After a year of researching TV’s I bought a Samsung QN90A who has insufferable stutter or artifecting in low fps hdr content. Please advice a desperat

[moviegamefan]

After a year of researching TV’s I bought a Samsung QN90A who has insufferable stutter or artifecting in low fps hdr content. Please advice a desperate newbe.

Dear forum-visitors,

I am new to avforums. Well, sort off. I only just registered, but I’ve been reading relevant threads from the shadows this past year. Ever since I decided I wanted to upgrade my TV, I’ve been educating myself on Rtings, YT (HDRTest and Stop the FOMO), Reddit and AVForums.
After a year of doubting, I finally bought a Samsung 55” QN92A. I ultimately choose a LED over an OLED because my living room is rather bright.

I use my TV for gaming and movies. While gaming in HDR, I discovered something quite bothersome. It is exactly this issue I decided to register myself on the forum and ask you - the experts - for advice.

When in HDR, the TV’s motion is quite bad. I think it has to do with lower than 60fps content. When I toggle to 60fps, the motion is clear. After researching this, I think I’m sensitive to stutter.

Allow me to describe what I mean:
When Graphics are displayed (menu’s, world maps, credits rolling in films) the motion becomes jerky. The same happens when I pan the camera in a game. It’s like the motion flickers or vibrates. I get a headache watching this for to long. On my PS5, I can disable HDR. When watching or playing the same content in SDR, the motion is smooth.
I can also increase the Judder slider to 10 on my Samsung. This also helps smoothing the motion in HDR. However, it creates other problems. Now thin objects in the foreground are blurry or slightly pixelated (maybe artifacting?).

While I do have two games who can handle 60fps (on ps5), most of my games can’t. I can turn off HDR on my ps5, but not on other apps (like Netflix) or my ps4.

I really don’t know what to do with this. There are several questions I have:
1. Have I made a wrong purchase? Should I go for another TV where this is less of an issue? Iso, which one?
2. Is this a known issue? And are there ways to fix this?
3. Will VRR be of any help when it finally comes to the ps5?

My last TV was a Sony 49XD7004. It had perfect motion, but really dark HDR. It also wasn’t able to show HDR content in 4K.

Disclaimer: While I have a Samsung QN92A, I used the more commonly used QN90A name in the title. There is no difference except the area in which the TV is sold (and maybe the panels).

TLDR: I have stutter in HDR low fps content on my Samsung QN92A. How do I fix this? Is there a TV out there which is better handling motion of low fps content?

 

[moviegamefan]

An example:
When I play Ghost of Tsushima on ps4 with the Judder slider open, and I pan the screen from one side of the character to the next. There are not only some artifacts around the playable character, but the treetops are also distorted. If this makes sense: the treetops are settling in a bit late. It is as if the glitch out of place and when the pan stops, the settle upon the trees themeselves.

 

[Dodgexander]

The new TV will probably have worse response times compared to your old one, which is typical of a TV that uses a VA type panel, response times closer to black are usually the worst which can create more stuttering, and even trailing behind darker objects. The brighter and bigger the picture, the worse motion can be perceived also.

Generally though, once you get to this point its just a case that the TV probably just isn't suited to you and you should seek out a replacement. Some degree of motion tweaking on every modern TV is required for film and TV, but most people still agree Sony are ahead of Samsung in this regard.

Btw are you sure when you are making these comparisons that you aren't comparing 60 to 120fps games? I think the baseline is now 60fps, with some titles having 120 modes. Samsung unlike other brands let you set motion settings while gaming, so one thing you could try is tweaking judder reduction (for less, or equal to 30fps) or blur reduction (for more than 30fps) to see if it helps. You shouldn't need to put it on the highest setting as the highest will cause motion artifacts.

VRR may help, since the TV will then refresh exactly the same rate as the game. Right now no matter the game be it 30,60 or 120fps the TV refreshes at 120 so frames are repeated to build up the numbers.

 

[Mallett94]

@moviegamefan Have you change the HDMI port settings on your TV to enable UHD Deep Colour (or something like that) so that the TV can receive a 4K HDR 60fps signal via its HDMI ports? If you haven't then the HDMI ports are limited to only 4K HDR 30fps or 4K SDR 60fps.

Also in the general/system settings of the Samsung TV you should have the option to put the TV into Game mode. This should give much reduced input lag and may also speed up the response time.

You shouldn't use motion interpolation with games because it increases input lag and of course motion interpolation will cause unwanted side effect issues/glitches in the picture.

Another thing you should try is setting the default 'mode' that the games run in on your PS5 to be Performance mode so that it will always use the higher FPS mode of the game where available.

Hope this helps.

 

[moviegamefan]

Thanks for your help. Both of you. I discovered I can’t fix the problem without creating a new one, so I decided to return the TV.

I don’t know if I should get a new one. Is there a modern TV who handels the stutter of low fps content better?
What about the Sony X90J?

Or should I wait for new technology?

 

[Mallett94]

Thanks for your help. Both of you. I discovered I can’t fix the problem without creating a new one, so I decided to return the TV.

I don’t know if I should get a new one. Is there a modern TV who handels the stutter of low fps content better?
What about the Sony X90J?

Or should I wait for new technology?

What do you mean you can't fix the problem without creating a new one?

Have you tried any of ther suggestions I gave you?

 

[moviegamefan]

Yes I have. Game mode does not make a difference.
The hdmi input was already in the correct mode: enabled. I had no problem displaying 60fps. It’s everyting below 60fps that started the issue.

The only thing that seems to work is adjust the Judder slide, but when I do that, I get heavy artifacting issues. Both the stutter and artifacting isn’t what I want in a TV.

I can’t understand why the TV can’t adjust to a slower response time for content below 60fps

 

[Dodgexander]

You shouldn't use motion interpolation with games because it increases input lag and of course motion interpolation will cause unwanted side effect issues/glitches in the picture.

Samsung models are the exception here. They let you use interpolation in game mode.

 

[Mallett94]

What games did you used to play on previous generation consoles? Seeing 'not very good motion' on 30fps games has always been there especially when comparing to 60fps games.

You say in your OP that some things when you try it in HDR it has the motion issues, whereas if you try the same content in SDR it is perfectly smooth?... Have you done this for the PS5 input? => How to enable HDMI UHD Color in Series 6 4K UHD TV(KU6470)? | Samsung Support India

Have you tried changing the 'mode' which the games are runnning in from 'Quality/Resolution' mode to 'Performance' mode? Performance mode will generally change the games to running in a 60fps mode.

 

[Mallett94]

Samsung models are the exception here. They let you use interpolation in game mode.

Do they let you use it without adding any input lag though? Tbf I may have read that they do just that starting with some of their 2019 models? But tbf I've not really ever heard of anyone actually using it.

 

[Dodgexander]

Do they let you use it without adding any input lag though? Tbf I may have read that they do just that starting with some of their 2019 models? But tbf I've not really ever heard of anyone actually using it.

Not sure if it ads input lag, but if it does it certainly doesn't add a lot. Its a feature they've had since 2018 called game motion plus. 120hz models let you use it on 30fps and 60fps games whilst the 60hz models only 30fps games.

I've heard people use it, especially with older 30fps titles.

Be interesting to hear what the OP has to say about 30fps. Not sure many games are 30fps any more so seems a bit strange if they were being locked to 30. As you say, could be limiting the HDMI ports to 4k 30fps (HDMI 1.4 max).

To take a guess I think they meant 60fps and 120fps, the latter using performance mode.

 

[Rev007]

The 2020 qleds that suffered the same stutter has got an update last week which has fixed it .only took 2 years ..May work on this tv .look in Samsung UK tv firmware update