B&W HTM62 & Onkyo 606, correct crossover frequency?

Takenobu

Standard Member
Hi

I'm considering buying the B&W H&M62 center speaker, but i'm unsure as to what the correct crossover frequency should be, when i'm configuring my receiver.

I've heard it should be 10Hz above the minimum -3dB which is 55Hz so should I set it the closest I can to 55+10 = 65?

Thanks!
 

Badger0-0

Member
It depends on how good your sub is at 55hz, really and you don't say what it is :)

I subscribe to the view that 10-20hz higher than the speakers spec is probably a decent starting point, but you should try lots of different settings and see what you prefer. Bear in mind that 80hz is the usual standard, but IMO it's not always best.
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
I don't have a sub - my old B&W loudspeakers are set as "full band". I'm using the Z-5500 speakers as center and rear so i'm using a 5.0 setup. I couldn't use the Z-5500 sub. My small Z-5500 speakers are set at 150Hz...

I'll start by replacing the center with the B&W HTM62 :)

So I should start at around 10-20Hz above the minimum -3dB and then depending on how good my speakers perform in the low band change it (higher if they are good and lower if they are bad)?
 

Sniper

Novice Member
since you have no sub, compare the specs (or real world performace) of your center and fronts and decide!!
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
Thanks!

So if I had a sub i'd want a smooth transition on the lower bands, but I guess listening for it with no sub is going to be hard?

I think i'll start at 80Hz and see where I can go from there!

*Edit

I ran Audyssey and wanted my HTM62 to run as full band along with my two loudspeakers, should I keep the setting at that?
 

Badger0-0

Member
Thanks!

So if I had a sub i'd want a smooth transition on the lower bands, but I guess listening for it with no sub is going to be hard?

I think i'll start at 80Hz and see where I can go from there!

*Edit

I ran Audyssey and wanted my HTM62 to run as full band along with my two loudspeakers, should I keep the setting at that?

Seeing as you have no sub, it's going to be impossible :)
If you have no sub, it has to set speakers to full band, it has no choice, as it has nothing to crossover to.

You can run your speakers full band, no problem, but I wouldn't want to go anywhere near full volume with the amp, in all honesty.

Get yourself a sub mate, asap.

Try a gander at these;

www.bkelec.com/HiFi/Sub_Woofers.htm

The xls200 and above are good quality, VFM subs :smashin:
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
Thanks for the reply - I was thinking of replacing my current (old) B&W speakers with the DM683 / DM684 or DM604S3... but then i'd still need a sub. I wonder if I should get a sub first then wait untill I can get the front speakers?
 

Badger0-0

Member
I don't have a sub - my old B&W loudspeakers are set as "full band". I'm using the Z-5500 speakers as center and rear so i'm using a 5.0 setup. I couldn't use the Z-5500 sub. My small Z-5500 speakers are set at 150Hz...

I'll start by replacing the center with the B&W HTM62 :)

So I should start at around 10-20Hz above the minimum -3dB and then depending on how good my speakers perform in the low band change it (higher if they are good and lower if they are bad)?
It's the other way round mate.
The better the speakers are, the lower they'll go and you'll set the crossover lower.
But then any decent sub should be a lot better than most speakers.
 

Badger0-0

Member
Thanks for the reply - I was thinking of replacing my current (old) B&W speakers with the DM683 / DM684 or DM604S3... but then i'd still need a sub. I wonder if I should get a sub first then wait untill I can get the front speakers?
Your choice, which depends on how much you are missing the bass :)
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
It's the other way round mate.
The better the speakers are, the lower they'll go and you'll set the crossover lower.
But then any decent sub should be a lot better than most speakers.
Ah yeah thanks for clearing that up, I don't know what I was thinking when I wrote that :D

I must say though that even at 80Hz they seem to put out a lot of bass. But if I had a sub i'd set the crossover lower and closer to what the crossover for the sub would be? So it would take over on the really low tones?
 

Badger0-0

Member
There seems to be a bit of confusion here.

Let me clarify things a little.

A crossover in this sense, is the frequency where the sound is directed from the main speakers and sent to the sub. Seeing as you have no sub, you can't setup a crossover.
The only way you can alter the crossover is if you have told the amp you have a sub. If you have done that, all you are doing is cutting off the bottom end of your speakers, which will give you less bass.

You need to tell the amp you have no sub and run all speakers full range.
If you have done that, altering the crossover will make no difference, because as I said, you have no sub to crossover to. The amp will just ignore any adjustments. That is why they are producing decent bass.
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
Ah - only my front speakers are set as full band, so I thought that anything below the crossover I set for the center would be directed to my front speakers? Maybe that only works if it has registered a dedicated subwoofer?
 

Badger0-0

Member
Pulled from the 606 manual;

Specify Full Band for speakers that can output low-frequency
bass sounds adequately, for example, speakers
with a good sized woofer. For smaller speakers, specify
a crossover frequency. Sounds below the crossover frequency
will then be output by the subwoofer instead of
the speaker
. Refer to your speakers’ manuals to determine
the optimum crossover frequencies.


That should make things a bit clearer :smashin:
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
Ah thanks! Now I see what you mean - so that's why Audyssey set it to full band. I'm finally dry of questions, thanks for all the help!
 

Badger0-0

Member
I've just re-read the thread and noticed you are using z5500s.

Which means I'm going to change my advice a bit :)

Tell the amp you have a sub.
Set your fronts to full range and the Z5500s to small.
Set the crossover on all the Z5500s to around 100hz.

That should protect the 5500s to some extent, so you don't blow them.
Bear in mind that they won't take too much grunt anyway.
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
Ah, they were set to 150Hz by Audyssey, but I wasn't sure how low they would go (hard to find specs on them). I'll set them to 100Hz! Luckily it's only Z-5500s on the rear now, I finally got rid of the center and replaced it with the mentioned HTM62 :)

What will happend when I tell the amp that I have a sub when there isn't one connected?
 

Badger0-0

Member
You'll be making sure the low stuff doesn't get sent to the 5500s, it'll get sent to the sub out, which obviously doesn't exist. Don't worry, that's fine :smashin:
Seeing as they're so titchy, they won't be able to handle it.
The fronts will run as normal.

It's just a precaution, that's all :)
It's mainly the centre I'm thinking of, as that does most of the work in a surround setup.

They should be capable of 100hz, but if you're happy with way it sounds, you can leave it at 150.

Best bet is to get a sub.
I know I keep harping on about it :D
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
I get it now!

So even now with Audyssey having set them at 150Hz anything under won't get sent away because the sub is disabled... If I enable sub and put them at 100Hz anything under is sent into nothingess? So if I don't set the center at Full Band i'll lose anything sent to the nothingness... Thanks :)

I understand why you stress the importance of a sub - everything made sense after reading this artile: (http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/get-good-bass/bass-management-basics-2013-settings-made-simple)
 

Takenobu

Standard Member
Bump + Update:

Now i've got a complete 5.1 set (I bought the SVS PB-10), so it consists of the following:

Mains: B&W DM2 Mk2, frequency response: 50 Hz - 18kHz +/- 3dB, at centre of listening window.
Center: B&W HTM62, frequency response: 55 Hz - 22kHz - 3dB
Sub: SVS-PB10NSD, frequency response: 20 Hz - 100 Hz +/- 3dB
Rear: Z-5500

So i've tried setting my crossover frequencies for the speakers as follows:
Front: 80Hz (trying 60Hz, but I can't tell any difference...)
Center: 80Hz
Rear: 100Hz
LFE: 120Hz

Is it possible for someone to give me some advice based on that information, it's much appreciated hehe
 

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