Amps and decisions

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by carrera2rs, Jun 20, 2002.

  1. carrera2rs

    carrera2rs
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    Well I am about to make a decision....

    here's the contenders :

    Yamaha DSP AX1, the best price so far seems to be £799

    Denon 3802 Best price £629

    Denon A10SE best price £800, but I will need an additional amp for more than 5.1

    Second hand Denon A1D, Mike what are you looking for ?

    I will initially run 5.1 but may upgrade later. It will only be used for DVD's

    The rest of kit is Toshiba SD900E (Bought for new £699 multiregion and chipped for PAL progressive)

    Still looking for a well proced Sim2 HT200DM, might buy a new DMF or ex dem from Germany (Ian is yours still for sale ?)

    Thinkin of Energy 5.2, anyone know of a chaeper than £750 source ?

    Your advice n thoughts would be greatly appreciated

    Adrian:D
     
  2. Reiner

    Reiner
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    I would go for the Yammy or the 3802 + power amp(s). Add the power amp(s) now or later.

    The AX1 and 10SE don't do some of the latest decoding, so actually it would wise to choose the 3802 if 7.1 is your future plan. Or a Denon AVC-11SR though I dunno the price of that ...

    Acutally the 3803 is coming out soon, may wanna wait for that (price of 3802 should drop or you choose the new model).

    Anyhow, I rekon to quickly go out and listen to those and see if they actually suit your taste.
     
  3. carrera2rs

    carrera2rs
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    Thanks for the advice, the only problem is no-one seems to dem old stock......

    A:(
     
  4. Ian J

    Ian J
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    Depending on the size of your overall budget, if you only intend to use it for DVDs and you seem to have no objection to second hand, the Denon AVC 10SE goes for £500 - £550.

    It appears to be a better amp than the 3802 but doesn't have PL2, amplification for the second set of rears or a tuner, none of which you appear to need at the moment.

    The saving of £300 could be put to your speaker budget and would buy one of the two second hand REL Strata's currently for sale in the classifieds, with some change.

    That's the way I went.
     
  5. carrera2rs

    carrera2rs
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    Well, I had a listen....

    I auditioned the Yammy AX1, the Denon 3802 and the Denon AVC A11SE.

    To me the conclusions were:

    AX1 Excellent, really sounded real drew me into the film sounded effortless and bottomless. Had a real weight to the sound great dynamics that were totally natural. The sound was very cinema like a real sense of scale and drama without the hardening up usually found on jap amps.

    3802 Good, very impressive but lacked the scale and drive of the yammy. never convinced me I was there (A la Cinema), sounded leaner and more clinical and nowhere near as naturally dynamic. You could here the amp trying as the volume went up. Tonally this amp was a little bright and less natural, very clear but not in the same league as the AX1 (To me....)

    11SE Much better than the 3802, the drive and weight was back to the sound. A little leaner and brighter than the Yammy and more 'obvious' to me less natural. Imaged very well, very clear. Tonally not as rich as the Yammy, somehow every time I went back to the yammy the film seemed to have more suspense, drama and a bigger grin factor.

    Conclusions for me were clear, with all bar the Yamaha I was impressed but left believeing there was something better, more natural and more believable. With the Yammy, I just felt it was excellent and simply more than good enough for home Cinema. I'm sure there is better out there (Ihave no doubt) But for me this was fit and forget material. (Rare for me, I have doen the second mortgage on the Hi-Fi., this will only be used for home cinema)

    The AX1 for £799 is a steal, weighs in at 28kg and will do very nicely thanks,

    Just need to decide on a sub £1k subwoofer and satelite system thinkin of

    Energy 5.2
    Boston/Rel
    Kef 2005

    Any othe ideas ?

    Thanks for a great forum

    Adrian
    :D :D :D
     
  6. Guest

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    Adrian,

    I've both emailed and PM'd you via this forum. It's £750 firm. If you need to know why it's worth that then get in touch ;) Oh and mine's black so it's not your beastie if you're set on a gold'un.

    Also, I've got a pair of Denon monoblocks (POA-4400) which I may consider selling with it. These are very hard-to-find now and were/are revered by anyone 'in the know'. Fed from the A1D, they are sensational.

    Other than that, try and find an A10SE (or wait a little while for pricedrops on secondhand A1SE's).

    Mike.
     
  7. Ian J

    Ian J
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    The Kef eggs are highly rated (although I must admit I have never heard them) but there have been complaints about the lack of bass.

    Five Kef eggs plus a REL subwoofer would get around that problem.

    The Definitive Technology Pro Cinema setup at £1,000 is a good system (that I have had and can recommend) as an alternative if you insist on sub sats.

    Having had floorstanders and sub sats and now having compact size speakers, the sub / sats were the least satisfactory solution as there is always a hole in the upper bass / lower mid range but I am aware that for some people it is the only type of speaker that is acceptable
     
  8. carrera2rs

    carrera2rs
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    Thanks for the advice

    Mike, sorry for not gettin back on the A1D. In the end the Yammy was the winner on the blind tests and ofcourse it is not limited on 5 channels only. Thanks for the offer anyhow

    I'm due to dem the 5.2's the Ruarks and the Kef 2005's as well as the rel Q150 to compare and contrast, I'm takin the AX1 along

    I will let you know my findings......

    A:rolleyes:
     
  9. Rad

    Rad
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    You may want to look at the Marantz series as well, I have an SR7200 and it was the best option for me as it not only does great home cinema but it is excelant with normal audio as well.

    At the end of the day (same old story here) go and have a listen for yourself.

    Happy hunting.
     
  10. carrera2rs

    carrera2rs
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    Well I took the Yammy along and dem'd :

    Kef KHT 2005
    Energy 5.2
    Ruark Vita 100

    I was at Sevenoaks Hi-Fi for about 3 1/2 hours, played lots of different secenes, mostly from Gladiator (great film!) and swapped to and from more times tha I can remember (Thanks Sevenoaks for your patinece). My thoughts:

    Ruark clearly ahead of the game, richer, cleare and mcuh more muscal. It did however seem to draw your atention to them in a peculiar way that could distract you from the film (probably set up, etc). They were a notch up on the other two (twice the price....) On musical pieces you could see their pedigree (Hi-Fi)
    They had more weight and sounded a little more effortless than the other two

    Energy and Kef, I did lost of listening between these two. The Kef's are more 'obvious' and immediately impressive. There is a little emphasis on some of the upper mid allowing you to locate voices and some detail very clearly. They image well and have a 'punchy' sound, the bass seemed more obvious than on the energy system. For my money is intergated less well and was a little plummy. The energy is more even and better integrated accross the range. The sound was a little less obviously dramatic but seemed to me to draw you into the film more successfully than the Kef's. There was more weight in the mid and voices sounded more natural.

    After a very long listening I just preferred the Energy's they somehow had more listenability, body and depth to the sound. A little more natural and even.

    Final decision the Energy's would come home with me !

    I was so grateful for being allowed to have a long dem. All the systems sounded excellent driven by my Yammy. The shop manager held the Yammy in very high regard (And doesn't sell it !)
    I have tonnes of respect for the Yammy after lstening to the Kefs driven by a Denon 2802, with that amp they sounded all boom and tizz, thin and very unconvincing and harsh when driven.

    The manager had often seen the value of a grunty amp driving a sub/sat system and believed that systems like those demmed showed a bigger between amps than larger full range enclosures.

    Ths dem was done with no more than a quick shuffle with position and no amp tuning (Now having read the manual, the poor yammy was looking for a rear centre and additional front effect speakers all the way through.....). Can't wait to get them delivered a nd running with a full set up...

    The reason I didn't buy the Ruarks was not performance just price, they were better, but the Energy's were simply more than good enough for the purpose and sounded fantastic. After visitng my nearest Cinema that evening, was becoming critical of the Cinema's sound - QED the Energy's driven by a big amp will do me ! (For now!!)

    Adrian
     
  11. carrera2rs

    carrera2rs
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    Der....

    Sorry for the typo's above........

    :( ;) :D
     

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