Barco Rankings

[Alaric]

Hi there,

I'm curious to what people think the order of preference in models of Barco Projectors are ???

Now i know the Graphics are generaly better than the Data, and that the 800 is better than the 600 and i think the 801 is better than the 800, but what does the S add on the 801s and then you get the 701, the 808 and i guess the king is the 1208/9 - also where do the cine7, 8 etc slot into this...Is the Cine7 better than the 1208 because it is newer or are the larger tubes better ???

I've never really seen a ranking and basicaly wonder whats best to aim for ???

I'm talking raw out and out performance, gimmics and ease of use are irrelivent, cost and size is too.

I guess it may be interesting to slot in some of the Sonys, Selecos and Nec's but you'd probably get more personal opinions then.

Ta,
Lee

 

[helipilot]

Have a look here it might give you some idea as to the differences between each model.

http://www.crtcinema.com/barcospecs.html

 

[klr10]

Where does my Sony D50 fit in the rankings? I'm more than happy (only have an iscan doubler) apparently Anthea Turner has one (maybe time to change) but seriously guys, apart from new tubes - I've not spent a lot, my D50 seems much smaller and loads more reliable....??? I know it's only a 7" er but it has a wicked picture..

 

[AndyFov]

There are just so many factors, it's difficult to call. It's probably easy to cobble together a table based on all things being equal - use, wear, burn, general level of tattyness etc, but in the real world there are people with theoretically inferior projectors which have every bit of performance squeezed out of them, and they're in an install which will knock the socks off a poorly setup 'better' projector.

Shouldn't a Sony G90 be at the top of the list anyway?

 

[SamirP]

Andyfov have scene at this thread on AVSforum
"What is the best CRT projector out there"

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=368896&highlight=rankings.

 

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

No a Barco CINE9 shold be top of the list.

D50 is equivalent of CINE7/708 or SelecoHD800 . The Seleco was my favourite at the time followed by Cine7 then D50.

There are many variables it has to be said. The CINE series from Barco have colour fltered lenses. These produce more accurate colours for video playback. It usually makes them dimmer than their unfiltered commercial counterparts of 708/808 and 909.

Gordon

 

[crteaman]

Bang on Gordon,
The cine nine is the ultimate,followed closely by a marquee 9500 (with red c element)
Third place goes to the G90 (needs colour filtering) closely followed by 1209.
That's the 9" units out of the way the 8" would go as follows cine 8 onyx/marquee 8501lc,followed by marquee 7500/8500,barco 808s,the data or graphics side is irrelevant,the G70 has better colours over the 808s due to colour filtering and better blacks due to liquid coupling,however the barco is sharper and can pull back some distance with colour filtered lenses.

james (crt)

 

[crteaman]

Oh and of course Andyfov is totally correct in saying a technically inferior projector properly set up will always be better than a technically superior unit poorly set up.

james (crt)

 

[Rob]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=22610&item=5754045438&rd=1

Looks like a good deal (if its genuine of course)

Rob.

 

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

James, You missed out NEC10PG...above all 8"'s and 1209 to my eyes......

The NEC xg'S are 7-8"'s but I'd stick them above unfiltered 808's. 8500/LC'S etc.....and then theres the queston of where a 812/912 fits!!!!!!!!

Gordon

 

[crteaman]

Hi there Gordon, yes correct again on the seleco 800/cine 7/D50,although an NEC 10PG is no match for a good 1209,unless you mean an NEC 135? that would change things,without to many exceptions a good 8" is no match for a good 9" and mostly colour filtering and liquid coupling are rather large advantages.The 912's are good fun,built for raw light output rather than the finesse of the cine 9,and of course with tubes that big the lenses required have certain geometric/optical compromises (it looks best at just line double too) but oh what light output eh Gordon.Stick with a cine 9,less its limo pro and wow,i mean how good does ice-cream get?
Quite right of you to jog my memory on the NEC units, I have a few reservations regarding some of their models,but darned nice units anyway,how about a highly modded 9501 thrown into the mix.....now that alters things again.

james (crt)

 

[Thunder]

(Sorry to hijack thread!) Hi James, How are you mate? My Barcos still goin well I experienced that strange horizontal banding again the other week on the blue tube As before it was solved by swapping the cables over bizarre! Im just worried that I will run out of cables to swap as I only have five in total and ave already used three

 

[JimmytheSaint]

James, I'd just like to point out that the G90 produces a sharper picture than the Marquee 9500. It has been proven (using a spectrometer and not just a simple colometer) that it needs NO filtering, the green is spot on. The Marquee, however, does need a colour filter on the red Celement. I'm sure after a Mike Parker mod, red filter mod etc etc the Marquee might outperform the G90, but I had some time to look at both side by side and the G90 provides a better picture in my unbias opinion
The Cine 9 is infact the best CRT available domestically, but try finding one second hand!!

Regards

Yas

 

[Vince M]

I think we need to quantify better?

If you take the Marquee 8501LC,the Sony G70,the NEC XG 135LC and the Cine 8 for example-some may prefer the blacks of the Marquee..or the colours of the NEC or the sharpness of the Cine 8.

Which wins out of these as an all rounder? It has to be the Marquee.

As a 9".I think its a far closer battle,but I would pick thus;-

(1) Marquee 9501LC
(1=) Cine 9
(2) G90.

..But a nats between the three..

If you put mods into the mix..it has to be the Marquee again..

If cost is a factor-"bang for buck" as the yanks say..Definately Marquee.

 

[crteaman]

Hi Yas,I knew it would be a problem if you did rate any given unit that someone owned,and as pj dreams states,at the top of the crt food chain i.e the top 9" units we have to remember that one thing is for certain they are all awesome and with high def running through them they are nothing short of spellbinding.
Only a nine inch unit can fully resolve all of this information eh yas what can I say we know how lucky we are.
Everyone has their opinions of course,it keeps life interesting, although I do feel well placed to comment when it comes to CRT' its my living and I have been doing it for a long time now.
I feel somewhat priveleged,having installed well, not every model crt out there,but most,including most of the units mentioned above,brand new out of the boxes,cine 9's,sony G series,marquee's etc,even a brand new nec 135 in new zealand.
This allows all of the units I have worked on,set up and installed to be compared on an even keel,and set up by the same eye (mine) for each and every one,the G90 has superb resolution,no question as do most nine inch units,but the G 90 does not have perfect phosphor colour,i had a conversation with joel silver recently,both of us with a wry grin of amusement regarding the lack of colour filtering on most of the (not all) G90's and also the 9500 lack of a red filter which we both agreed is almost the most imortant one.
In fact in widescreen review issue no? (the one with mystery men on the cover) they compared the G90 at one point with the dtv 1101(1209 with coluor filtering) and stated that "the G90 had slightly better resolution,but the runco had the more accurate colours,now if you were only to add colour filtering to your G90........
I could go on for some time and get into specifics and many more strengths and weaknesses/fors and againsts of each unit (if required)
but the bottom line is this,the differences between them are small,they are all great units but you have to be sure you are getting the best from them as Gordon and I know only to well,will a poorly set up 8" actually look better than a well set up 7"? i have never seen a projector yet that I could not make big improvements on, I hope Thunder will be testimony to that.
Yas I hope you are giving the G90 the diet it loves and deserves,plenty of dvhs,its great on an 8" but on a 9" well it really is eye candy eh?

james

 

[JimmytheSaint]

Hi James

Didn't mean it like that mate (I hope you'll be installing this very same G90 when the extension is finished ), but I do feel the G90 has been tarnished unfairly. The light output is considerably more on the G90 than both the 1209 and Marquee (don't know the stats on the Cine 9) and as a result the green element seems a little more yellow than the others. I doubt Sony technicians would have gone from their perfectly colour corrected G70 to their flagship G90 and messed up the colours!! On viewing both the red on the Marquee/1209 is immediately apparent, but to be honest, I can see NO difference in the greens (on screen).
This post involving William Phelps on AVS explains it better than I ever could : G90 'Yellow Push'

Regards

Yas

 

[Alaric]

Hi Guys,

I seem to have sparked quite a little thread here and i know its always great to look at the high end models...however what about some of the lower spec ones ???

I was more interested in the afordable end, definatly second hand. I'm certainly curious with the lower end Barco's as i have a BG801s (still to install !) and have used a BD800 and was origionaly blown away by that. I also see tempting offers on the boards, ebay etc and wonder if a 701 would be much better, or even a 808. I think the fairly fixed room position/mounting i have for the 801s would alow me to change to one of these without much physical problems. A 9" one i'm not so sure !

 

[Thunder]

James definately knows his CRTs inside out and did some very in depth tweaking on mine If you wanna see an 808 mate Im only in Peterborough. Its been tweaked to death, so I cant imagine another 808 looking much better than mine

 

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Just some comments to end my participation in this.

Just want to point out that you can't say the colour is spot on with any projector unless you specify what colourspace its spot on for. The gamut for PAL, NTSC and HDTV are all different. So if you want to playback material correctly for PAL you will have incorrect gamut for NTSC and HDTV....etc

Gordon

 

[crteaman]

Hi Yas,

Gordon's correct on that one re: colour gamut,incidently the c elements for the nine inch units were built to meet HDTV standards.
Remember they built the G90 for raw light output but,if you have three V12 five litre engines and two produce 300 bhp but one produces 500bhp,then they can achieve this in one way by running higher boost pressure on the turbo.
Having said that yas the G90 sure is bright,colour filtering does cut light output a bit,in fact a certain person on this forum e.mailed a couple of day's ago to tell me he had seen a G90 last week in the uk,and the guy who calibrated it had set the contrast to 72!
with the G90's output its a wonder,the screen didn't melt! to really make the G90 sing yasin,it needs a lot of work on the mag focus including a wee trick learnt on the G series some time ago,I look forward to meeting another serious AV guy,I used to use an aerial centre spkr (awesome) but fell in love with the dunny's.
Thus I had to get the centre to match the four mains,i think you will find we share a similar passion for our hobby, and btw you have an awesome pj there not tarnished at all,in fact we will polish it!

james (crt)

 

[Vince M]

.. he had seen a G90 last week in the uk,and the guy who calibrated it had set the contrast to 72!
james (crt)

Calibrated by William Phelps actually.

I have to say I prefer the 9501LC..

 

[JimmytheSaint]

Thanks James. Look forward to you sorting out the install at some stage. If your in the London area, let me know if you can pop in!

Regards

Yas