OLED SCREEN BURN ( permanent image retention)

GadgetObsessed I was reading your previous thread on page 101 about aperture ratio. As a result of your recommendation I was looking at OLED Info | The OLED Experts.

Reading, An introduction to OLED displays, I came across this statement.
"OLEDs have limited lifetime (like any display, really), that was quite a problem a few years ago. But there has been constant progress, and today this is almost a non-issue."

I don't know how they come to this conclusion, but it is another view point.
Remember that OLED Info is a web site for OLED manufacturers - therefore I would expect it to be biased towards OLED. They would be the last place that I would expect to see negative stories about OLED.
 
All this fuzz about burn in, pages of discussions, is enough for me not to go for oled. Think i can deal with the minor flaws of fald from a q90r for example. Or wait until next year maybe...75inch is quite an investment.
Many expert reviewers say they prefer the Q90R if you watch your TV in a bright room. Consumer Reports almost rates the Q90R as high as the OLED TVs.
 
Hi. I'm new to the forum and found it via searching/researching LG OLED "burn-ins". I feel that I must post this in order to help prevent anyone from wasting their money along with any agony.

So I bought my OLED65B6P back in November 2016 (almost a year), and I too am not home to babysit the use of the family television, although really, should one have to?

This last Saturday, I noticed some discoloration on the bottom of the screen while watching a movie. I started to switch from channels and different apps in order to get single color backgrounds and wala...

Well, the photo says it all. I bought the set from PC Richard and Son (US retailer) with an extended warranty and I'm currently awaiting a service call scheduled for this upcoming Saturday. I'll update as things happen. I highly suggest anyone wait for the 2018 models and any test results from the supposed fix. This is very disappointing, as reviews tout that any burn-in is temporary and can be remedied using Clear Panel Noise or keeping it off for an extended period, which I have tried to no avail. I also have had Screen Shift enabled since first use. The OLED picture is absolutely amazing, along with amazing blacks that can't be compared to. Unfortunately, now when I watch the TV, rather than watching the program, I find myself staring at the bottom of the screen...it's sad. :(
UPDATE!! After 2 years. I am replying to my original post from way back when.

At the time of this original post, my OLED65B6P was less than a year old and it was already showing signs of OLED pixel degradation. LG wouldn't cover it, nor would PC Richard and Son (the retailer here in the northeast US) whom I had paid for an extended warranty. I was denied any replacement and/or repairs. It's your fault - as was explained to me. Preposterous!!

I began discussing my OLED problems with Mr O'Keeffe over at RTings.com before they began their absolutely awesome OLED testing. He was nice enough to post my pictures on their site. This was way back of course. I was even contacted by a lawyer who wanted to start a class action lawsuit against LG, but I don't know what had transpired with that. Never heard from him again.

Well, after some time, all I could do was simply give up.

Recently, because my OLED tv had simply degraded beyond the point where one could even bear to watch anything on it, I began researching LED TVs to buy a replacement. I am shocked that OLEDs are still "all the rave", and that reviewers still give them a thumbs up, but pleased that they do warn about OLED degradation. I happened to read a post somewhere that LG was now backtracking and repairing the OLEDs. I figure I try again via their support site. I got no reply immediately. On a whim, I figured I try the retailer again too. Low and behold, they said they would cover it! At first they said they would repair it. Then I asked if I could just get a replacement, and they said yes. They valued the replacement at the price of the latest comparable LG OLED. Of course now, if I was getting a new tv, I wasn't going to get an OLED and wind up with issues again. I went with a beautiful Sony LED. This was all about 2 weeks ago.

LG finally responded yesterday. This is what they said...

"We would not replace or refund the unit as this is image retention and is not covered by LG under the manufacturers warranty. However, we can offer a one time courtesy repair to have the panel on the unit replaced to rid you of the image retention. Please advise if you would like to proceed with the repair option."

Courtesy repair??? I told them I had already gotten a replacement Sony LED from the retailer and that they could take their courtesy and shove it up their 😉. I did - really.

Anyway, I've attached some shots of how bad things got after owning the OLED for 3 years. Enjoy...
Note the yellow background one, yellows had gone to being green entirely. Awful.

Good riddance LG/OLED. Can't wait for MicroLED!

Kal
 

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UPDATE!! After 2 years. I am replying to my original post from way back when.

At the time of this original post, my OLED65B6P was less than a year old and it was already showing signs of OLED pixel degradation. LG wouldn't cover it, nor would PC Richard and Son (the retailer here in the northeast US) whom I had paid for an extended warranty. I was denied any replacement and/or repairs. It's your fault - as was explained to me. Preposterous!!

I began discussing my OLED problems with Mr O'Keeffe over at RTings.com before they began their absolutely awesome OLED testing. He was nice enough to post my pictures on their site. This was way back of course. I was even contacted by a lawyer who wanted to start a class action lawsuit against LG, but I don't know what had transpired with that. Never heard from him again.

Well, after some time, all I could do was simply give up.

Recently, because my OLED tv had simply degraded beyond the point where one could even bear to watch anything on it, I began researching LED TVs to buy a replacement. I am shocked that OLEDs are still "all the rave", and that reviewers still give them a thumbs up, but pleased that they do warn about OLED degradation. I happened to read a post somewhere that LG was now backtracking and repairing the OLEDs. I figure I try again via their support site. I got no reply immediately. On a whim, I figured I try the retailer again too. Low and behold, they said they would cover it! At first they said they would repair it. Then I asked if I could just get a replacement, and they said yes. They valued the replacement at the price of the latest comparable LG OLED. Of course now, if I was getting a new tv, I wasn't going to get an OLED and wind up with issues again. I went with a beautiful Sony LED. This was all about 2 weeks ago.

LG finally responded yesterday. This is what they said...

"We would not replace or refund the unit as this is image retention and is not covered by LG under the manufacturers warranty. However, we can offer a one time courtesy repair to have the panel on the unit replaced to rid you of the image retention. Please advise if you would like to proceed with the repair option."

Courtesy repair??? I told them I had already gotten a replacement Sony LED from the retailer and that they could take their courtesy and shove it up their 😉. I did - really.

Anyway, I've attached some shots of how bad things got after owning the OLED for 3 years. Enjoy...
Note the yellow background one, yellows had gone to being green entirely. Awful.

Good riddance LG/OLED. Can't wait for MicroLED!

Kal
My God!
Now a lot of feedback will be: yeah but the c8 and c9 do have software improvements to avoid these kind of things....to me: bullshit its the same technology and ones you will have to deal with it soon or late. It will just delay the issues...in my opinion. Of course people that change their tv every 5 year is another thing. I rather like to invest and keep it 10-15y.
 
My E7 went for repair on Thursday.Its two years old and needs a new screen mainly due to banding.It just did it’s second 2000 hour pixel refresh which caused banding.On coloured slides the engineer got up on YouTube it was horrendous on a red slide,It was covered in great big splodges.
Ive now no faith in OLED but I’m stuck with it as a new screen is being fitted.Theres going to be so many issues as they age.Personally I think 2 to 3 years is their lifespan.
Im now using a 10 year old Philips 32 inch lcd out my bedroom the picture has amazed me how good it is and im going back to lcd when I upgrade.
Im a massive OLED fan but they simply don’t last and aren’t fit for purpose in my opinion.
 
ok so basically old OLED models have a high risk of burn in....and models starting from 2018 have less risks but we have to wait another 9 months to know for sure ?

does that sum it ?
 
I've sorted everything with Richer Sounds now, but I've finally recieved a reply from LG. Took them over 2 weeks to reply.

"Good Morning.


Thank you for your email.


I am sorry that you have not been given an update before now and for any inconvenience it may have caused. Having spoken with our Management about your case we have two potential options for your consideration.



We do not manufacture 3D screens anymore so we are not able to repair your television to its original specifications. As such if we were to look into a repair for you the television would lose its 3D capability, however we would be able to offer you £30.00 of compensation, subject to final authorisation, for the loss of that function.



If this option is not amenable to you then we could look into providing you with either a replacement product, or a financial settlement to the current worth of the unit if there is no stock of appropriate replacements. Both of these would also be subject to final management authorisation and, as I have mentioned, we no longer manufacture 3D screens so any replacement products would be 2D only.



In response to your concerns about the condition of the unit at the point of sale and whether the product was fit for purpose, the designation ‘fit for purpose’ only applies to the point at which the unit is purchased. If a fault develops along the line, and it is the nature of electronic products that faults might randomly occur, the product cannot become ‘unfit for purpose'. If you disagree and wish to pursue this further under consumer law you will need to speak with your retailer as your legal recourse is with them.



Please have a think and let us know which of the available routes you would prefer to go down.



Kind Regards,
Rebecca | Resolutions Agent – Level 1

LG Electronics UK Helpdesk"

I asked if she'd forgotten a zero! It's a shame LG thinks so little of 3D.
 
ok so basically old OLED models have a high risk of burn in....and models starting from 2018 have less risks but we have to wait another 9 months to know for sure ?

does that sum it ?
I would take "high" out of your statement and that we have to wait another "9 months to know for sure". Consumer Reports, which bases their opinions on actual factual data, has already confirmed to me that OLED Burn In is a non-issue with new OLED TVs.
This is primarily because the aperture ratio has been increased. Because the aperture ratio has been increased each pixel requires far less current to achieve the same brightness, There are many other improvements on top of the increased aperture ratio LG has done to their OLED panels in recent years to make Burn In a non-issue.
 
My E7 exactly two years old with 4200 hours of use has just gone for a new screen to be fitted.It developed severe banding after it’s second 2000 hour pixel refresh.Football was really bad with bands so it’s not just burn in issues as these tvs can suddenly go from a perfect picture to a mess with something designed to keep the screen uniform.Ive no faith LG now.
If burn in was a non issue then they’d confidently give a 5 year burn in warranty.
When the engineer came to veiw my tv it took seconds for him to approve a new screen.To my amazement on red slide he put up it was covered in squares from the sky q recording planner so my tv also had burn in aswell but it never showed and I was blissfully ignorant of it until I saw a red slide.
I think time will show a lot more issues but hopefully newer models will be better as the E7 didn’t have logo luminance protection as far as I’m aware.
If I get two more years problem free with my new panel then that will be 4 years my E7 has lasted and I’m happy with that.No way would it’s original panel have lasted 4 years though.
My old lcd is next door as I gave it to my neighbour and 14 years old with not one issue.
Im watching a 10 year old Philips 32 inch lcd now until mine comes back and the picture is amazing I’m truly shocked how good it is id say 1080 content beats my Oled but smaller makes for a sharper picture I think.Also the colours are so good and there’s no upscaling to be done.
 
My E7 exactly two years old with 4200 hours of use has just gone for a new screen to be fitted.It developed severe banding after it’s second 2000 hour pixel refresh.Football was really bad with bands so it’s not just burn in issues as these tvs can suddenly go from a perfect picture to a mess with something designed to keep the screen uniform.Ive no faith LG now.
If burn in was a non issue then they’d confidently give a 5 year burn in warranty.
When the engineer came to veiw my tv it took seconds for him to approve a new screen.To my amazement on red slide he put up it was covered in squares from the sky q recording planner so my tv also had burn in aswell but it never showed and I was blissfully ignorant of it until I saw a red slide.
I think time will show a lot more issues but hopefully newer models will be better as the E7 didn’t have logo luminance protection as far as I’m aware.
If I get two more years problem free with my new panel then that will be 4 years my E7 has lasted and I’m happy with that.No way would it’s original panel have lasted 4 years though.
My old lcd is next door as I gave it to my neighbour and 14 years old with not one issue.
Im watching a 10 year old Philips 32 inch lcd now until mine comes back and the picture is amazing I’m truly shocked how good it is id say 1080 content beats my Oled but smaller makes for a sharper picture I think.Also the colours are so good and there’s no upscaling to be done.
Based on your experience do you think Rtings.com 1.0 rating is overblown or do you agree with this rating?

Thanks for your reply below.
 
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Pretty sure that Rebecca's interpretation of "fit for purpose" is deeply flawed!

Andy
 
Yes I think I agree with Rtings rating based on my experienc.Will be interesting to see how 2018 and 2019 models compare as they age.Id be a lot more confident in Oled tech if they covered burn in as I’m a massive fan of the technology and hope I’m proven wrong but that red slide astounded me with the sky q recording boxes burnt in or should I say the pixels more worn out.
 
Remember that OLED Info is a web site for OLED manufacturers - therefore I would expect it to be biased towards OLED. They would be the last place that I would expect to see negative stories about OLED.
Consumer Reports gave me a similar answer when I inquired about OLED Burn In. I wonder if these guys just stole this information from Consumer Reports.
This is a small portion of Consumer Reports response.
“With the OLED technology advancing so quickly, these newer models have improved their performance to help avoid burn in. Overall LCD tvs are less prone to burn in, since the OLED use a much higher frequency of energy and lighting. But that is not the case with newer models. “

 
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Consumer Reports gave me a similar answer when I inquired about OLED Burn In. I wonder if these guys just stole this information from Consumer Reports.
This is a small portion of Consumer Reports response.
“With the OLED technology advancing so quickly, these newer models have improved their performance to help avoid burn in. Overall LCD tvs are less prone to burn in, since the OLED use a much higher frequency of energy and lighting. But that is not the case with newer models. “
Consumer reports is a North American based website and as such has no relevance in the UK. The fit for purpose test has already been through the Small claims court, with a very successful outcome for the claimant. It is fully documented on this site,
 
Overall LCD tvs are less prone to burn in, since the OLED use a much higher frequency of energy and lighting. But that is not the case with newer models. “
What the hell is that crap supposed to mean?

Surely they could have come up with something a bit more reasonable than that e.g. "OLED displays use organic compounds and these compounds can deteriorate over time and through use, especially when exposed to heat"

I did not know anything Consumer Reports before - but now at least I know that they talk complete nonsense.
 
Consumer reports is a North American based website and as such has no relevance in the UK. The fit for purpose test has already been through the Small claims court, with a very successful outcome for the claimant. It is fully documented on this site,
I suspect that one issue when discussing burn in is that more recent sets are probably much less susceptible to burn-in than older models such as the B6/C6/E6 range.

Since 2016 when those sets were released, there have been two observable changes to the physical structure of the panels (changes to the sub-pixel apertures) and there have also been changes to the protection algorithms implemented by LG. (None of these algorithms seem very clever and they all impact viewing. All the protections I have seen discussed seem to simply be along the lines of "If a part of the image is bright and static, then dim that part of the image, or the whole screen".)

Additionally, there may have been improvements to the OLED emitter compounds and better temperature management in later models. For example, the latest Panasonic GZ2000 is supposed to have significantly better heat dissipation and that may be the reason why it does not show any image retention when displaying very bright HDR test patterns - unlike other OLEDs.

Unfortunately for LG even if they do make significant improvements on OLED lifespan they cannot really come out and publicly say "Our latest OLEDs have a much better lifespan" as that then implies that lifespan really was an issue with previous generations.

It will be interesting to see whether the OLED panels presented by LG in a few weeks at CES, have any changes to their sub-pixel structure - the 2019 sets were unusual in that they had the same pixel structure as the previous years model. I also wonder if LG will try to implement improved screen cooling similar to what Panasonic did with their custom OLED panel.
 
I have a feeling the problem will be even worse on the newer models as Im pretty sure they have slightly higher peak brightness.
 
@OLEDExpert how effective is "logo luminance" ? i never read any reviews about that...is it automatic or do we have to activate it ? and do all 2018/2019 brands/models have it ?

also how effective can it be, if oled burn in is CUMULATIVE ? thanks for any input...
 
Just got another reply from LG.

"Good Afternoon,



I would like to firstly apologise for any delay in getting back to you and for any inconvenience that this may have caused. We are currently experiencing a higher volume of emails than normal and are working diligently to answer each one as soon as possible.



If you would like to proceed with the route of a chargeable repair, as advised below we would be unable to repair the unit to its original specifications and therefore if you would like to proceed with a replacement screen it would be a 2D panel. Due to the loss of the 3D function should you accept, we would offer you £30.00 as a gesture of goodwill compensation, subject to final authorisation. Please note that as the unit is out of warranty this would be a chargeable repair, however we can offer a reduced rate repair of £200.00.



In order for us to look into any potentially models that we could offer you or the depreciated settlement offer, we would require a copy of your proof of purchase to be provided to us.



An acceptable proof of purchase would include the retailers name, VAT number, amount paid for the unit, product information as well as the date of purchase.



Once this has been received we will be able to advise you of any potential models. Please note that when we check for the models they may not be in stock by the time you come to a decision and therefore if this is the case we will also provide you with the settlement amount. As it is subject to stock availability.



Kind regards

Victoria

Level 1 Agent LG Resolutions"

Yesterday there wasn't a £200 charge, but today LG must be feeling extra Christmassy Haha!
 
There are millions of OLED owners who haven’t experienced burn in. It would be nice if some of them would share their usage. Their are millions of real life tests that have been run we just need users to post their results. On these sites you only get the few people that have experienced burn in reporting.
Bought my LG OLED 55EG960V from Currys 20/02/16. Approximately 1 year to 18 months later I got a stuck pixel and Currys replaced the screen. The second screen has lasted around 18 months and I have now got the ITV Breakfast news logo burned into the bottom left of the screen. Good Morning Britain is on 5 days per week for approximately 1 hour each morning and of course has regular advertisements being ITV. Im amazed that the screen has burn in in what must be less than 300 hours of use. Currys have just told me they do not cover burn in on their 5 year warranty. They tell me my only option is pay for a repair. Very disappointed in a tv costing £2,500 not even 4 years old and on its second defective screen.
 
Bought my LG OLED 55EG960V from Currys 20/02/16. Approximately 1 year to 18 months later I got a stuck pixel and Currys replaced the screen. The second screen has lasted around 18 months and I have now got the ITV Breakfast news logo burned into the bottom left of the screen. Good Morning Britain is on 5 days per week for approximately 1 hour each morning and of course has regular advertisements being ITV. Im amazed that the screen has burn in in what must be less than 300 hours of use. Currys have just told me they do not cover burn in on their 5 year warranty. They tell me my only option is pay for a repair. Very disappointed in a tv costing £2,500 not even 4 years old and on its second defective screen.
The 2015 models are more prone to burn in. Do you think Rtings.com 1.0 rating is overblown or do you agree with their rating?
 
Just got another reply from LG.

"Good Afternoon,



I would like to firstly apologise for any delay in getting back to you and for any inconvenience that this may have caused. We are currently experiencing a higher volume of emails than normal and are working diligently to answer each one as soon as possible.



If you would like to proceed with the route of a chargeable repair, as advised below we would be unable to repair the unit to its original specifications and therefore if you would like to proceed with a replacement screen it would be a 2D panel. Due to the loss of the 3D function should you accept, we would offer you £30.00 as a gesture of goodwill compensation, subject to final authorisation. Please note that as the unit is out of warranty this would be a chargeable repair, however we can offer a reduced rate repair of £200.00.



In order for us to look into any potentially models that we could offer you or the depreciated settlement offer, we would require a copy of your proof of purchase to be provided to us.



An acceptable proof of purchase would include the retailers name, VAT number, amount paid for the unit, product information as well as the date of purchase.



Once this has been received we will be able to advise you of any potential models. Please note that when we check for the models they may not be in stock by the time you come to a decision and therefore if this is the case we will also provide you with the settlement amount. As it is subject to stock availability.



Kind regards

Victoria

Level 1 Agent LG Resolutions"

Yesterday there wasn't a £200 charge, but today LG must be feeling extra Christmassy Haha!
Come the Revolution eh?
 
Bought an LG OLED65B7A less than 2 years ago. I am a retired person who simply watches television....the normal way I always have. I have now noticed a burn in news banner along the bottom of my screen. I have NEVER had this problem with Plasma, LED's or LCD's. Anything I can do? I assume LG will not stand behind this....

I will give a warning to everyone considering an OLED to be very wary. Again...I never thought this would be an issue and assumed the old days of burn in problems were long gone with software and such. Seems like I wasted over $2K on a great looking TV.
 
I think it's not overblown at all. Bought an LG OLED65B7A less than 2 years ago. I am a retired person who simply watches television....the normal way I always have. I have now noticed a burn in news banner along the bottom of my screen. I have NEVER had this problem with Plasma, LED's or LCD's.

I will give a warning to everyone considering an OLED to be very wary. Again...I never thought this would be an issue and assumed the old days of burn in problems were long gone with software and such. Seems like I wasted over $2K on a great looking TV.
 

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