be midrange?
- Music in general. The standard piano goes from 28hz to 3951hz. I think we can safely say that the extreme notes on each end of the piano are out of the Midrange.
Now there are certain large Pipe Organs and Synthesizers that have response outside this range, but rarely are those ultra deep and ultra high note used.
- Audible Frequency Spectrum. The audible range covers 10 octaves, and that allows us to divide up the spectrum with ease.
.....20hz
1.) 40hz
2.) 80hz
3.) 160hz
4.) 320hz
5.) 640hz
6.) 1,280hz
7.) 2,560hz
8.) 5,120hz
9.) 10,240hz
10.) 20,480hz
As a suggestion, let's assume
20hz - 80hz = ........ Low Bass
80hz - 320hz = ...... Hi Bass, also referred to as Midbass.
320hz - 1280hz = ... Midrange
1280hz - 5120hz = .. High Midrange/Low Treble
5120hz - 20840hz = . High Treble
Finally, what does it sound like? At what frequency, does a low note stop sounding low? Using the very basic Sony 5" speakers on my computer, in my subjective opinion, tone stop sounding bassy around 315hz.
The tones I have available on my computer are upto and including 200hz, 250hz, 315hz, and 400hz. While not really low, a 200hz tone does have some bassy undertones, 250hz, while sounding less like bass, still have some bassy weight and depth to it, but it is becoming more subtle. At 315hz, I can hear a very definite shift away from bass, and at 400hz, there is no way I would consider that remotely bassy.
So, using the Octaves listed above, 320hz seem a pretty good shift between bass and midrange.
Next, where does a mid-tone stop sounding like a mid-tone and start sounding like a high-tone? Again, this is subjective, and a test performed within the limits of my ancient hearing and my so-so speakers.
However, this is an altogether more difficult test. It seems clear when a bass tone no longer sounds bassy. I can, in my mind, clearly define and understand bass, but what is midrange? That's not so clear. So, again, I went on pure subjective impression alone.
Clearly there is a shift between 2000hz and 2500hz, but I'm not sure it is enough to push it over the line. At 4000hz and above, there is a definite shift, that would allow me to say we have crossed the threshold into High Frequency.
Above 5000hz at the modest volume I'm listening at, my high frequency hearing doesn't fade completely, but it starts to falter. Again, these tone are played at modest volumes. If I crank it up, I an certainly hear well above this range. And, even at this modest volume, I still heard well above this range, just compromised slightly.
But, in the 4000hz to 5000hz range, I clearly hear a change in the characteristic of the tone, that lets me confidently push it up into the next catagory; mid to high.
Just as 320hz represented the border between Bass and Mid, I would say that 3200hz stands on the border between Mid and high. Again, 4000hz has clearly crossed the line into high.
This second threshold at about 3200hz, is near the middle of the Hi-Mid/Low-Treble range, and again seems somewhat consistent with my division of the octaves.
If by chance, you would like to conduct your own test, to see if your perceptions are consistent with mine, here is a link to source of several sets of test tone. I used the 1/3 octave test tones which provide 31 tones between 20hz and 20,000hz.
http://www.avforums.com/forums/speakers/925527-audio-test-tones-several-sources.html
Now, one last point, while it is possible to hear up to 20,000hz, if the tone is loud enough and you are young enough, there actually aren't any fundamental musical notes up that high.
- The Piano ends at 3,951hz.
- Lead guitar encompasses 82hz to 1397hz, if we don't count stretching the guitar strings.
- Bass guitar encompasses 31hz to 440hz.
- All the standard orchestral instruments are somewhere within the frequency span of the piano.
So, while we can hear above 5,000hz, there is not much up there to hear. Just harmonic 'echoes' of lower frequencies. Though these harmonics are vitally important to giving an instrument its unique voice.
The first harmonic of the highest note (assumed 5,000hz) is 10,000hz, and the second harmonic of the fundamental is 20,000hz. The ultra-high notes aren't so much heard at a tone or note as perceived that the unique tone, timbre, and voice of specific instruments.
Back in the 'old days, when the science of acoustics and speaker design was in its infancy, it would not be uncommon to see top of the line Altec Lansing speakers with response from 60hz to 12,000hz, or possibly 14,000hz, that, despite the limited frequency response, sounded fantastic. Though, they were ultra efficient horn designs.
Also, keep in mind that when speaker design was in its infancy, so was amplifier design. They were limited to low powered, often noisy, tube amps at the time.
So, what does this all add up to? Well, nothing really.
But, I thought it might be worthwhile to get some idea of what we mean when we say bass, midrange, and treble, and to also point out the differences between available fundamental notes in music, and the range of human hearing.
So, this is just 'for your information'; accept it, reject it, take it or leave it, agree or disagree, or try to prove me wrong. I just though it presented an interesting perspective on the audible frequency range, and how that apply to speakers (primarily).
Steve/bluewizard
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