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Arcam AVR390 / AVR550 / AVR850 including Dirac Live®

mouldy15

Active Member
Hi everyone, I've been playing with Dirac live for a while now and currently useing the 2.1.2 version
How many of you adjust your target curves and not stick with the default one that Dirac provides ?
I personally have stuck for a while with the default but recently started tweaking it I read a interesting article from Andy Moore from arcam and he followed the measured curve of the speakers .... I tried it and gave me better bass response ... . I've set up my monitor audio gold 300 and centre with relatively the same curve but should I be setting the sub up with the same curve.? The rears seem very different so I've altered the pair with a different one ... What do you guys think ?
 

Rambles

Distinguished Member
@mouldy15 I think if it sounds good to you, then you are doing it right :)

Personally, I only use Dirac to address the problem areas in my room, so on the subs, and on the front left, right and centre speakers up to about 1kHz. I switch it off completely for the surrounds and atmos speakers.

if you have any big nulls, you might want to track the target curve to follow them a bit so that Dirac is not applying too much of a boost.
 
The question is if you want to use Dirac to reduce (eliminate) the impact the room has on the sound or if you want to make sure the FR comes close to what has been found out to be the best/most liked, which is represented as the default curve?
In the first case you should look for dips and highs that come from your speakers and not from the room and adjust the target curve so that it follows those.
I started myself with the target curve and later on adjusted the target curves to follow more the FR of the speakers.
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
Here are the graphs from my first go with 2.1.2. Comments welcome.
They look similar to mine, which although our rooms are bound to be different, the fact that some of our speakers have similar characteristics, makes some sense. I have M&K CS29s as rears and my sub is a Velodyne DD12, which has similar output characteristics to the JL Audio. I also run a 850.

Most importantly is how does it sound to you?
 

JEDIBLADE

Active Member
It's not blowing my socks off, I'd like a little more bass and a little more at the very top end. Watched lotr yesterday and screams of the nazgul weren't quite as piercing as they were on v1, also bass just seems to lack a little presence.
 

Ringnut

Distinguished Member
It's not blowing my socks off, I'd like a little more bass and a little more at the very top end. Watched lotr yesterday and screams of the nazgul weren't quite as piercing as they were on v1, also bass just seems to lack a little presence.
That's a very restricted range for your sub, effectively 30hz to 70hz. Have you tried various positions? Ideally you don't want Dirac trying to boost.
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
It's not blowing my socks off, I'd like a little more bass and a little more at the very top end. Watched lotr yesterday and screams of the nazgul weren't quite as piercing as they were on v1, also bass just seems to lack a little presence.
One of the things I might have suggested was to lower the slight incline at the top end of your speaker curves, although I have to say that I didn't notice any difference when I did that with mine. But if you think you've lost some top end, then I'd leave it as it is for the time being.

I don't see anything in your LCR speaker curves that would result in a really noticeable change in the upper frequencies. In fact, I think the natural frequency responses look great and Dirac probably doesn't need to do much.

As for bass, that peak at 40 Hz is probably why you think bass is lacking a bit with Dirac. You could try lifting the curve from 100 Hz up 20 Hz, but I would advise caution in case you start to overboost you sub. I certainly wouldn't be trying to boost by over 4-5 dB at any point on your sub.
 
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JEDIBLADE

Active Member
That's a very restricted range for your sub, effectively 30hz to 70hz. Have you tried various positions? Ideally you don't want Dirac trying to boost.
I can't move the sub, It's our living room and the position it's in is the only place it will go.
 

linnasak

Active Member
Trying to get ARC from LG tv, now set CEC to ON arc to auto in general, but still no sound. The display source has digital highlighted and HDMI greyed out. Am I missing something?
Ended up using optical input of STB input as workaround, but assume must be way to get display input to work.

Kevin
 

JoeSepi

Well-known Member
It's not blowing my socks off, I'd like a little more bass and a little more at the very top end. Watched lotr yesterday and screams of the nazgul weren't quite as piercing as they were on v1, also bass just seems to lack a little presence.
The standard Dirac curve can sound a bit bass-shy. Try a Harman curve, have a look here, to download some that Markus has made for Dirac 2, +4dB, +6dB, +8db and +10dB low-frequency boost.

Follow his instructions but basically, I'd try the + 6dB first, download it to your computer then right click on each and every speaker group in the right-hand column of Dirac and select "Load Target Curve" select the +6dB Harman curve. Alternatively, you can group every speaker then right click and select the curve to load to all and then ungroup after.

These Harman curves are RMS corrected so will sound quieter than your Dirac off so forget about AB testing it against Dirac off because louder tends to always sound better.

I'd listen to say the Atmos Amaze demo at say 60dB on the master volume, then load the +6dB Harman curve and listen again but 4dB higher (64dB) and the volume should be the same but you'll note the increased bass.
 
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JoeSepi

Well-known Member
I can't move the sub, It's our living room and the position it's in is the only place it will go.
Is this "only" position a corner, can it be pushed further into the corner?
 

JEDIBLADE

Active Member
Is this "only" position a corner, can it be pushed further into the corner?
It's not a corner, it's the side of the AV unit near the Right speaker.
 

DT79

Well-known Member
Trying to get ARC from LG tv, now set CEC to ON arc to auto in general, but still no sound. The display source has digital highlighted and HDMI greyed out. Am I missing something?
Ended up using optical input of STB input as workaround, but assume must be way to get display input to work.

Kevin
Good luck mate. It’s a bloody nightmare. Just keep playing around with CEC settings and power cycles until it works. It will eventually.

Just a tip - don’t do what I did when I first got my 390 and plug into the wrong HDMI input on the TV and then bang your head against a brick wall wondering why ARC won’t work :laugh:
 

Rambles

Distinguished Member
I have tried the REL method of running Dirac without the high level input connected to the sub, and then adding the high level input back in afterwards.

As predicted, there is a lot more bass up front. And non Eq'd bass at that. But, I think I quite like it. The only thing I am not sure about is when I watch movies / tv with a stereo soundtrack, I upmix with Dolby surround and have centre spread on. This means that the dialogue is spread across the LCR speakers. Some of the dialogue could just fall into the non EQ'd area of audio on the front left and right speakers, and sounds a bit deeper than before. But, as long as that all stays up front, it might be okay.

I am going to live with it for a few days, and see how it sounds with a variety of different content. I will be getting a new sub soon for the back of the room and will need to run Dirac again. So it remains to be seen whether I adopt this method with the high level input on the front sub, or not.
 

Mo Better Blues

Distinguished Member
After vigorously cleaning our carpet for several days, thanks to Ringnut :):D:laugh::rotfl: it has become very obvious that the upgrade to Dirac Live 2 and the subsequent calibration has given us a clarity in dialogue that was not present before.
I am very fond of watching Modern Family on Sky One and I am rewatching the complete box sets for the umteenth time, I am now hearing dialogue that I had completely missed in every previous viewing. :smashin:
 

matrhos

Active Member
Odd issue with my AVR550...

When put in standby now (via IP control), the unit turns off, it remotely powers down my power amp (via 12v trigger), but then the power light on the AVR stays green rather than changing to red. Also, I now notice the display has faint orange horizontal lines running across it, even in standby. (They disappear when I turn it fully off)

Any ideas why?
 

Jay130984

Well-known Member
Odd issue with my AVR550...

When put in standby now (via IP control), the unit turns off, it remotely powers down my power amp (via 12v trigger), but then the power light on the AVR stays green rather than changing to red. Also, I now notice the display has faint orange horizontal lines running across it, even in standby. (They disappear when I turn it fully off)

Any ideas why?
Maybe check if zone 2 is on if yes, turn it off
 

JEDIBLADE

Active Member
The standard Dirac curve can sound a bit bass-shy. Try a Harman curve, have a look here, to download some that Markus has made for Dirac 2, +4dB, +6dB, +8db and +10dB low-frequency boost.

Follow his instructions but basically, I'd try the + 6dB first, download it to your computer then right click on each and every speaker group in the right-hand column of Dirac and select "Load Target Curve" select the +6dB Harman curve. Alternatively, you can group every speaker then right click and select the curve to load to all and then ungroup after.

These Harman curves are RMS corrected so will sound quieter than your Dirac off so forget about AB testing it against Dirac off because louder tends to always sound better.

I'd listen to say the Atmos Amaze demo at say 60dB on the master volume, then load the +6dB Harman curve and listen again but 4dB higher (64dB) and the volume should be the same but you'll note the increased bass.
I gave the +6db curve a go and the bass was overpowering. Checked the instructions and noted that it says to adjust to frequency range to match your speakers, so I've pulled the curtains in to match what Dirac showed when I ran it initially. Not had time to check this yet but just wondered if I've done the right thing?
 

Ringnut

Distinguished Member
I gave the +6db curve a go and the bass was overpowering. Checked the instructions and noted that it says to adjust to frequency range to match your speakers, so I've pulled the curtains in to match what Dirac showed when I ran it initially. Not had time to check this yet but just wondered if I've done the right thing?
Dirac already gives a little boost to the bass as well as a slight cut to the higher frequencies and Dirac 2 seems much better at doing this than Dirac 1 ever did. With Dirac 1 I always felt the need to boost the bass a little, with Dirac 2 I haven't felt the need to do so. :)
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
I gave the +6db curve a go and the bass was overpowering. Checked the instructions and noted that it says to adjust to frequency range to match your speakers, so I've pulled the curtains in to match what Dirac showed when I ran it initially. Not had time to check this yet but just wondered if I've done the right thing?
I gave it a go too. Far too much bass for me and I felt that Dirac was trying to overdrive my speakers and sub. Changed back to my default setting using Dirac v2.
 

CarlB

Well-known Member
I gave it a go too. Far too much bass for me and I felt that Dirac was trying to overdrive my speakers and sub. Changed back to my default setting using Dirac v2.
Me too. Tried the 6db and that was way too much, then tried 4db which is better but still makes everything a bit too ‘full’. I could maybe live with 4db as some things sound quite good but music was a bit much. Back to default curve for me too.
 

JoeSepi

Well-known Member
I gave the +6db curve a go and the bass was overpowering. Checked the instructions and noted that it says to adjust to frequency range to match your speakers, so I've pulled the curtains in to match what Dirac showed when I ran it initially. Not had time to check this yet but just wondered if I've done the right thing?
Well the standard curve gives 2dB boost, so the Harman +4dB is only another 2dB and the +6dB another 4db so maybe try the +4 and see if that works for you if you still think the standard curve is bass light.
 

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