Am I a donut - AOTC plot holes

Discussion in 'Movie Forum' started by JaseyJay, Nov 10, 2002.

  1. JaseyJay

    JaseyJay
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    SPOILER ALERT --------------------




    A bit of a noobie at all this (prounced knob) but what is it all about !

    OB1 goes to Kimono (or whatever) talks to some aliens with long necks about an army been made for the jedi. He then meets Fett the elder who was trying to assainate ex Queen of naboo. All ok. Then Fett the elder does a runner to Genododah and is the right hand man of Chrissy Lee (Best performance and top man) who happens to have his own robot army.

    So now you got a robot army against fett the elder clones, with Fett the elder on the other side?

    How come the clone army takes orders from a little green fella? Surely Fett could of taken his helmet off and gone "everyone do the jedi" and that would of been that!



    :D
     
  2. bishman

    bishman
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    Yes, it's complicated to be sure, but evil works in devious ways.

    Dooku is responsible for bringing the trade federation and the other groups together to rise up against the republic.

    Dooku is also known as Tyrannus and it was him who Jango Fett said recruited him to be the original for the clone army.

    Therefore Dooku is involved in putting together both of the armies!

    While Dooku is instrumenting the armies, Palpatine is worming his way into a position of absolute control and is now on the path that leads to him becoming the emperor. He gets into the position of being granted these powers because of the threat caused by the seperatists. But these seperatists were put together by Dooku, Palpatines right hand man. Palpatine has organised the whole devious mess!!!

    I am sure that being so closely involved with Dooku that Jango Fett was well involved with the plan also.

    Hope that helps with your confusion.
     
  3. bishman

    bishman
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    And let's not forget the small fact that Jango was dead when the clone army arrived!
     
  4. ReTrO

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    But Boba is a direct clone of Jango!

    But it's all irrelanvent anyway. The clones have been taught to obey their Republic masters, so niether Jango nor Boba could control them.
     
  5. smallman28

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    POSSIBLE SPOILERS






    How about when R2 and C3PO go to the droid factory,they are poised on the edge of the platform and C3PO makes a remark about R2 always being a trouble maker.
    Granted they hung out a bit in episode 1 but what did R2 do in the time they were together to earn his reputation as a trouble maker with C3PO?
     
  6. lightningvictim

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    R U NOT missing the main point in all this.
    Dooku want to create instability so that the Dark Side can rise and take over the Galaxy - he plays a part in raising both armies to speed the process along....
     
  7. JaseyJay

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    Where does Count Dooku get the money for two armies?

    Plus if he has a hand in both armies, the quickest way to universal domination is to combine them and say "lets have it".

    Anyway - Long live the Empire - can't wait for the goody-two-shoes mob to get a good shoeing!


    :D
     
  8. lightningvictim

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    Where does any politician get there money - nuf said I think!

    However, after testing Anakin, Yoda gives the good old

    Fear is the path to the Dark side. Fear leads to hate. Hate leads to anger. And anger leads to suffering!

    A full blown war creates the perfect hate filled world for the Dark Side to feed off of - a single army just creates a dictatorship aka Mr Hussein in Iraq which leads to lots of oppressed people who just keep their heads down for the sake of staying alive despite their pityful existence.......
     
  9. bishman

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    Didn't I already say that?
     
  10. John-D

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    IMO all that fuss at the end of the movie, was for dooku, to just get his grubby hands on the Death Star plans. 'Dooku' and the soon to be 'Emperor' shafted the termite things, big-time.

    Maybe I'm wrong, but it's the best excuse I can think of.

    JD
     
  11. the_pauley

    the_pauley
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    Sloppy is not the word for this script. Apart from the woeful, inane dialogue, try this for a plot hole. Padme and co. are pursuing Dooku when she falls out of the transport.

    She is unconscious for several minutes during which time the chase continues for several dozen miles or so, 'til they reach Dooku's hangar / hideaway.

    Bear in mind, Padme has never met Dooku before, been to the planet, etc, and yet when she is revived by the trooper she states "...we've got to get to that hangar...".

    :confused:
     
  12. godzilla

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    IMO all this fuss about "terrible scripts", "dire acting", "plot holes" etc are all because those making a fuss, i.e. the thirtysomethings who cherish the memories of seeing the original trilogy at the cinema the first time round, don't understand why the "new" trilogy doesn't evoke the same magic for them.

    Well, duh! That's because we were KIDS the first time round, and now these new KIDS movies don't connect in the same way with us some 22 years later! There would have to be something very arrested about our development if they did...

    I've not seen anyone point out the most obvious "plot hole" of the whole saga, which is the fact that Luke receives ALL the training necessary to become a fully fledged Jedi Knight in no more than a couple of days on Dagobah in ESB! (Oh and a couple of hours aboard the Falcon in Ep 4.)

    That doesn't really tally with the Jedi academy we see in Ep2 and the fact Yoda initially says Anakin (at age 10) is too old to begin training in Ep1.

    But SO WHAT? They're only movies and ones aimed at a young audience and are still inspired and entertaining on most levels.
     
  13. bishman

    bishman
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    Never heard of womens intuition? :rolleyes:
     
  14. bishman

    bishman
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    EXACTLY!!

    Reminds me of something I read in a magazine, went along the lines of....

    "1999 was the year that George Lucas, creator of popular childrens sci-fi series Star Wars, was blasted by fans and critics for releasing a childrens sci-fi film"

    In any case, has anyone who slags off bad script/acting actually sat down and watched the original trilogy lately? I love the films, but they were hardly gonna set the oscars alight for their acting or writing now, were they?
     
  15. Gary D

    Gary D
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    Question: why didn't Janga Fett tell Count Dooku that he had been the template for a clone army? did it slip his mind? or didn't he think it was important?

    ATOTC is one of those films that seems to get worse the more i watch it......

    i've seen it four times time now and its gone from a 4 star film down to a two star movie


    Gary
     
  16. bishman

    bishman
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    Jango didn't have to tell Dooku, because Dooku recruited him to be the original for the clone army! If you remember, Jango said that he was recruited by a man called Tyrannus. This is Dooku's dark side name, Palpatine/Sidious calls him Lord Tryannus when they meet up at the end.
     
  17. Gary D

    Gary D
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    if so why was Dooku so shocked when the clone army turned up?

    Gary
     
  18. bishman

    bishman
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    He probably wasn't expecting them, Yoda went to Kamino and came back commanding the army.

    Also, Dooku was playing one side off against the other. He was amassing the droid army coalition under the guidance of Palpatine. So when the clone army turns up and destroys all the driods, he can hardly look pleased in front of his droid army leaders.

    This whole film is about Palpatine and Dooku setting up the disruption to cause the wars and get Palpatine into a position of supreme power in the republic.
     
  19. Geezer

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    That was my interpritation on the story as well.
     
  20. Gary D

    Gary D
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    thanks that makes some sort of sense now, what still makes no sense though - and no one can explain it - is why does george lucas insist on writing directing? hes crap at both.

    Gary
     
  21. bishman

    bishman
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    Can't help with that one Gary. :confused:
     
  22. Lex

    Lex
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    I totally disagree. I am disappointed with Episodes 1 & 2 because they are poor movies. Simple as that.
    The fact that George Lucas spent 22 years developing such appauling scripts/stories is truly frightening! :eek:
     
  23. godzilla

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    Ask any kid of 10-16 whether they think Episodes 1 & 2 are "poor movies". I think you'll find the vast majority think not, although naturally there is not the kind of mass hysteria as generated by the original trilogy because the prequels, by definition cannot be as, er, original.

    Yes it's a shame the scripts weren't better, but don't forget PART of the reason the dialogue is so clunky is because George deliberately wanted to give it a "timeless" feel, i.e. purposefully not contemporary, a bit like the 50's sci-fi serials it was all based on.

    But of course I agree he should leave the final screenplay to more talented writers as he did with Empire Strikes Back.

    It may be controversial, but I definitely prefer both Ep1 & 2 to Return of the Jedi which still ranks as my second all-time-most-disappointing-sequel; Alien 3 being by far the worst.
     
  24. green manalishi

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    there are holes, but thats not really what starwars has ever been about. i had an initial problem with epI (especially jar jar flamin binks), but stuck with it because of the pod racing (extended version on dvd:D ), and i'm gonna cue my epII dvd right now cos its sooo cool i wanna watch it again. if it's plot you want, go watch pride and prejudice or something. but if your looking for gung ho sci fi action adventure...

    btw, sabre scenes are boss too, especially yoda vs lee!
     
  25. bishman

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    Look, only 1 post and talking sense already!
     
  26. Nyquil Driver

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    I see what you're saying, but my nephew who's 11 yrs old actually thought Episode 1 was a bore and he cited Darth Maul as the only interesting character (he didn't find Jar Jar very funny, although he didn't hate him either). So I think you should have said "Ask any easily pleased kid of 10-16 what they think" as I believe todays children are generally more sophisticated and (unlike previous generations) are spoilt for choice. That said though, my nephew thoroughly enjoyed Eps 4-6, so I've come to accept that the new ones just aren't as endearing (despite being more technically accomplished).

    Yes it's a shame the scripts weren't better, but don't forget PART of the reason the dialogue is so clunky is because George deliberately wanted to give it a "timeless" feel, i.e. purposefully not contemporary, a bit like the 50's sci-fi serials it was based on.

    But that excuse doesn't stand-up for various reasons- firstly, 'timeless' doesn't equal 'clunky', so the bad dialogue in George's latest films isn't just bad because of its historical/referential accuracy IMO and it's probably the combination of duff lines and duff delivery that makes it seem so inadequate. Secondly, the majority of the speech in the original trilogy is acceptable enough (and certainly delivered better) so our expectations certainly shouldn't be any lower than that....

    Personally, I think the new films are inferior because they lack charm and humour. Jar Jar isn't as bad as some say, but he's woefully inadequate when you compare him to 3PO in A New Hope or when you think of the sly humour offered by Han Solo. Basically, I liked all the original characters a lot more and cared about their fates, wheras the newer movies seem to be populated with dullards. Yes, there are some interesting aliens (on the periphery of things anyway) but instead of the feisty Leia we get the dull Amidala, instead of the captivating Vader we get the dull Palpatine. I understand that the foundations of the story have to be properly laid, but I reserve the right to describe the films in a negative way if I don't find them engaging...
     

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