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Any happy Pioneer 435 owners

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs Forum' started by kangaroojack, Oct 6, 2004.

  1. kangaroojack

    kangaroojack
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    Have not seen any posts from Pioneer new 5th generation owners, are they a dud or not? Plenty of specualation and a half hearted reveiw by What HI FI. What about a no BS owners report. Should we trading our 434's or not.
     
  2. Ekko Star

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    Good question.....the silence is becoming deafening......
     
  3. sturdy

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    Coming out... :hiya:

    Got my PDP-435HDE on friday!
    So I have just got it installed and set-up.

    The first thing I have to comment on is that I think it's almost impossible to compare this with other I have seen in shops around. The number of possibilities regarding how the picture is set-up mostly tells me that whenever you view/compare this screen in a shop, your 100% dependent of knowing how it is set up, what it's conneted to and how it's connected.

    Before I got this screen I viewed the PDP-434 vs. the Panny in a shop.
    In the shop the PDP-434 was BAD. The smearing of the picture and digital articfacts when watching for example LOTR (in moria) was TERRIBLE, and the panny looked way better (but still awaful).
    In the demo you actually saw that whenever the Gandalf moved his head, his hear was beeing smeared and fuccy!

    According to the salesperson, they were running the screen on composit out from the DVD, and the same composit was used for several screen.
    If what that demo showed was the truth, I would never have owned a plasma at all :mad:

    Now, ower to MY pio!

    I tried the LOTR scenes. I did not notice any kind of smearing of the picture or other digital artifacts.
    I think the black level is good, I'm not sure if it's perfect, but that again it very mutch depends on how I set-up the picture.

    Stuff that looked bad on my old 30" CRT screen still looks bad.

    Images is not 100% crispy when received from a broadcaster, but they never were before either. Having the screen setup with high contrast make this worse, as the artifacts is easier to show. After adjusting the screen the OK channels is looking quite good. (I'm not thinking about the image beeing bad when viewing)

    Watching DVD is great, problably better than I would expect when I'm thinking about the same resultion looks when blowed up on a 19" LCD PC monitor!

    I have testet to few other plasmas to say exactly how good or bat it is, but from my point of view the screen seems to get as mutch as it's possible to get considered the low-res input signal.
    This is getting clear when you for example take a snapshot. This causes the live picture and the snapshot to be shown side-by-side on the screen.
    The little image (that is getting better input signal compare to the size) is amazing clear when shown in this modus.

    I just cant wait to get the plasma tested with some real HDTV signals!

    I have one single point of issue: When a whole scene is beeing panned from one side to the other, it migth (in some cases) look like it's not floating 100% evenly, but is "stepping". It's not mutch but my eyes is very sensitive to that kind of motion, so I do notice it. I have only seen this in some special scenes.

    All in all I'm absolutly happy! My gut feeling is that the screen is very good and that the final image quality I'm experience is mutch more about how I adjust it than the actual physical limitation of the screen. :clap:

    But... I do absolutly beleve that to compare the almost double price compared to the panny, you will have to feed it some HDTV signals.

    The screen deserve it! :lesson:
     
  4. Jimbo73

    Jimbo73
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    Had my 434 swapped out for a 435 today.... and overall I am VERY impressed.

    Spent a little time setting the 435 up as close to the 434 as I could (using the THX optimizer in ESB) so the comparison would be a fair one and after a limited test I've noticed ...

    * better blacks! the 434's blacks were a little "light" for me - IMO this 435 is getting deep into Panny territory
    * better contrast - the snow scenes from Emipire Strikes Back look amazing
    * colours are more natural, especially skin tones
    * less MPEG noise evident on all inputs, particularly progressive component
    * havent noticed any motion blur, banding, solarisation or other plasma traits.. yet..

    What I dont like -

    * the remote looks and feels cheap (and weighs nothing)
    * it buzzes just as badly as the 434 did (I'm hoping that wall mounting it will help reduce that).
    * there's something about the panel, and I can't quite put my finger on it, which makes it "seem" smaller and cheaper - physically it's the same but it *looks* smaller ?! Could be the lack of reflection from the new glass perhaps.

    Other things we found out ..

    The 434 Media box is not compatible with the 435 panel - you lose the bottom quarter of the picture in all screen modes. We didn't try it the other way round, but I assume this means the 435 media boxes will not use the full display on a 434 panel.

    The low bitrate channels on Sky+ still look pants...

    Any questions, feel free to ask!
     
  5. sturdy

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    Ahh, forgot that.

    Following up on the buzz from the tuner.
    Hear it when swapping channels. For a tuner that is to be seated in the living room, it's a bit fan noice from it!

    Can't say that I agree on the remote... think it's easy to use and doesn't feel cheep.
    But I'm putting it away as soon as I have upgraded my Pronto with the correct settings.
     
  6. adopted scouser

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    Great to read peoples experiences. I have been thinking of buying a Plasma screen for a few month and after reading different sites and reviews I ended up deciding on the 434. Now of course the 435 is out.

    Jimbo73, you say that the low bitrate channels look pants on Sky+. I have Sky+ myself and I'm wondering which channels specifically you are talking about. I guess one of them are ITV. How is the BBC channels and, say, Channel 4 and E4?

    How is the Skysports channels looking, specifically live football?
     
  7. jwramsay

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    Jimbo,

    Is the Media receiver the same colour as the 434s?

    Reason I ask is that an engineer was out, verified that my 434 was get another buzzer and is recommending to JL a swap-out. But as there are no 434s left, JL will probably offer a 435.

    Is the Remote different to the 434 remote, which I would describe as very high quality.
     
  8. Jimbo73

    Jimbo73
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    The buzz is actually from the panel, haven't noticed anything from the media box yet.

    As for Sky+, it's hard to say. The comment was made after seeing some DIY program on BBC 1 this morning which must have been very low bitrate, however, in the evenings the BBC channels are much better. I guess something like the Hallmark channel (very bad) vs Sky Movies 1 (top notch) would be a better comparision. I dont have Sky Sports and couldn't find any footie on just now so cant really comment on that.

    One nice thing is that the orange off button on the remote also switches the panel on to the last channel you were watching (it didnt on the 434). Scart auto-sensing is much quicker...

    Looking at the panel more, I know why it seems cheaper. The black plastic surround seems very thin and is distorted at regular intervals, perhaps by strenghtening "bones" on the hidden side. As the plastic is high-gloss you can see every little uneven ripple when light reflects on it. The surround on the 434 did not have this.

    The media box is an FDE, JL are not stocking the XDE. This is a problem for me as I need the PC input. Currently trying to decide if I should refund and buy and XDE elsewhere (and lose 5 years of brilliant customer service) or go back to the 434.

    The remote weighs in at about 10% of the 434's weight with batteries, has less buttons, better layout but cheaper grey plastic... as you can tell, I dont llike it much.
     
  9. Tejstar

    Tejstar
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    How did you get it swapped, was through the retailer?
     
  10. jwramsay

    jwramsay
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    The remote is only 1/10th the weight of the 434s, surely not.

    No PC input, not even on the rear of the MR?

    What is the difference between FDE and XDE?
     
  11. sturdy

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    The FDE does not have any pc-input.
    The HDE has a pc-input (VGA) on the front. I have not tested if it's working to use DVI-to-HDMI konverter plug to send the PC signals in trought the HDMI input on the back.

    XDE has a buildt-in digital tuner, FDE and HDE does not.
    Detailed spec here:
    http://www.pioneer.co.uk/uk/product_overview.jsp?category_id=413&taxonomy_id=62-63
    (check the ones your interested in and press "Compare")
     
  12. Jimbo73

    Jimbo73
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    Remote - maybe not exactly a tenth, but it's very very light.

    No PC input, only S-Video, component, 3 x scart, composite and HDMI.

    I've got DVI out on the PC - does anyone know if I can connect that direct to the HDMI port and get 1x1 mapping at any refresh rate?
     
  13. jwramsay

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    Cripes, there are three flavours of 435 : FDE, HDE and XDE

    But only one 434 : HDE

    I thought a 435 would have a digital tuner. After what I've read I'm not sure I want JL to swap over my 434 (buzzin problem). They have been on the phone today saying that 434 was no longer available and would I loke something else. I really want the HDMI and HDTV for future proofing, and the 434 just looks so good. If only it didn't bloody well buzz!!!!
     
  14. rusty79

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  15. kangaroojack

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    Well Jimbo73, all said and done is the 435 an improvement on the 434, you say it looks cheaper, the 434 was one of the best looking panels on the market with its black piano glass surround, is this still the case? What difference in price did you have to pay to upgrade from the 434 to the 435.

    Rusty79, I had a look at the web site at the specs but i cant see what you mean about the remote?
     
  16. jwramsay

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    Got to agree that the 434 is just gorgeous to look at.
     
  17. thebigkung

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    Hi all,

    kangaroojack,
    Look at the picture thumbnails, you can see a different remote for the FDE model.

    From what I can make out the screen for the different models are exactly the same. What changes is the media box and functionality.

    FDE - No home Gallery function (no real loss)
    No PnPand No Duel Display (hence new remote - less buttons needed)
    No PC socket
    No SR + (only valid if you have other poi SR + stuff - for osd of AV setups, eg will display the volume output from the AMP on the screen)
    No Electronic Programme Guide (EPG) - but this is only available in Germany, France and Switzerland

    HDE - same as the old HDE with the above available.

    XDE - Same as HDE but with Digital tuner

    The difference between the 434 screen and 435 screen are that
    the 435 screen can reproduce 7 billion colours instead of 1 billion colours
    It uses Pios 'Direct Colour filter' in place of the 'Pure colour filter II' and has Pio's 'Advanced Super CLEAR Drive' in place of the 'Super CLEAR Drive'

    I has a 'plastic' screen instead of a glass one on the old 434

    All this Pio say should lead to a nicer Picture. Whether the 435 Screen itself looks sexier than 434 is subjective. IMHO the 434 is more than just a screen it is also a sexy piece of room eye candy with the high gloss black surround.
     
  18. jwramsay

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    I disagree about the Home Gallery, it's excellent, shows pictures in high resolution, easy to use : nice feature.

    Agree strongly about the eye candy bit, my wife spotted one of these in Currys and commented on how good it looked. When the JL deal was on the table I phoned her and told her the price and she gave me the nod. She ain't interested in HDTV, HDMI inputs etc, for her the looks and the price were the top criteria.

    Got to state this again, the only downside to the 434 is that it buzzes, and I'm on No3 now. I think I'm going to ask JL to get it fixed this time, the 435 sounds like a big unknown what with the 3 variants etc.
     
  19. rajpura

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    I'm in a similar position with a buzzing 434 from JL. Had a quick look at a 435 fde in currys today, cant comment on the pic quality as is being fed with a rf feed but the screen definitely looked a lot cheaper with a ripply plasticky surround. There was also a step between the surround and the screen which I dont recall there being on the 434 as the glass extended the full width including the surround. The remote was also really cheap feeling as mentioned earlier. Also read a few reviews in the other magazines whc etc and they werent overjoyed with the pq from non dvd sources, however there was no comparison made with the 434. So I'm a little confused as what to do, might have to live with the buzz...
     
  20. Xstyle

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    Uh-oh... The reason I bought the 435XDE (still waiting fro delivery) was based on the looks of the 434HDE !!

    I hope it still looks sexy!!! :lease:
     
  21. Jimbo73

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    After having both, I think that if PQ is your only consideration then the 435 FDE wins by a mile.

    You can get around the inadequacies of the FDE media box with other equipment if you really want to, and the remote is easily replaced. The FDE media box so far has been utterly silent (the fan on my old HDE box was pretty loud for a fan).

    The buzz from the panel IS louder, but it's consistant rather than the old 434 where the tone used to vary depending on what's onscreen - it's far easier to ignore a constant buzz at the same tone than one which varies by the millisecond.

    If you want out-of-the box connectivity, or something that screams QUALITY even when it's switched off then stick with the 434... or put your 435 XDE somewhere where the black surround wont reflect any light...

    EDIT : Just been watching some ST : The Next Generation on Sky - the 434 always used to suffer pretty severe motion smearing with this ... the 435 so far has had none.
     
  22. jwramsay

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    When are you expecting this? JL are going to swapout my 434DHE for 435XDE, hope the remote ain't plastic!!
     
  23. Jimbo73

    Jimbo73
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    You wont get an XDE mate, JL aren't going to stock them... I was promised an XDE and they delivered an FDE.
     
  24. jwramsay

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    I realised that Jimbo, so I got her to clarify that it is XDE. I asked does it have a Digital Tuner? "YES" Is it definately XDE? "YES".

    They have stock down South. Yes, XDEs. The JL price is 3795 BTW
     
  25. Jimbo73

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    That sounds almost identical to the conversation I had last week. Be interesting to see what you end up with...
     
  26. pkeery

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    I too have a 435XDE on order. I ordered on the assumption that it would be as pretty as the 434. The pictures certainly look that way. £3500 including wall bracket and speakers seemed a good deal compared to the 434 too.

    Homecinemaheaven.com have told me that delivery is scheduled for the end of October but they hope that it will be a week or 2 earlier.

    *Hopes things will work out fine*
     
  27. jwramsay

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    Did you not complain? Did the JL kit include the stand and speakers (and were they silver or black?). I forgot to ask, but if there ain't a stand they ain't gonna be able to install it!
     
  28. alancolledge

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    With all these John Lewis swaps happening, is there going to be an influx of cheap 434s about?
    Mayby I could have 1 for the Bedroom too :cool:
     
  29. jwramsay

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    I was wondering about that one myself! After all, the service menu allows you to see whether you are getting new goods. Probably Pioneer will stockpile them for spares.
     
  30. Deron

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    Actually there's already been a couple of posts about people receiving pioneer 434's with a hours on them.

    There will always be people who don't notice...
     

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