Applying Audyssey XT, before or after external EQ?

Discussion in 'Subwoofers' started by AngelEyes, Jan 16, 2008.

  1. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    I have been fiddling around with REW today trying to find the best method to EQ my* PB13U.

    I decided to remove my BFD because the ground loop hum is worse with this sub for some reason. I thought I would see how Audyssey XT on my Onkyo 805 would handle things.

    Here is the plot connected direct to my HTPC, I have had to adjust the trace because the levels were different by 10db but the curve remains the same. As you can see a nasty hump or two but nothing a BFD or SMS-1 couldn't sort out.

    [​IMG]

    Audyssey on the other hand seems to have set the target level based on the top of the peaks and has boosted the rest of the signal, which seems completely wrong to me.

    [​IMG]

    From this it looks to me that the more logical route of smoothing the curve and then applying Audyssey would make more sense. I wish it wouldn't take so flipping long to run the 8 sweeps though...:rolleyes:




    * on loan only unfortunately :(
     
  2. james.miller

    james.miller
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    after external, id imagine. audyssey would have less work to do then. i dont know if that would make any difference in reality but if it did, that would be the logical way to do it:)
     
  3. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Agreed, I just wish it could doa better job on it's own, after all this is what it is supposed to do...

    Adam
     
  4. james.miller

    james.miller
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    yes, looking at that, its only made it worse. That's got me thinking - ive only jsut started to play around with REW and an spl meter, but there are some nasty humps where there really shouldnt be. im starting to wonder if audyssey is doing the same with my sub..... im going to measure and compare audyssey on/off, because something isnt quite right.
     
  5. Andori

    Andori
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    Have you tried using the on board PEQ to try and smooth the 35Hz peak first?
     
  6. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Is there asimple on/off on the Reciever for Audyssey? I found if i use 'Direct' i lose the crossovers and get no deep bass at all on my sweeps. Hence why I connected direct to the PC.
     
  7. james.miller

    james.miller
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    yeah, the equaliser settings page, you can choose either audyssey, manual or off:) cant rememebr the exact menu numbers, but i know its on the second menu menu, option 7 or something around there
     
  8. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Great, that will save some hassle! Thanks
     
  9. suniil

    suniil
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    Adam, you had a similar curve before applying Eq?

    btw, do you mind sharing what MB you use to get LPCM over HDMI [my asus m2a-vm hdmi outputs only 2 channel]?

     
  10. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    Sorry, I am not quite sure what you are asking here?

    My motherboard is the Asus P5E-VM HDMI which has the Intel G35 Chipset. I am not familiar with your MB I am afraid.

    Adam
     
  11. suniil

    suniil
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    :) ignore me - i just compared your response curves posted in PB13 thread with the one here

     
  12. mattkhan

    mattkhan
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    the processor/receiver based version is limited by the processing power it can bring to bear unfortunately. Your experience mirrors mine though, it seems to have particularly difficulty with nulls & peaks that are close together as it just doesn't have the resolution to deal with it.
     
  13. kansashick

    kansashick
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    I had the Pro Eq done on my system a few weeks ago.

    Even though we were using the more advanced version of Audyssey, the tech and I spent over an hour moving speakers and the subs to get as flat an SPL curve as we could prior to implementing Audyssey. We reduced some fairly significant nulls and peaks before implementing the software.
     
  14. AngelEyes

    AngelEyes
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    I don't doubt the Pro version, I just wish the XT had some visual interface to offset its limitations. With no graphical view of the response curve, there is no way to assess how speaker movement etc. affects things.
     
  15. james.miller

    james.miller
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    ok as an update, i compared the response of my system as a whole using audyssey processing on and off. i used a radioshack 33-2055a digital meter with the relevant calibration file to make it as accurate as possible. see attached.

    this is with all tone controls set to 0db in both cases:) <71hz, the response is generally much better (especially below 25hz). however, there is a strange drop in levels at 100hz. this is measured in the listening position, ~3m from the front speakers (and the sub)

    the results are generally good, yes? however, this is NOT being reflected in music. infact its the exact opposite:confused: sound at the bottom end is very muted, and i cant explain why. i wonder if its something to do with bass redirection from the front channels, maybe audyssey is confusing bass from the left or right channel, when something that is neutral is coming through clean? im not sure yet, pure guesswork here lol
     

    Attached Files:

  16. kansashick

    kansashick
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    Your results are very different from mine. My SPL curve is virtually ruler flat from 12Hz after the EQ. I have attached the file.

    For music listening, I have been told to use the Audyssey flat setting on my Denon. I have no idea what this does.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. Jase

    Jase
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    Gives the speakers the flattest response possible rather than the "curve" of the standard Audyssey setting.

    They suggest the Flat setting for music and for THX processing (if the model has it) and the Audyssey setting for movies/TV etc. :)
     
  18. kansashick

    kansashick
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    FWIW Manville Smith of JL Audio responded to a similar question on avsforum regarding whether to run the onboard equalization on the fathoms before or after Audyssey. His advice was to run the JL's equalization before running the Audyssey. Similarly, my Audyssey tech first moved the subs around while checking SPL levels, then ran the onboard equalization on the JLs and then ran Audyssey.
     
  19. recruit

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    I have found that running the Audyssey after the EQ with the SMS-1 has better results :thumbsup:
     
  20. Member 96948

    Member 96948
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    I run Audyssey with everything in place, because done right, Audyssey is very good at setting the right channel levels & distances that take into account processing delays etc. I then EQ the sub and speakers with the SMS-1 with Audyssey turned off, then run Audyssey again. I'm anal like that.:rolleyes:

    Finally, I may re-adjust the SMS-1 to flesh out areas that Audyssey may have cut a bit savagely, but I do listen to the results before doing so - What turns up on the SMS-1 display often doesn't bear out in the listening when Audyssey is involved.:confused:

    @ Angeleyes; I'll be over with the SMS-1 in about an hour, so we shall see.:thumbsup:

    Russell
     
  21. iainsilvester

    iainsilvester
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    Well after reading this, other related posts and an exchange with the forum's sub bass god I have bought an SMS-1. Now waiting for a short piece of Mark Grant to arrive, hopefully today, then wer'e off.

    Looks a nice piece of kit, well packaged with a slight cottage industry feel. However the feet appear not to be level such that there is a slight wobble on my glass shelf. Ironical that the only thing likely to cause rattle test issues in my HC is my expensive sub bass management toy :)
     

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