Any new Kef Di-Poles on Horizon?

Discussion in 'Home Cinema Speakers' started by Mark Ward, Mar 7, 2002.

  1. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    I'm looking at the TDM34DS's. This model has been out for ages and I'm wondering if there are any near future plans for a replacement di-pole, possibly to match the new reference range?

    Has anyone heard anything on Kef's future plans with Di-Poles?

    Mark.
     
  2. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    This was brought up a while ago. Kefs comment was "that if aint broke, dont fix it it!"

    I can only assume they have no intentions to change them, although with THX Ultra 2 around now its possible they might change them.

    Give Kef a call & see what they say.
     
  3. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
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    or walk down the road!
     
  4. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    or walk down the road!

    Yep! they're less than 2 miles from my house.

    The reason I asked here was that I'm usure whether Kef (or any company) would talk openly about a future product when the existing one still commands such a high price.

    I've bought only Kef speakers for the whole of my Hi-Fi buying life (23 years since the first pair).

    In general I find Kef a excellent company to talk to and have always liked the products. Unfortunately the new Ref series stretches beyond by current budget abilities. The TDMs will go with my Q55s until I can think bigger budgets. I have to say though... At the new pricing levels B&W also begin to arouse some curiosity, but that'd be a different thread ;).

    Mark.
     
  5. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Having spoken to those VERY nice people at Kef....I've bought the TDM34DS's today, I can't wait! :D

    Mark.
     
  6. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    Enjoy!!

    They´re great speakers!!:)
     
  7. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Thanks! I'm sure I will. Now I'll have to begin the quest for optimum surround speaker placement all over again.

    Room is 24' X 15' but due to doors & windows I have my setup across the middle of the room with the back of the viewing position sofa 2.5ft from rear wall.

    The easiest place for me would require them to be around ear height whilst seated, behind but around 2ft further out than the front main pair.

    The other opition would be also behind but fixed to the side walls around 1ft from the ceiling and 1.5ft from the rear wall. The problem with this position is that it will require drill holes & re-run the wire just to try it.

    Any suggestions/advice?

    Thanks,
     
  8. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    These Dipoles need to be either side of your listening position and about 1-2ft above your head to perform at their best.

    At the very least have them either side of your listening position so you are sitting in the null (in front of the bass driver) dont put them forward or behind you as they wont sound right.

    You can vary the height in regards to your head position but ideally they´ll be above it by the distance I mentioned.

    If you have to have them behind you make sure the null is pointing at your listening position (if possible!!).

    cheers
     
  9. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    The guy I spoke to at Kef seemed to thing they'd work fine behind me.....now I'm getting worried.
    Room limitations mean that they're either above a door (Ie 7ft high) or ear height seated (on 3ft stands)
    This should be possible.

    BTW. If I wall mount them, do they come with brackets? Can they be angled (Left & Right) easily?

    If on stands..Do they have specific stands for these? My current Atacamas are a fair bit deeper than the speaker.

    Cheers,

    Mark.
     
  10. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    Mark

    They come with wall brackets, you just mount one half and then slot the speaker into it, really easy!! But they cannot be angled as its a flat slot type bracket so they are flush to the wall.

    The important thing is sitting in the null otherwise you wont be get the spread of sound around you.

    Before I mounted them properly I had them slightly behind me but not with the null facing me and they became to localizable.

    Up high may work but you´ll need to experiment as different placement works for different rooms.

    I dont know whether Kef do specific stands for them???
     
  11. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
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    Mark

    Jase advice was pretty much spot on but the real beauty of the quality dipoles are that they are very easy to position to get them working well. The hard bit is buying them in the first place!

    The speaker come with wall brackets and are designed to sit flat on the wall. There is little need to angle these babies. This is the beauty of a di pole. Other speakers are not this flexible in positioning.

    Ordinary stands are fine which is what I use as a temporary solution (move coming up very soon). The top plate on my stands are alittle too big as well, other than aethetics, it makes no difference.

    These babies are easy to site, don't worry about it. Just enjoy.
     
  12. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Thanks for the input Jase
    This is some I'm well aware of. It hadn't actually occurred to me that I MUST be in the Null position. I've now got some ideas what/where to try first.

    I could place a wooden wedge behind the bracket to get the angle right I guess.

    I'm in my third HT room now and this room is the worst so far for choices and sound. When we moved here my (then low budget) kit sounded noticeably worse in very similar configurations/positions. Having heard these speakers I'm positive that they'll bring me a great improvement.

    Mark.
     
  13. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Hi Nic

    I read your reply after I answered Jase's

    This is precisely the opinion of the guy from I spoke to at Kef.
    This is most likely how I will end up. Main problem is that with the width of the speaker and the angle they'll need to be at, they won't look very wife friendly.

    Due in early next week...... Can't wait!

    Mark.
     
  14. Nic Rhodes

    Nic Rhodes
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    Glad you are getting them quicker than I got mine!
     
  15. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Glad you are getting them quicker than I got mine!

    One of the perks of living 2 miles away from Kef I guess! :p

    Seriously, I'm back home now and looking around the room it's going to be practically impossible to direct the null spot at the listening position.

    Going to have to try a lot if different things.

    I know the best thing is not to worry too much about it until they're here and then panic if they don't sound great.

    Mark.
     
  16. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    Experimentation is the key.

    Oh, and careful how you pick them up, its all too easy to grab them at the sides and poke your fingers thru the drivers!! (its been done but not by me!!)

    Theyre pretty big speakers too.
     
  17. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Noted Thanks!

    BTW. Do they take much running in?
    Yeah I'm surprised just how big they are. I saw them a while ago fitted in a Dem room and new that I liked them. Having got the brochure, the dimensions are a lot bigger than I expected.

    Mark.
     
  18. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    Hi Mark

    They´re pretty heavy too!!

    My dipoles were ex demo so had already seen some use. The rest of the Kef package were new and needed a couple of weeks or so running in (few hours a day). They´re smoother sounding now.

    I left the amp running 5/7ch stereo to get them all broken in.
     
  19. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Just got a call! My TDM's are in! Ordered Thursday arrived Monday :D

    Now... how to explain it to the wife :confused:

    Mark.
     
  20. Electric Mayhem

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    That was quick!!

    I´ll let you worry about the excuse to the missus´:eek:
     
  21. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Well... New speakers are here and currently on my old Atacama stands that previously held my Q15 rears.

    Rear Speakers

    Which position would be best for these? The problem with trying the high up position is the holes in the walls if it turns out not to work there.

    There is a third option in front of the curtain and in by the lamp opposite but that would interfere with the "Ironing spot" and I'm not feeling that brave right now.

    Mark.
     
  22. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    Carefull you dont put them too near the back wall, they need a bit of space to breathe as it were.

    Where you have them now (angled with the null towards your seating area) looks pretty good, they just need to be higher.

    What do you think of the sound of them where they are now?
     
  23. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    I've only had a chance for a quick listen, not enough time to for an opinion.

    I just can't use higher stands, they're just to big to stick out in the room angled on taller stands.

    First impressions was of way more bass behind me than I'm used to. Could just be getting used to them.

    I'm also going to try flat against the back wall. I know I won't be in the null spot but I'm hoping this my tone down tha bass a little.

    What would be good titles/chapters to best demonstrate Di-poles?
     
  24. Electric Mayhem

    Electric Mayhem
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    You can tune the bass with the BCD grub screw that is in one of the binding posts, have a tinker with the two different settings.

    Good film for ambient effects is Saving Private Ryan when they are in the church (also good for general surround testing!!), Fight Club has all sorts of noises going on throughout the film.

    Another good one is U571 when they are submerging down to 200 meters to avoid the depth charges, you´ve got pipes splitting, creaking etc going off all over the place.

    The Phantom Menace is another with good ambient effects as is Titan AE when they are in the Ice Field.
     
  25. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    I think I'll spend a couple of weeks running in and getting used to the new speakers before I start tweaking, but it's comforting to know that I can.
    I have all these, I'll try and have a good listen tonight & over the next day or two.

    Thanks,

    Mark.
     
  26. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Didn't need a couple of weeks to say that I'm already happy with the TDMs. When I first installed them I was getting a bit worried by the sound of them.

    Jase (Thanks Jase!) helped me solve a couple of problems I was having.... I've given them a good tryout this afternoon and I'm pretty happy at the moment!

    I've changed the angles of the speakers, they work very well to the rear with the null pointing at the sweet spot. Also... the L & R surround are now the correct way round :blush:

    I also tightened up a VERY loose negative binding post in one of the speakers.

    I've tried SPR, U571, Bug Life, Gladiator (The Cornfield at start) & a few other snippets and I'm pretty happy with everything.

    I even think the wife may forgive me for buying them soon!

    Mark.
     
  27. ilkand

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    What would be good titles/chapters to best demonstrate Di-poles?

    I like scenes where there is a lot of rain. There is one in
    Carlito's Way when he is on top of the roof. With dipoles it feels like the rain is all around.
     
  28. General Skanky

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    Mark, being curious, where did you end up mounting your speakers?
    I ask as I 'may' be dipping a toe in that direction, maybe.:)
     
  29. Mark Ward

    Mark Ward
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    Rear Speakers shows where they are and also where I was thinking of placing them.

    I'm REALLY happy with their sound now they've had a month or so to be run in and I won't be moving them for now. They're going to be moved into a different room eventually, so I don't want to get into drilling holes in walls in this room.

    I have however notice that if I stand again the back wall directly between them the sound is even better, I just can't position them to the sides of the main viewing position in this room.

    I've made lots of changes other recently, I bought 2 Kef 100 Centres (1 was for a 6.1 rear but didn't work out) WOW! :D BIG difference to front soundstage, even makes my Q55's sound better, I also bought a pair of MK-V75 Mark II subs second hand. One of them on it's own absolutely blows my old 120 Watt Yamaha so I'm ebaying the other.

    Back to the TDM's. I'd say if you can have them directly at the sides of the viewing position it's probably the optimum place you can place them. I'm sure someone else who's had TDMs a little longer than me could confirm this.

    Cheers,

    Mark.
     
  30. General Skanky

    General Skanky
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    When you say you can't place them to the sides, I take it you mean more forward of where they are now?
    Why didn't you place them on the back wall firing across the back of the seating position?
    I have never heard dipole and use direct radiating KEF 60s speakers as rears for the moment.

    If I did go the same route, I think I'd have my dipoles more or less as you have them if not against the back wall, as in Rob's pictures, the two at the back, not the sides.
     

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