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B&W PV1 Compared to a SVS PB2+

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by Stonedragon, Sep 22, 2004.

  1. Stonedragon

    Stonedragon
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    Just when I had my mind all made up to buy a PB2+ what happens? I go into my local WHSMiths and read an article from this month What-HiFi mag of the B&W PV1.

    They were besides themselves with the praise, the main factor in their opinion was size and performance. Apparently it is about the size of large bowling ball, weighs 21Kg and goes down to 20Hz. They also say because it's spherical, it gives nearly zero distortion and is up there with the 'big boys'. At £950, this is about the same price (all in) for a PB2+ from the States. So my question to the experts in the forum - what should I do? Has anybody heard one who has been able to compare it to the PB2+? I wanted this purchase to by my last as far as subs go, but I've got this nagging feeling if I were to go down the B&W route, I will have the 'what-if' question at the back of my mind. Any thoughts would be welcome.
     
  2. Ian J

    Ian J
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    I have never heard the B&W offering but I cannot believe that anything the size of a bowling ball could match the output of any half decent subwoofer.

    I would suggest that you find a friendly forum member who will let you listen to his PB2 Plus and I can guarantee that you will go straight home and press the buy button
     
  3. Stonedragon

    Stonedragon
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    Thanks Ian J - yeah I find it hard to believe myself, so I'm inclined to take your advice and go with the tried and tested.
     
  4. Steve.EX

    Steve.EX
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    My money's with Ian also.

    Steven
     
  5. bob1

    bob1
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    What-HiFi mag :clown:
    Is it April :rolleyes:
    Read THIS if havent allready done so.
    I'm not saying that the b&w is crap just can't see it would be an option against the svs.
     
  6. funkmonkey

    funkmonkey
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    Why do people buy What-HiFi?

    It just cannot be taken seriously, even our own Home Cinema Choice sometimes has the odd injustice, the Hitachi TX100 review for starters, though this is few and far between compared to the laugh on issue you get with What HiFi.

    Personally I buy WHF every couple of months and just use it to pass the time as I sit on the toilet. Thats about the best thing I can say about it.
     
  7. Stonedragon

    Stonedragon
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    bob1 - nice link I enjoyed reading the review and it has ceartinly cemented my decision. It seems to be the unanimous view to go for the sb2+ where it has at least been tested in the 'field'. Bob1, you seem to have a low opinion of What-HiFi - any particular reason?
     
  8. tom bell

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    The B&W will be well supported and certainly looks the part. It shouldn't be difficult to find for a demo.

    What Hi fi explain the science behind it and why it is small but acts as if it was bigger. Even though that would have come from the B&W PR man, they make very few bad products and it might even be true!
     
  9. Nimby

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    So the PV1s are a load of balls then? :blush:

    I think I mentioned spherical enclosures for subs only recently.

    Maximum volume for minimum dimensions.

    Minimum enclosure wall resonance due to pressure vessel form.

    Volume = 4/3 x Pi x r^3. (Pi = 3.142 or 22/7)

    I've used plastic spheres for speakers before. Inshore fishing floats are superb. (if you like orange) :devil:
    In an incredible range of sizes. Acoustically dead. Easy to thread for drive unit fixing screws using a metal thread cutting taps. Completely airtight. Did I mention orange? Low cost in comparison with MDF or chipboard boxes.. Any internal standing waves would be at a much higher frequency than those being reproduced. So coloration should be at a minimum too. Apart from the orange. :laugh:
    Easy to cut with metal cutting saws and smooths with sharp metal planes and emery paper. Smells slightly of styrene (like GRP) when worked.
    (GRP= glass (fibre) reinforced plastic)

    Highly recommended if you can get the idea past the "Inspection Committee". :suicide:

    Couldn't agree more on "What HiFi". 21st century bog paper. :p

    Nimby
     
  10. Smurfin

    Smurfin
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    The mere fact that the B+W only goes down to 20hz rules it out of my books (for movies). The PB-2 Plus should comfortably destroy that sub in the lower frequencies, and then some. However, if looks is a biggie, then that's another matter. Still wouldn't trust a sub that looked like a bowling ball though:D
     
  11. Nimby

    Nimby
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    Could this be because you are geometrically challenged? :D

    I think the PV1 could start a trend. Do the sums and surprise yourself how small a PB2 volume could be as a sphere. Only problem is you'd need curved ports. There isn't room for straight ports because a PB2 ball would be so small!! :smashin:

    Nimby
     
  12. rags

    rags
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    I cant see the PV1 competing with the SVS PB2+. It's more of a lifestyle product. Just one look in the flesh at the SVS and you will realize the very different market it is aimed at. The PB2+ is a very good performer imho.
     
  13. bob1

    bob1
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    Strange that because they have the same opinion of us on here.
     
  14. Nimby

    Nimby
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    So you think B&W have dropped the ball? :devil:

    Nimby
     
  15. Stellavision

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    I sent an email to B&W early summer time asking them how the PV1 performs compared to an ASW750. As usual for B&W, I got a friendly prompt reply saying it is a very good sub for it's size but no match for an ASW750.
    I believe the 750 and SVS have been compared before with Rags and Smurfin and the general impression that I got was the main factor to make the PB2+ a better sub was the B&W's steep roll off below 20hz, but otherwise they gave each other a good run for their money. With this in mind, I would certainly not expect a PV1 to come close to a PB2+.
     
  16. tom bell

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    I think that the size and performance of the PV1 could mark the beginning of B&W being a serious AV company rather than a Hi Fi one. On their website it is down as part of their plasma / flat screen speaker range, it's already getting the support of the magazines and will inevitably get dealer support. Which can only be good news for fans of AV (but bad news for Kef etc.)
     
  17. Nimby

    Nimby
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    I am a little surprised you consider that B&W subwoofers are hifi rather than AV. Since they ony support low level connections they are denied use by humble hifi stereo enthusiasts. The PV1 continues that trend. As such it joins the rest of the B&W AV subwoofer collection. :confused:

    Nimby
     
  18. user34

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    Nimby,

    On the French AV forum The B&Ws 675 & 700 are considered very 'musical'. I was thinking of one myself, but settled on a Audience Absolute A10 sub. Whilst Rel insists that hi level connections are the only connections for music, as long as there's a 'pre-out' socket(s) on your gear then the B&W subs can be used for hifi.

    Which, by a big sideways jump, leads me to the new SVS baby sub, this would work also with a normal stereo system as long as you slip an outlaw audio ICBM in front of it, or a Paradigm X-20 or X-30.
     
  19. Nimby

    Nimby
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    You make excellent points. But I wonder what these magic boxes do to my precious stereo signal. The Yamaha DSPE800 has also been mentioned in this connection. :cool:

    I tried feeding my 16-46 direct from my NAD DVD player. But the sub was so quiet I could hardly hear it on maximum gain on the tank scene in Private Ryan! :blush:

    Though I did discover my Philips telly rattles like a tin can from the subwoofer output right beside it. This must usually be masked by the main speakers! :rolleyes:

    I normally use a setting of 2-3 on the sub gain using high level connections. And can knock the house down at just 4 on film! :devil:

    Nimby
     
  20. user34

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    If the sub has a low level input and a low pass filter and you are using a preamp with two sets of variable outputs then one goes to the sub and the other goes to the power amp. If one is using Naim pre/power with a HiCap then you just use one of the extra feeds off the Hicap and a suitable lead. In my set up I'm going to use a 6m 4pin din to phono I got very reasonably from Flashback Sales , I'm sure you could get something groovier from The Missing Link . Effectively there's no bass management here and you have to really on a the natural rolloff of your main speakers to match the high pass roll off on the sub.

    As for the Outlaw ICBM, you could use it strictly as an input crossover, although it's frequency choices are limited, otherwise it's going inline between pre and power, you'd have to suck and see if it's killing your music or not. Stereophile asserts that it's insertion into a system does not kill the music. An ICBM is $250 + shipping and tax, with 30 days trial. Mind you, they didn't answer my 230v enquiry, so I don't know if they have the necessary AC/AC adaptor. The unit runs off 15v AC, I believe. The Paradigm controllers, I haven't been able to source yet.

    Another possibility if you're a bit handy with DIY is this: Active Sub Bass Filter from BK Electronics.

    Maybe they'd make a boxed version ?
     
  21. Nimby

    Nimby
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    I don't use a HiCap so getting a low level signal becomes somewhat more difficult in a Naim system. Flashback offered to make me a special cable to go between the 72 & 180. But I didn't pursue it at the time. I ought to get a HiCap anyway. But even second hand they're a bit pricey for my pocket money. :blush:

    I'm already using my sub with full range Mission floorstanders so integration isn't the problem. Though it would be with an SVS "Little Bugger".

    I hope this is proving informative to our other readers. Hopefully somebody else out there is also wondering how to connect a low level sub to their stereo only systems. :)

    Nimby
     
  22. user34

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    HiCap pricey ? Yes I suppose, but in the context of your system you're not exploiting the full potential of the 72, and by a long way :nono: . But since this about subwoofers I'll leave it at that :devil: . Interesting, I wondered about a special lead when there's no HiCap :thumbsup: .
     

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