Arcam AVP700 and P1000 experiences

Discussion in 'Hi-Fi Stereo Systems & Separates' started by regent8, Sep 11, 2007.

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  1. regent8

    regent8
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    Hi,
    I'm looking for splendid separates (or possibly a receiver) for my home as regards of sound quality - music and moives. The combo from Arcam seems to be a suitable alternative since I need to actively filter the signal after the pre-out. Perhaps am I over-interpreting the reviews where it is stated that the avp700/p1000 is really good, since there are some
    reviewers that judge them as good, but not more.

    http://www.areadvd.de/lm/AV_Hardware/test_arcamav700.shtml
    http://www.ultimateavmag.com/surroundsoundpreampprocessors/1205arcam/index.html

    Perhaps time has catched up on also Arcam so other alternatives are better to reproduce presence, silence - when it shall be silence, attack, acoustic picture, easiness?

    What are your experiences as owners and users of these pieces?

    /Lars
     
  2. regent8

    regent8
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    anyone? :lease:
     
  3. webhammer

    webhammer
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    The AVP700/P1000 are the best things I know of at the price, revealing subtlety that completes instruments, voices, and other sounds, making them real. To me, that's what it's all about. I bought the AVR350 for space reasons, and it is very close to the 700/1000 for sound.
     
  4. Iliketocook

    Iliketocook
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    My first post, but a faithful reader:hiya:
    Webhammer has nailed the sound of the pre 700 and most of the reviews agree with this, those who don't :thumbsdow.
    I try to get reliabilty out of the reviews, but most only have them for short trial periods.
    I wanted a ss pre to go with my tubed amps that was reliable, good sounding, and clean looking. I gave several companies a listen, one a two week head to head at home and chose the Arcam.
    My tubed pre amps sound more open in stereo, but the Arcam is close and is more user friendly with the remote and all. It replaced an aging Yamaha 740 pre/amp combo, which the amp part didn't get used. I didn't think separates in home theater made the cost/performance sense. I was wrong. Also with the Yamy I couldn't listen to stereo at all, ear fatigue. I had to manually switch to the tube pres.
    This Arcam pre is the warm and detailed.

    The Arcam is 7 months old, we haven't had a moments trouble with it. One of the pre amps I tried would have to be rebooted if the electricity went off. Once we couldn't get the thing going again, so I packed it and sent it back.
    Just too much trouble.
    The Arcam may not have all the adjustments some do, but as I stated no problems either. Sub adjustments per driver is like having a sun roof in Louisiana, why? We use the ac 95% of the time and more sun ain't helping.
    Good shopping
    iliketocook
     
  5. PenguinHiFi

    PenguinHiFi
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    Hi Regent8,

    Here's what I think of the AVP700 and the P1000. This is not a review from "something I've been told", but just from what I heard.

    Concerning the pre/pro, the AVP700 is probably the best machine money can buy. It is loaded with features and it offers really good sound. And that sound is good for Homecinema and for stereo. The only thing it lacks is probably the HDMI 1.3 connectors. But I must admit that, after seing the performances of a DV29 or a DV139, I am not that sure that HD is so much a step forward.

    As far as the P1000 is concerned, I must admit that I was not overly convinced by what I heard. It was good... but not in the same league as the AVP700. Because it is a rather powerful amp and well thought for Home-Cinema. But to me, it lacks the refined aspect that you must have to enjoy stereo sources. It is just too "blurry" to convince me.

    So go for the AVP700, but you can try to find a better amp for a price close to the P1000.

    Regards.

    FRED
     
  6. SteinigerGE

    SteinigerGE
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    I think I posted a similar response some time back in a different thread, but I'll share my thoughts again.

    I have always been very impressed by the AVP700, but not so much by the P1000. The P1000 seems to impart a thin haze that detracts from overall resolution and also seems to shrink the soundstage width. Initially I was using it to drive my 5.1 setup with the fronts biamped, and although it was fine while watching movies, this haze and smaller soundstage was very apparent while listening to music.

    Once I upgraded to Bel Canto REF 1000s for the fronts, I was much more impressed by the AVP700 as a processor even for stereo music direct (although a USD 900 stereo preamp probably delivers about the same). This upgrade also confirmed my suspicions about the P1000 - good, but not that great.

    FWIW, I made a further upgrade to Red Dragon Leviathan monoblocks for the front left and right and center and now use the P1000 to biamp my surround left and right and single amp the LSB and RSB. I think this is probably the best use of the P1000....
     
  7. regent8

    regent8
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    Hi,
    I've bought a AVP700+P1000 on the second hand market.
    I've however not had the opportunity to use them yet :eek:


    The combo was chosen since I've speaker setup with 2 small fronts, no center, 2 woofers (passive) and 4 surroundsspeakers.

    It seems me that I need to also acquire an active crossover filter in order to distribute the signals to the speakers (small fronts + woofers).
    The filter shall then be put in between the AVP700 and the P1000.

    Any idea how I can find a filter or an alternative setup?

    BR Lars
     
  8. regent8

    regent8
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    But even though having a great combo I anyway aren't sure if it is the right piece :rolleyes:. The Blueray player I'll buy must have analogous 5.1 (or 7.1) output in order to utilize the HD Audio formats, and what will a player cost which meets the standards of the Arcam playback. The weak point will be the analogous part of the BR player.

    AVP700/P1000 is probably overkill since areas, where it is good, will not be used (old DD, old DTS etc formats).

    P1000 is of course always OK since poweramps will always needed.
     
  9. Mark.Yudkin

    Mark.Yudkin
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    I own a P1000. I found the AVP700 rather disappointing and therefore bought an AV9. I didn't have room for the P7's (it was too deep) but found the P1000 to be close enough. In any case, I disagree with PenguinHiFi and SteinerGE on both counts.

    I do not believe in active crossovers for biamping - the theory sound more like snake oil (that should get me flamed), but in practice, poor implementations (mismatch with the speakers) often lead to lower quality sound. In your case - small fronts - I see no reason to consider an active crossover.
     
  10. regent8

    regent8
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    Interesting. For what reason(s) is active filtering not a good choice? How can the setup be without active crossover? I don't have any passive crossover, so the signal to the woofers needs to be filtered in some way in order not to interfere with the fronts - how?
    The fronts needs to be cut below 80 Hz.

    How do the trick if I want to utilize stereo direct?
     
  11. Mark.Yudkin

    Mark.Yudkin
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    I wonder if you're confusing biamping and subwoofer crossover? 80Hz is the standard THX subwoofer crossover point. The AVP700 amplifier will handle this.

    Fir biamping, you need biamp-capable speakers - and these will have a suitable split crossover that will correctly handle the incoming signals and correctly pass them to the correct speaker / will correctly apply appropriate filtering to assure a correct sound. The only speakers that do not have a passive crossover are those with only a single driver (such as my stereo fronts) - but in such cases you would not be asking about woofers, crossovers or the like, as it's all irrelevant.

    An active crossover is an attempt to place the crossover between the preamp and the amp, on the "theory" that each amp will therefore only have to amplify that part of the signal that the speaker will be receiving and will therefore perform better. The speaker's crossover is then removed. As mentioned, this is snake oil - speakers and amplifiers dont' work this way.
     
  12. regent8

    regent8
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    I might need go back to start.
    I've a speaker setup where the fronts have the range > 80 Hz.
    The lowrange <80 Hz are to be handled by two separate bassboxes which are passive and have no filters.

    the surrounds are small pieces. No center. And the .1 channel not activated.

    Feeding the fronts with power from LF+RF channels in 5.1 (or 7.1) or
    L+R in stereo must be filtered in some way so the part above 80 goes to the small speakers and the signal below 80Hz has to go to the bassboxes.
    I've no external filters so my idea was to have active filters, or passive.
    Both of them have to be filters of good quality and the lowpass falling at least 18dB/octave.

    How can this be solved without an active filter?
     
  13. Mark.Yudkin

    Mark.Yudkin
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    The short answer is that solving this is going to be very difficult, especially if the two boxes were not meant to go together in the first place (similar voicing, same sensitivity), and will quote probably sound awful. I rather suspect this to be the case as if they were meant to go together, you would not need to ask about crossovers, but would have received them as part of the package.

    Essentially you have to create a single speaker out of two separate speaker units. It probably makes little difference whether you use a passive or an active crossover if you have two spare amplification channels. I also suspect that frequency splitting is not the only issue you're going to have.

    This may not be the best place to ask about DIY speaker / crossover construction.
     
  14. bobpaule

    bobpaule
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    Well said man, what is the purpose of additional active crossovers when the speakers already have internal ones built in? Strange effects can result from this redundant setup. I biamplify my front stage.

    Guess who is sitting on my rack above the Sherbourn 5/1500A? The P1000 of course, ready to power my surround stage Paradigm Ref. v.2 ADPs and Studio 20s. It is taking over duties from my Adcom GFA-7605, which while adequate did not do so well with the penny RCA-XLR adapters which voided the sonic benefits of the Canare/Neutrik cables. The Onkyo Pro PR-SC885P (monochrome Integra 9.8 with front door) started it all. And i do know that while not fully balanced on either end, my system now sons much better prolly cuz of the eliminated interference from the forest of power cable coils behind the components.

    Do you think the P1000 will handle well? Can anyone tell me if it is made in China or Britain, i see no Made in sign on the unit or box which makes me suspicious it may be a "labor of camp" as opposed to "love" :)
     
  15. regent8

    regent8
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    The speakers do only have internal filters between the tweeter and midrange.
    The small fronts are NOT filtered below 100 Hz!
    The woofers are NOT filtered at all.
     

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