AVForums Review: Paradigm Signature Sub 1

Member 639844

Former Advertiser
Sweet :smashin:

EDIT:

A very positive review and it just makes me want to hear the thing. So come on Russell, how do your DIY efforts compare to this amazing sounding sub, the DIY jobs are about a 3rd of the price but I guess that should be ignored.
 
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Member 639844

Former Advertiser
:D

You know what, AE have just released an 8" bass driver (and a 6" version) that I bet would be absolutely perfect for an application like this. They also have 10" bass drivers too, for pretty much the same money if you would like a stab at a sub 2 :eek:
 
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Wull

Well-known Member
You know what, AE have just released an 8" bass driver (and a 6" version) that I bet would be absolutely perfect for an application like this

Exactly what I was thinking :thumbsup:

no I wasn't :(
 

Member 639844

Former Advertiser
Well in truth, I doubt they would go low enough (although the current TD10S has an fs of 32hz), but they will be a driver out there that is good for this. In fact, I think I'll do a bit of research and see what I can turn up.
 

Turtles

Active Member
I took a gamble on the Sub 1; I’ve owned it for around 4 weeks now and bought it after coming down to the Sub 1 or Mark Seaton’s SubMersive. I genuinely couldn’t be more pleased with it. I knew that both were going to be good but the Sub 1 became the victor because I couldn’t demo the SubMersive and because of the room correction included with the Sub 1 and the level of finish.

My biggest worry was the ‘what if’ feeling that I should have bought the Sub 2, but this just takes everything you throw at it. As much as I want to hear the Sub 2 I just haven’t found a film or piece of music that doesn’t get reproduced the way that I want it to be with the sub 1. I actually went out my way and looked through the ‘Best Music Subwoofer moment’ thread and nothing seems to bother it. It bothers the windows and the staircase and anything else around the house not nailed down, but not the Sub. Well not yet :devil:
 

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Nimby

Distinguished Member
Excellent review, Russell! A real treat to read. You become a greater asset with each day that passes. :smashin:

Trusting your experienced judgement also finds me agreeing with your valuation. This sub offers far more than the sum of its parts and deserves to do well. Albeit to a limited audience due to the asking price. Certainly one to aspire to for those looking for something far more sophisticated and modestly proportioned than the usual big boxes. What you might call an upper class, teenage hooligan? Excellent manners but can be rather noisy at a private bash. :D

PS: What's this about the soap? :)
 

sammy the squid

Distinguished Member
Excellent review from Russell. Ive mentioned elsewhere, i cant get overthe dimensions of this sub. Are you reviewing the Sub 2 as well Russell and am i pushing it querying wether the new B&W effort will be getting the review treatment anytime soon?
 

HiFiRuss71

Distinguished Member
Sweet :smashin:

EDIT:

A very positive review and it just makes me want to hear the thing. So come on Russell, how do your DIY efforts compare to this amazing sounding sub, the DIY jobs are about a 3rd of the price but I guess that should be ignored.
All of my comments are compared to my personal reference, but I obviously have to consider that DIYing is largely an irrelevance to the world at large. As such, when I decide this mark or the other, I have to consider the like for like competition and mark accordingly.

What really gripped me about the Sub 1 is that parked between my left sub and the front left speaker, it was completely hidden and yet it came so close to equaling the output of not only the larger sub it was hidden behind, but the combined output of that sub and the one sitting opposite. That is a truly ****ing awesome result.

On top of that, I run REW to tune my subs and then run it again when I'm bored on the off chance I might come up with a better result on the basis that I hear something every once in a while that I 'think' could be better if I tuned more astutely. I tuned the Sub 1 in line with what Tom said when he delivered it and once he'd gone, tuned it again given my knowledge of my room and the improvements were minimal if any. I measured the in room response with REW, the original tuned response after Tom had left and then again after I'd done my best effort using Bass Perfect and the differences were minimal on a 2D graph and equally satisfactory on a 3D graph.

This thing really is plug and play and given that the current accepted best stand-alone subwoofer EQ solution is the best part of £800 and that isn't integrated with a subwoofers own internal DSP, I'd argue that the Bass Perfect's value should be considered as a larger part of the total purchase cost. Stand alone solutions second guess the subwoofer they're connected to; Bass Perfect knows exactly what subwoofer it is working with and tunes accordingly. This 'knowledge' makes it a superior solution and worthy of extra consideration within the purchase price as far as I am concerned.

As I said, I tuned it that second time and never felt compelled to fiddle again whatever I was listening to. Awesome.

Russell

PS. As I write this, I just seen a clip from Diddy's latest film (on Jonathon Ross) and noticed a pair of Meridian 8000s sitting behind him. I'm a sad case.:(
 

HiFiRuss71

Distinguished Member
Excellent review, Russell! A real treat to read. You become a greater asset with each day that passes. :smashin:

Trusting your experienced judgement also finds me agreeing with your valuation. This sub offers far more than the sum of its parts and deserves to do well. Albeit to a limited audience due to the asking price. Certainly one to aspire to for those looking for something far more sophisticated and modestly proportioned than the usual big boxes. What you might call an upper class, teenage hooligan? Excellent manners but can be rather noisy at a private bash. :D

PS: What's this about the soap? :)
I think that is an accurate assessment - a hooligan in silk gloves which is what we all want.

Correlating value with the asking price is difficult, because as I say above, it's EQ, integrated as it is with the Sub 1's DSP, has an extra advantage over and above the best stand alone solutions and they're already £800(ish). In raw performance terms, it seems fair to subtract that sum from it's purchase price to make in comparable, if not cheap.

That said, it's a given that you're obviously going to pay a fair bit extra for this sort of performance in a smaller sealed box as opposed to going the "I don't care how large it is ported route" and given that looks and/or space can be a limitation, you could easily fit two of these in the space of the forum's favourite and that 'favourite' doesn't come close with music.

I suppose value is in the eye of the beholder as ever, but I've not heard anything commercially available that comes close to this balance of performance, even before you consider size.

Russell
 

Member 639844

Former Advertiser
All of my comments are compared to my personal reference, but I obviously have to consider that DIYing is largely an irrelevance to the world at large. As such, when I decide this mark or the other, I have to consider the like for like competition and mark accordingly.

What really gripped me about the Sub 1 is that parked between my left sub and the front left speaker, it was completely hidden and yet it came so close to equaling the output of not only the larger sub it was hidden behind, but the combined output of that sub and the one sitting opposite. That is a truly ****ing awesome result.

On top of that, I run REW to tune my subs and then run it again when I'm bored on the off chance I might come up with a better result on the basis that I hear something every once in a while that I 'think' could be better if I tuned more astutely. I tuned the Sub 1 in line with what Tom said when he delivered it and once he'd gone, tuned it again given my knowledge of my room and the improvements were minimal if any. I measured the in room response with REW, the original tuned response after Tom had left and then again after I'd done my best effort using Bass Perfect and the differences were minimal on a 2D graph and equally satisfactory on a 3D graph.

This thing really is plug and play and given that the current accepted best stand-alone subwoofer EQ solution is the best part of £800 and that isn't integrated with a subwoofers own internal DSP, I'd argue that the Bass Perfect's value should be considered as a larger part of the total purchase cost. Stand alone solutions second guess the subwoofer they're connected to; Bass Perfect knows exactly what subwoofer it is working with and tunes accordingly. This 'knowledge' makes it a superior solution and worthy of extra consideration within the purchase price as far as I am concerned.

As I said, I tuned it that second time and never felt compelled to fiddle again whatever I was listening to. Awesome.

Russell

PS. As I write this, I just seen a clip from Diddy's latest film (on Jonathon Ross) and noticed a pair of Meridian 8000s sitting behind him. I'm a sad case.:(
Sounds like I should be content for the near future then, but it also sounds like this little baby has found a way to break the laws of physics on a whole new level, which is a shockingly good result. If money was no issue, it would be nigh on impossible to justify a sub the size of mine.

The burning question now is does the sub 2 simply do the same thing, but in a larger room, or does it extend this subs performance and go deeper as well as louder.
 

Turtles

Active Member
The burning question now is does the sub 2 simply do the same thing, but in a larger room, or does it extend this subs performance and go deeper as well as louder.

:rolleyes:

I am going to try not to read ANY reviews of the Sub 2.
 

rigman

Well-known Member
Excellent review Russell thank you.

I am looking at various options for my room and I wonder if you could answer the following questions?

Would 2 of these be able to integrate together well as stereo subs do you think or would one be more than enough. Would it be able to intergrate with my Velodyne HGS 18

I am also looking at the Sub 2 also as an option instead of 2 of the above but it weighs more than my 36" CRT TV used to (105kg without packing) and I would need to take it up some steps.

Room size is 20' x 12' btw
 

Turtles

Active Member
I don't know how you do it! :rolleyes: :D

Hey Turtles, you used to own a SVS PB Ultra/2 and the Velodyne DD15 if I'm not mistaken, how does this compare?


I had a PC13 Ultra and then a JL Audio F113 and I think it compares really favourably, actually a little of the good parts of both of them. It certainly has the speed of the F113 and I believe the depth of the PC13 Ultra, although my memory fades a little. Certainly prettier than the PC13.

I would be satisfied with any of the 3 but asked to choose and there is no doubt that the Sub 1 is quite a way ahead, but then the asking price is too.

PS. The PC13 may not be the best looker, but she’s a great laugh (and probably let you do things on the first date)
 

Prize78

Well-known Member
A good review indeed Russell. Is this bass nirvana?!
 

tin69

Active Member
Excellent review. As usual :smashin: Makes you sick reading shallow reviews from some glossy mags or websites thereafter.

Got interested about the Perfect Bass Kit 'knowing' the Sub 1 and thereby intergrating better than stand alone EQ devices. Reminds me when Velodyne DD subs had the advantage of EQing with the SMS-1. Sadly, the PBK works with Paradigm subs only so its a no no for the proletariat :nono:

The Sub 2 should be some monster based on my (limited) appraisal at the Bristol Show :D
 
R

recruit

Guest
This is one sub or the sub 2 that will certainly be on my radar, nice review Russell :smashin:
 

roaduck

Active Member
Well done Russell - What a wonderful review.As usual it was insightful, humorous, even-handed and not overtly technical for the people that just listen to music-not hi-fi's.

The Paradigm looks amazing - compact, brilliantly finished, no fuss quick setup, powerful, undistorted and deep - It looks like a total bargain for £3.4K.

My only possible suggestion would be to have a switch on that could convert it from a monopole to a dipole mode of operation a la the 6 KW dodecasub from Elemental Designs so the bass is localised if necessary with the figure of eight pattern dispersion.

As an example I have 48 inch high 3-way dipoles and it's quite surreal having 112 db at 32 hz @ 0 db upstairs and virtually nothing downstairs.

YouTube - Dodeca Information
 
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HiFiRuss71

Distinguished Member
This is one sub or the sub 2 that will certainly be on my radar, nice review Russell :smashin:
There's nothing confirmed as of yet, but the Sub 2 has been mooted for future review. I'm actually living in fear of that moment.:eek:

BTW, just noticed the XXLS-400 in your signature. That's one hell of a change!

Russell
 
R

recruit

Guest
There's nothing confirmed as of yet, but the Sub 2 has been mooted for future review. I'm actually living in fear of that moment.:eek:

BTW, just noticed the XXLS-400 in your signature. That's one hell of a change!

Russell

Look forward to a review if you do :thumbsup:

Yes, temporary for now but yes it just does not pressurise the room like the M&K did, tbh I do not really use it that much as I am listening to so much 2 channel HiFi and the ProAc's sound amazing, I just need to find something to partner them with properly for movies and I am looking and saving in the meantime.
 

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