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AMD Athlon 3200 vs AMD 64 3200

Discussion in 'PC Gaming & Rigs' started by gargoyle, Jul 24, 2005.

  1. gargoyle

    gargoyle
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    I'm currently putting together a new gaming machine and am currently checking out the mobo and cpu - I plan to base my system around an amd cpu but before I make the purchase, could anyone tell me if there is any 'real' difference in performance between the standard AMD Athlon 3200 and the equilvilant AMD 64 cpu bearing in mind that this is primarily a gaming rig?
     
  2. overkill

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    The XP3200 has 512mb L2 cache same as some of the 3200 64's. However, some 3200 64's have 1mb cache others have 1600 ht (hypertransport) some have 2000. Depends which one it is to make a comparison. Either way i'd go for the 64 bit. The 3200xp is a fast CPU but runs hot (I have one) while the 64 bit cpus have a much faster fsb, run cooler, control memory onboard, are future proof and are overall faster even in 32bit than their XP counterparts.
     
  3. gargoyle

    gargoyle
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    That taught me! Thanks for the info overkill :hiya:
     
  4. james.miller

    james.miller
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    The 64's can really be compared to the xp's. AMD totally revies the PR ratings for the 64 and they excel in certain area's that throws the comparisons further off.

    A few points:

    * an xp3200 is about on par with a 2.8ghz P4 (AMD were a little too generous back then)
    * a A64 3200+ are faster than a 3.2ghz p4 in just about everything, especially when it comes to gaming. This is due mostly to it's very efficiant floating point capabilities, and also to it's onboard memory controller which cut's memory latency by massive amounts compared to anything AXP or P4 that all have the memory controller on the motherboard.
    * i'd advise you not to compare cpu's by cache alone. If you did that the p4 extream editions with their massive amounts of L2 and L3 would like look them look like the fastest things on earth - they aren't lol.
    * The hypertransport bus is largely irrelevant to your desicision. The first thing us overclockers do is drop the HP bus speed (usually from 1000 to 800) to enable is to overclock further. I wont get into that here, but a HP bus speed of anything from 700mhz upwards really doesnt alter performance at all.


    There are a few ways you can go with an a64 setup. There are two socket types - 754 and 939.

    up to now 754 has been the budget socket and 939 has all the top end stuff.
    Even now that is largely true, however various companies are starting to bring the latest features to s754.

    The only realy difference between s754 and s939 is that the later has dual channel ram capabilities like the P4 and the aXP nforce2 boards do. THis generally gives you a 7-10% increase in performance over its s754 counterpart. You still with me? good lol

    S939 is definately more futureproof. The latest big thing in cpu's is coming to s939 only - Dual core cpu's. They do nothing for gaming, but increase windows and encoding performance (and other things) dramatically. So much so that AMD are now running away with the performance crown.

    S939 also has AGP and PCI-E options. PCI-E is now the new standard for pluging in perherials. Your AGP's cards wont fit in a PCI-E socket, so be you're going to need a new pci-e graphica card aswell if you choose that route. As i said before though, s754 is now getting pci-e aswell, which makes the choices even harder lol. You WILL nedd pci-e if you want the latest grasphics cards and the ability to upgrade. AGP is almost at the end of its life now.


    there's more but i'm sure the basics are all in there. If you want my advice, go for a A64 3200+ Venice core on an nforce4 PCI-E motherboard get yourself some Geil value ram (2x256 or 2x512) and your set. Then its down to the graphics card, but ill leave that for another thread:)
     
  5. the_sanguine

    the_sanguine
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    Sorry to intrude guys but can somebody explain what this 64bit thing is about and whether it's important when buying a PC?
     
  6. james.miller

    james.miller
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    64bit means it can process larger numbers, faster, than a 32bit cpu, basically. If a number requires more than 32bit's to process, the 32bit cpu would have to do it in two operations wheras the 64bit would do it in one. That's a little over-simplistic but that's how it works:)

    It's faster, but not a lot. And while we're all using 32bit windows editions, it's not faster at all.
     
  7. the_sanguine

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    Thanks James, Don't worry, I'm not a complete non techie. It's just that I'm not up on PCs. ( can explain why a text message is 160 characters but not much about IT stuff....)

    So, if somebody's looking to buy a PC, how important is it to get 64bit? Is price/performance reasonable yet? Is there an upgrade path?
     
  8. Daftboy

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    Want to tag onto this if I can.
    I'm looking to upgrade my XP2600 processor, but the amount of xp chips around are limited and expensive. My motherboard will take the Sempron processor, so I have the following questions:
    1. Is a Sempron on the same level as an XP chip?
    2. How much difference would I notice between a XP2400 and a Sempron 3200?
    3. Should I just hold onto the case a little longer, sell the old PC and go down the 64-bit route?
    4. Abandon PC's and move onto Mac?
    5. Mac Mini or G5?
    6. Chelsea or Man Uted.

    Sorry, rambeling a bit there, but if anyone can advise, it would be appreciated.
     
  9. overkill

    overkill
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    Can they? :confused:
    The rating was not linked to clock speed. ;)

    Not on terms of speed, but it does in terms of the fact that the HT is onboard memory handling something which the XP cannot do.

    Nope. The 754 was the original 64 bit socket. 939/940 has replaced it.

    Dual channel memory is unlikely to give you a 7-10% improvement in performance either. :D

    However, the rest I'd agree with! PCI-E is the long term future, although take up has been described as 'modest' by a few PC 'majors'.

    If you want really fast then as james says go for a 939 (or 940) board with PCI-E. Not sure about Nforce though............... :) I'm back with VIA after a nasty brush with an nforce chipset! :D

    Daftboy, three sounds like the sensible option at this juncture. I upgraded to an XP3200 & nforce2 recently - a waste of time. After much poncing with it gave up and went 64 bit. That's the best move when you can afford it.

    Windows 64bit is almost (Microsoft almost that is) with us and Linux 64bit is already here. So, 64 bit computing is just around the corner.
     
  10. james.miller

    james.miller
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    CAN'T. Spelling mistake on my part.

    the hypertransport bus (HTT BUS) is what links The motherboard and it's chipset to the cpu, it is NOT the memory bus. As i said, the memory controller is onboard the cpu itself and thus the ram is linked straight to the cpu. It doesn't use the HTT bus.. If you like, i can run any benchmark you like at 1000mhz, 800mhz, 600mhz and anything else you like and you'll see the difference it doesnt make.

    Yes you are quite right. However a calling it a replacement would suggest the s754 is defunct. It is not. s939 get's almost all of the top end specs these days which is exactly why the s754 platform is now the budget version.
    It's certainly not far off. I have an s939 dual chanel based A64 pc. Yup you guessed it - i tested single Vs dual channel, so im pretty clued up on it.

    Via aren't good for anything AMD these days./ It's all Nvidia and ATI atm. And don't go for an s940 board. they need buffered, regestered ram which is both slower and vastly more expensive. There is no need to go s940.

    unfortunately, it's not making the performance difference that was promised when the a64's were released.
     
  11. overkill

    overkill
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    It is to the effect that no new motherboards are being produced in 754 format. They are only budget in that they do not carry the latest hardware support, basically because when they were designed (PCI-E, SLI) it wasn't ready yet. Hence the last gen are being sold off cheap.


    Erm, nice one! ;) I have read around on this, and used both Dual channel and standard mode myself, and the performance boosts just aren't that great. Not saying you're wrong in your own tests however.

    I think quite a few people might take issue with that first statement! :eek: ECC reg is more expensive, but the performance hit really isn't that great. We are talking nano seconds here! Not to mention the added data security it gives.............

    They're pretty damn quick in 32bit alone! I agree Windows 64bit is not that great yet, but hey, it's MS! Bugs galore, glitches abound............... :D
     
  12. james.miller

    james.miller
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    I dont know exactly what you mean by that, but boards are still being produced. As i said PCI-e has come to the s754's, as has the nforce4 chipset. Infact a friend of mine who owns a shop has a few ATI s754 dual pci-e boards in, as well as the s939 varients I was ready to purchase an s754 for a second pc if the s939 wasn't so damn cheap;)

    http://msicomputer.co.uk/Products.aspx?product_id=703542&cat_id=77

    one example - the msi neo3-FSR. Nforce4-4x chipset with pci-e.

    They really wouldn't lol. Where are via these days anyway? they aren't competing with NVIDIA that's for sure. Now you are right the performance hit isn't much, but the premium of s940 cpu's (around £250 for a 1-way 2.2ghz opteron for example) and registered memory is and it doesnt offer anything for the home user. That's exactly why AMD aren't pushing it.

    Agreed. They are very fast and efficiant cpu's but when it comes down to it, that's nothing to do with their 64bit capabilities. 64bit will be essential down the road, but in the next your or two i can't see it beeing all that needed.
     

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