Audyssey App discussion - chat about midrange compensation and post your graphs here!

Fairplay. If you’re happy the performance, that’s the main thing...
Dynamic Eq is ok, but I completely avoid Dynamic Volume.
Oh dear, I missed that. This is quite true. Dynamic Volume will utterly ruin any enjoyment and is, as Webbserver has pointed out, a late night viewing dynamic compression type thing.
Dynamic EQ is fine but *not* with a house curve, otherwise you'll be using 2x filters again. Dynamic EQ already, as the name suggests, applies a bass boost to varying degrees depending on how far away you are from ref (0db) volume. I find that with a -10db setting DynamicEQ actually applies a very nice room gain feel without muddying the sound.
The only reasons you would want to use a house curve in lieu of Dynamic EQ is if you want the bass to roll off before or (unlikely) after the Audyssey which, if memory serves is 500hz. Secondly you want to avoid the increase or rear speaker volume that DEQ also apples.
 
So don't use dq with a curve, got it. I tried a boost 2db at 20 and 50hz then 0 at 170 and 250hz which didn't sound good to me. My sub goes down to 35hz so currently I have 2 at 40hz then 1 at 80 and 250hz to work with the subs capabilites and the speakers crossover, I take it that's wrong. Should it be 2db at 20 and 60hz then 0 at 180hz then a minus number at 250hz. If so what minus number, also how does the sub boost below 35 is that the roll off. I thought the sub doesn't produce any bass after 120hz due to the lpf of lfe setting and nothing is mastered with bass over 120 or am I misunderstanding. Thanks for you time.
 
Audyssey is good enough, even with the bundled mic (that was very close to my umik1 when I had one), to determine what your sub is capable of. No matter what the curve is that you put in it’ll still be tethered to the results Audyssey recorded. It will try to get 6 dB above what is recorded but that’s pushing the sub too far. Basically if your sub is only capable of 30hz then the roll off will be in line with that.
i honestly think that You’re getting all twisted up over something settings can’t fix. If you aren’t getting good sound it’s a hardware thing. No amount of filters or house curves will fix it.
For AV, the baked in dynamic eq set to -10 dB is very enjoyable. Any more than that and you aren’t listening how the studio intended with way too much bass or no bass at all if you try to get clever with curves and filters. For music I run the fronts large with no eq at all. This is because I’ve only got 2 speakers to listen to and liked the sound they make in my room before I bought them.
Try placement or if that isn’t possible demo different speakers. choose an option and Then stop tweaking and just relax with a movie.
 
Great advice, I like a little more bass and thought I'd missed something with the sub, as you say time to relax, thanks all.
 
Being really thick here! Where and how do you download Ratbuddysey?
 
So what have the last 2 updates to the app improved if anything ?.
 
Hi, for the life of me I can't get the app to stop rolling off at 30. I can see people posting pictures of target curves that are flat so I have no idea what's wrong. Even if I use ratbuddy with 5db boost at 20 it still rolls off on the curve editor and there is no way to manipulate it straight. Frequencies above 30 I can manipulate as expected in the app or with ratbuddy. Despite several hours reading forums I think I am missing something here. I've tried a new install of version 1.5 and Denon has had a clean reset and latest updates. There is more than enough subwoofer so they don't need protection and I verify results with rew. Any help appreciated.
 
Hi, for the life of me I can't get the app to stop rolling off at 30. I can see people posting pictures of target curves that are flat so I have no idea what's wrong. Even if I use ratbuddy with 5db boost at 20 it still rolls off on the curve editor and there is no way to manipulate it straight. Frequencies above 30 I can manipulate as expected in the app or with ratbuddy. Despite several hours reading forums I think I am missing something here. I've tried a new install of version 1.5 and Denon has had a clean reset and latest updates. There is more than enough subwoofer so they don't need protection and I verify results with rew. Any help appreciated.

In the Before and After graphs for the Subwoofer what does Audyssey think your Subs extend down to?

The Curve Editor for my setup uses the frequency response curve that Audyssey has measured for the various speakers. The Sub curve is flat as it measured down to below 20hz anyway but for the other speakers their curves all roll off at higher frequencies.
 
Yes, as Jase has said, Audyssey has measured your sub as performing down to 30hz, and won't allow the system to run in a way that would damage your speakers, or introduce distortion. My old REL S5 SHO (no difference at all to the regular S5, BTW) was rolled of at 40hz. My current XTZ Edge is flat to 20. Audyssey reflects that in the curve editor.
 
TIL.

I always thought that it was due to the crossover set - i.e. there's no point in manipulating the curve below this, but it is indeed based on the measurement of the speakers.

I've just checked and my sub and mains let me adjust through the whole range, whereas even if the rest are changed to "large" the behaviour sticks for them, with the roll-off that it (rightly) won't let me try to compensate for.

Sensible feature IMO.
 
Thanks guys. I did start typing something similiar in my original post to be honest. The room a huge peak at 30 and this may be fooling Aud into thinking thats the limit of its extension. Aud is actually doing a great job above 30 for the subs. I was trying to simplify my set up by removing a minidsp from the chain (various reasons behind this). I'll put the minidsp back in place and put a shelf filter on to boost the bottom end and rerun aud and that should prove it one way or another.
 
Thanks guys. I did start typing something similiar in my original post to be honest. The room a huge peak at 30 and this may be fooling Aud into thinking thats the limit of its extension. Aud is actually doing a great job above 30 for the subs. I was trying to simplify my set up by removing a minidsp from the chain (various reasons behind this). I'll put the minidsp back in place and put a shelf filter on to boost the bottom end and rerun aud and that should prove it one way or another.
As mentioned elsewhere I am a believer that one should not double up on filters. If you have a minidsp and that’s running a room eq and that’s feeding Audyssey (or vice versa) i’d just stick with one system.
Audyssey is plenty accurate enough to look at measurements and determine what your sub is capable of (despite what the manufacturers may say) in your room and leave it at that. Any more extension and you’ll be listening to distortion. Especially is you retrospectively add a shelf filter. Just use the baked in dynamic eq if you want that room gain feel.
 
Ok well, it would seem the issue is Audyssey misinterpreting the peak caused by the room mode at 35. By either cutting it manually by 12db or putting a 5db shelf in below resolve the issue and the 'curve' now presented by default in the app as flat. Both methods require intervention with another source of implementing eq before Audyssey so this is really frustrating.
The room mode is what rew predicts for a square room so I am sure this is catching lots of people.
It's not that the subs don't have the output down below as either can measure at 110db+ at 15hz at the mlp individually never mind combined.
I even rolled out my svs ultra in 16hz tune mode to see if that helped and Audyssey rolled that off the same as the sealed subs.
It is a shame as without this issue Aud does a reasonable job. Full range it does ok too except for some oddities which do some harm. Dirac does this as well to some extent but is easier to analysis and correct before it's implemented.
I suspect a couple of months of work could really up the game for an application interface for Audyssey but it looks like this side of the business isn't a priority anymore.
 
Ok well, it would seem the issue is Audyssey misinterpreting the peak caused by the room mode at 35. By either cutting it manually by 12db or putting a 5db shelf in below resolve the issue and the 'curve' now presented by default in the app as flat. Both methods require intervention with another source of implementing eq before Audyssey so this is really frustrating.
The room mode is what rew predicts for a square room so I am sure this is catching lots of people.
It's not that the subs don't have the output down below as either can measure at 110db+ at 15hz at the mlp individually never mind combined.
I even rolled out my svs ultra in 16hz tune mode to see if that helped and Audyssey rolled that off the same as the sealed subs.
It is a shame as without this issue Aud does a reasonable job. Full range it does ok too except for some oddities which do some harm. Dirac does this as well to some extent but is easier to analysis and correct before it's implemented.
I suspect a couple of months of work could really up the game for an application interface for Audyssey but it looks like this side of the business isn't a priority anymore.
My AVR predates the Audyssey App so I have to use the on-board implementation but I too find that it needs the worst modes pre-treated to get the most from it.
 
Right my expert people, is there anything weird with these results? I ran these on my new 4700h last night.

Fronts are Q Acoustic 3050
Centre is Q Acoustic 3090
Surrounds are Q Acoustic 3010
Atmos are PSB Imagine XA's
Subwoofer is a SVS PC-2000

Screenshot_20200717-132617_MultEQ.jpg
20200717_132922.jpg
Screenshot_20200717-132723_MultEQ.jpg
Screenshot_20200717-132708_MultEQ.jpg
Screenshot_20200717-132708_MultEQ.jpg
Screenshot_20200717-132723_MultEQ.jpg
Screenshot_20200717-132734_MultEQ.jpg
20200717_133013.jpg
Screenshot_20200717-132617_MultEQ.jpg20200717_132922.jpgScreenshot_20200717-132723_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200717-132708_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200717-132708_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200717-132723_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200717-132734_MultEQ.jpg20200717_133013.jpg
 
hi, first time user of Audyssey here. Just ran all 8 points using the app and getting to grips with it.
Any hints/tips appreciated as it saves me reading this very long thread...

cheers
 
Right my expert people, is there anything weird with these results? I ran these on my new 4700h last night.

Fronts are Q Acoustic 3050
Centre is Q Acoustic 3090
Surrounds are Q Acoustic 3010
Atmos are PSB Imagine XA's
Subwoofer is a SVS PC-2000

You may have posted the L Dolby graph twice, but it matters not.
The fronts, assuming parity, seem to be getting a massive room gain boost @40hz, likely as this is where the port is tuned and the speakers are (as is normal for non-reviewers) close to a wall for domestic bliss reasons. Have you tried putting in some foam bungs that are often supplied with the speakers? Better to have Room EQ do as little as possible.
Also, I dislike the mid range compensation, if running full range. Which you need not do as above ~300hz it all appears to be normal. So, I'd use the app to limit to 300hz, use some bungs for the fronts, and maybe experiment with the sub placement to reduce the null at 60-70. to reinstate the room gain in a bit more of a controlled manner enable Dynamic EQ at -10db.
 
You may have posted the L Dolby graph twice, but it matters not.
The fronts, assuming parity, seem to be getting a massive room gain boost @40hz, likely as this is where the port is tuned and the speakers are (as is normal for non-reviewers) close to a wall for domestic bliss reasons. Have you tried putting in some foam bungs that are often supplied with the speakers? Better to have Room EQ do as little as possible.
Also, I dislike the mid range compensation, if running full range. Which you need not do as above ~300hz it all appears to be normal. So, I'd use the app to limit to 300hz, use some bungs for the fronts, and maybe experiment with the sub placement to reduce the null at 60-70. to reinstate the room gain in a bit more of a controlled manner enable Dynamic EQ at -10db.

I really appreciate your reply, sorry I didn't thank you sooner.

I took what you said on board, moved my speakers away from the wall a bit and also finally bunged the rear ports on my 3010's which are on a bracket and therefore mere cm away from the wall.

I've re-ran Audyssey and also took on board some tips about mic placement as I think I was spacing it out too far before.

Midrange compensation is now completely off everywhere, and Dynamic EQ is enabled.

How does this look now:

Screenshot_20200721-140343_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140356_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140405_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140412_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140421_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140430_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140437_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140445_MultEQ.jpgScreenshot_20200721-140525_MultEQ.jpg

I watched 'The Incredible Hulk' on 4K Blu-ray last night which has DTS: X (wife and I are working our way through all the marvel movies)

It sounded great to me, my rear surrounds seem to be doing more and I almost thought they might be too loud, but it didn't appear to be drowning out the front stage at all and dialogue was all pretty clear.

Bass seemed good and not localised to one specific area - which I guess is the point.
 
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I watched 'The Incredible Hulk' on 4K Blu-ray last night which has DTS: X (wife and I are working our way through all the marvel movies)

It sounded great to me, my rear surrounds seem to be doing more and I almost thought they might be too loud, but it didn't appear to be drowning out the front stage at all and dialogue was all pretty clear.

Bass seemed good and not localised to one specific area - which I guess is the point.
I have been tweaking setting and generally getting to grips with Audyssey and also noted that my rear surrounds had 'come to life' and seemed to be doing more .. Good to note that your experiance is in parts mirroring mine
 
So long as you think it's good, leave it and settle for that. Personally I'd change the max eq freq to 300hz, but otherwise, nicely done. Dynamic EQ will lift the volume of the rears so maybe that's the reason?
I think on standard 0db setting DEQ too much but at -10 its grand. DEQ increases the bass response (across all channels) and the volume of the rear speakers, dynamically, depending on how much less the volume is to reference level (0db). so at -20db there will be a significant effect. However, by changing the setting just under DEQ to -10, the system effectively thinks that ref level is -10 and so DEQ has a more subtle effect.
Just in case you didn't know.
 
So long as you think it's good, leave it and settle for that. Personally I'd change the max eq freq to 300hz, but otherwise, nicely done. Dynamic EQ will lift the volume of the rears so maybe that's the reason?
I think on standard 0db setting DEQ too much but at -10 its grand. DEQ increases the bass response (across all channels) and the volume of the rear speakers, dynamically, depending on how much less the volume is to reference level (0db). so at -20db there will be a significant effect. However, by changing the setting just under DEQ to -10, the system effectively thinks that ref level is -10 and so DEQ has a more subtle effect.
Just in case you didn't know.

Thanks, this is all a bit new to me and no doubt has been covered multiple times in this thread.

You mean the multi EQ Filter Frequent range setting in the app?

It defaults to 20,000Hz

You suggest I change that up to 300hz max?
 
Thanks, this is all a bit new to me and no doubt has been covered multiple times in this thread.

You mean the multi EQ Filter Frequent range setting in the app?

It defaults to 20,000Hz

You suggest I change that up to 300hz max?
Thanks, this is all a bit new to me and no doubt has been covered multiple times in this thread.

You mean the multi EQ Filter Frequent range setting in the app?

It defaults to 20,000Hz

You suggest I change that up to 300hz max?

Indeed. Audyssey (nor Dirac come to think on it) does not do well at mid and treble correction and is far better limited to 300hz or below. It will sound different but 'phasey' and indistinct as opposed to better.
 
Question; If you limit the frequency range to Schroeder value via the app and engage Dynamic EQ will only the bass be boosted then as you are cutting Audyssey EQ at say 230Hz or will it still boost the surrounds?
I ask as I never use Dynamic EQ due to the way it bloats the surrounds but do like what it does to the bass.
 

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