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Barco Screen shots

Discussion in 'Projectors, Screens & Video Processors' started by Paul D, Apr 12, 2002.

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  1. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Hi
    As promised i have posted my screen shots on yahoo photos.

    Barco Screen shots on Yahoo

    These pictures were taken using Kodak Gold 400 speed film (big mistake!). There is far to much film grain at this speed, so in future i will stick with 200 speed.

    The picture setup is as follows:-

    White painted wall (Dulux brilliant white)
    Barco Data 808s 1997 (17500 hours on meter but must have been in standby etc)
    Quadscan Elite processor (with filter removel mod)
    Pioneer 737 DVD player
    Olympus 35mm instant camera
    Put onto Max Speilmann photo CDRom etc

    My opinion on results:-

    Well i have mixed feelings, mainly due to the 400 speed film used. I was hoping that modern 400 film would have much less grain, and help with the dark environment. At least the pictures do seem to show some of the sharpness of the pictures. But again the pictures look a little over saturated and don't show the detail on offer in the darker parts of the scene.
    An example of the detail on offer in the first Jpg below.
     

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  2. Paul D

    Paul D
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    The above picture from Toy story 2 shows the reflection in Woodys eye etc.

    Here's a few more uploaded pictures that look ok
     

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  3. Paul D

    Paul D
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    And again...
     

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  4. Paul D

    Paul D
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    The above shot was for Gordon! :D
     

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  5. Paul D

    Paul D
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    And a final shot.
    Please feel free to slag any of the pictures off etc( you know who you are!)

    Ps i think i will use a tripod next time as the ladders appear to have been a little wonky!(or was that the beer!!!)
     

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  6. ReTrO

    ReTrO
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    Nice.

    :)
     
  7. Jeff

    Jeff
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    Paul,

    They look great, I wish I could take photos like that, come to think of it, I wish I had projector like that. One day...

    Jeff
     
  8. uncle eric

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    Well done Paul, very nice

    Eric
     
  9. acave

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    Paul, pics look superb, Now who is gonna lend me some cash to get my CRT installed?
     
  10. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Just in case anybody missed the link above for the other 70 odd shots!

    Press here!!!
     
  11. Phil Hinton

    Phil Hinton
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    Paul,

    Those are brilliant screen shots, very well done.

    Just makes me want to see them in person to get the details the camera couldn't pick up.

    Some of the best shots i have seen!!:D
     
  12. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Right! i'm retaking some of the screen shots, this time using 100 speed film. Since 400 had far to much grain i wanted to try the opposite!. I hope that you will be able to blow/zoom these new shots up, to see the real detail on offer etc.

    Again, here's hoping!:)
     
  13. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Update...
    The 100 speed film was a bad idea!.
    Yes it did get rid of film grain, but it drained the pictures of to much colour. I also think Max speilmanns scanner is adding kind of colour grain it's self.

    So i intend to take any future screen shots with 200 speed film.

    I hope it will be a good compromise ie less grain than 400 speed and more colour than 100 speed.

    Watch this space.

    Ps, i MUST get a tripod!
     
  14. Dick Scratcher

    Dick Scratcher
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    Paul,

    If I remember correctly from my amateur photography days 400ASA film is great for low light but has the disadvantage of visible grain, or at least more grain than you would normally see or want. 100ASA should be perfect and, if exposed correctly, should yield results that are the same as 400 but with noticeably less grain. The drained colour with 100 seems odd unless you are still using the fast shutter speed you were using for the 400ASA film which will obviously result in under exposure and inevitable washed out colours.

    There are always slight differences between film (emulsion) speeds and even from different batches of the same speed film but not so much that would warrant such comment that the pictures looked washed out. That is odd.

    If you are stepping up to 200 in the hope that it will make things better you will inevitably see less grain than 400 or, conversely, more grain than 100. No mans land really. Why don't you get a roll of slide film (do they still make it?) which has virtually imperceptible grain and have a print done from the positive onto decent quality paper. Don't forget, commercial prints are done on the lowest common denominator paper. Its basically crap.

    Sorry if this has sounded like a lecture. Hope some of it helps.
     
  15. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Hi Dick!
    I haven't posted the pics from the 100 speed film.
    My camera is just a normal 35mm model. It auto sets to different film speeds etc. I leave everything in auto mode, so maybe i will see if i can get a mate round with an SLR.
    Thanks for the photo tips, as all info is useful.;)

    Paul
     
  16. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Here's a photo taken using the 100 speed film.
    Compair it with the first "Toy Story 2" at the top of the page.

    Note the dark area at the bottom of this pick is the black cloth i rested the camera on!(thats why i need a tripod!).

    I think you will agree the image is poorer.
     

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  17. Dick Scratcher

    Dick Scratcher
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    Paul,

    Sure enough there is a definite fall off in colour saturation with the 100ASA film. Trying to be unbiased the first thing I would say is that the actual difference is slight but noticeable. It also appears that your exposure time is not as far off as I thought it might be. Its a little difficult trying to be objective if I'm looking at a scanned print, converted to a JPEG, downloaded and then displayed on my (uncalibrated) LCD monitor.

    What I have done is open two windows with each respective image in its own window and carried out a side by side comparison. If I look at the right eye on each image (the one without the reflection) and trace the boundary between the eye and the (orange?) nose I notice interference on the first photograph that I will assume is grain, but the second image does not show this inerference which may be attributable to the slower speed film. In reality this should be the case but its difficult to know exactly what it is that I am seeing.

    What is really strange is that, in theory anyway, the slower speed film should yield better results but, overall, this does not appear to be the case. Just to put the cat amongst the pigeons, is it likely that the second image is a more accurate representation of the true picture and the first image, though better to look at, is not a true representation of the quality of the projected image?

    Ooh I've done it now, I've criticised CRT. Do you think I'll be kicked off the forum, me being an LCD owner and all?
     
  18. Paul D

    Paul D
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    Dick, don't worry about slagging CRT if it's warranted! :)

    I much prefer people to point things out, if they can then explain their reasons. (ie not just to put someone/something down)

    So your posts have been very welcome.

    The true colour of the projector is somewhere between both pictures. Thats why i'm thinking 200 speed may be ideal.

    I have also just received some screen material samples from Walter Stewart of Direkt2U, which seem to help bring out more detail in darker parts of the picture. It not only improves the brightness of the image, it seems to help contrast and saturation. This is because as you know CRTs don't send "any" light when showing true black, so the slight 1.3 gain doesn't make any difference etc. But when showing whites, it gives them a boost increasing contrast.

    I'm now putting the screen upgrade (from Dulux brilliant white emulsion!) to the front of the queue.

    I will retake some new shots next week using 200 speed film. It's fairly cheap to have film put onto CDROM these days (£3.99 for 36 exposures plus the cost of a roll of film).

    Once the new screen is in, i will retake them to "try" to show the difference(if any!) a good screen makes.
     
  19. Dick Scratcher

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    Paul,

    Let me know how you get on, you treat tweaking as religion by the sound of things;)

    By the way, my comments about paper obviously do not apply, I forgot that you were having your images transferred to cd. I don't know how that process is achieved but any type of 'conversion' usually has some form of degradation attached to it. Conversely this would therefore apply to both types of film! God, you could drive yourself mad just thinking about this. Good luck.
     
  20. stevenwilliams

    stevenwilliams
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    Great Pics..


    If anyone needs any webspace for storing Home cinema pics & other HC related pics feel free to email me.. I have unlimited webspace and will gladly host them

    My email

    steven@whathomecinema.com
     
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