Answered Aerial options

funglejunk

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We have Virgin Media Tivo as our main supplier. We also have a fixed roof aerial. We have a Garden Annexe around 11 metres from the main house that is on a slope (lower than the main house) which we need to get a decent TV signal. We've tried a couple of different internal aerials but they tend to pixelate when anyone moves around in the annexe.

What would be the easiest and cost effective way of obtaining a good strong Freeview signal in the annexe?
 
Without any idea of the terrain or situation it's hard to say, does anywhere in the annex or just above it have line of sight to the transmitter tower?

If it does then a decent sized aerial should do the job, if not you may be better running a cable from the house aerial.
 
Without any idea of the terrain or situation it's hard to say, does anywhere in the annex or just above it have line of sight to the transmitter tower?

If it does then a decent sized aerial should do the job, if not you may be better running a cable from the house aerial.
No, it's too low down to be in line of site for the transmitter. It's a suburban area, semi detached with houses at the back and to the sides.
 
Is there a wall or fence along which you can run a coax cable ideally using WF 100 satellite grade cable. 11M isn't a very long cable. What compass direction does the downward slope point ? Does the Garden annexe have mains power from the main house.

Is the Garden Annexe in range of your WiFi signal (Can you connect to it using a mobile phone, while inside it ? )


Is there a aerial feed close to your broadband router (assuming you have broadband) ?
 
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Is there a wall or fence along which you can run a coax cable ideally using WF 100 satellite grade cable. 11M isn't a very long cable. What compass direction does the downward slope point ? Does the Garden annexe have mains power from the main house.

Is the Garden Annexe in range of your WiFi signal (Can you connect to it using a mobile phone, while inside it ? )


Is there a aerial feed close to your broadband router (assuming you have broadband) ?

The annexe is completely self contained. It's got it's own power and is connected to the broadband with a cat 5 cable and a wifi router.
 
The annexe is completely self contained. It's got it's own power and is connected to the broadband with a cat 5 cable and a wifi router.

Other questions ? Answer is required for your options.

Still ambigious. I take it the annexe connects to the router in your home by cat5. Can you connect a feed from the aerial to the location your home router is located.

Can you run a single cat6 cable from your home in addition to the existing cat 5 cable ?

You can get a device with twin Freeview tuners that records and connects to your router (It needs a terrestrial aerial connected and a connection to your router. Basically it's a twin tuner Freeview+pvr that records to a usb connected hard drive. It also gives you live TV pause and recording of up to 4 channels at once depending on mux. You do need a input from either an aerial or a satellite dish. Either a extension from your existing aerial or a local dish, hence the question as to the view of the sky from the annexe. 28.2E where our FTA content has a much higher elevation than terrestrial. Even a small ground based small dish £20-£30 will work with a view to the South East.

One of these connected to your home router will make all live freeview/FTA satellite channels and it's recordings usable on any kit connected to your home network.

You need a device that supports the app (PC with HDMI out, tablet with Chromecast mobile phone, etc. My TV works with this. You can even view the recordings when not at home using a a mobile device.

There is a number of ways but without the more detailed information, impossible to suggest cheapest/best option.
 
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Thanks for that. It's for my parents so the simpler the better. I guess the easiest option is to run a cable from the aerial down the fence to the annexe? I'd say in total it'd be maybe 25m.

Other questions ? Answer is required for your options.

Still ambigious. I take it the annexe connects to the router in your home by cat5. Can you connect a feed from the aerial to the location your home router is located.

Can you run a single cat6 cable from your home in addition to the existing cat 5 cable ?

You can get a device with twin Freeview tuners that records and connects to your router (It needs a terrestrial aerial connected and a connection to your router. Basically it's a twin tuner Freeview+pvr that records to a usb connected hard drive. It also gives you live TV pause and recording of up to 4 channels at once depending on mux. You do need a input from either an aerial or a satellite dish. Either a extension from your existing aerial or a local dish, hence the question as to the view of the sky from the annexe. 28.2E where our FTA content has a much higher elevation than terrestrial. Even a small ground based small dish £20-£30 will work with a view to the South East.

One of these connected to your home router will make all live freeview/FTA satellite channels and it's recordings usable on any kit connected to your home network.

You need a device that supports the app (PC with HDMI out, tablet with Chromecast mobile phone, etc. My TV works with this. You can even view the recordings when not at home using a a mobile device.

There is a number of ways but without the more detailed information, impossible to suggest cheapest/best option.
 
Room/set top aerials seldom work well unless in a very strong signal area and mostly unobstructed view to transmitter. (Occasionally, upper floors may be OK while ground is impossible). Location is key to TV reception. Use Wolfbane to give a very approximate estimate of the signal available (postcode or OS grid centres will seldom equate to anyone's home) and post the results (Transmitter, Field in dBuV and distance are the most relevant/needed). Alter the antenna height down to 1 metre from 10 to get a pessimistic figure/see if the numbers alter - it will be closer to the height of an outside aerial on the annexe?

An aerial cable could be run from house to annexe some way and the house aerial used to feed that (via a splitter, either powered/amplified or passively; depending on the signal lev. Overhead via a catenary wire, well supported and fixed to a suitable pole/bracket to be well above people's heads. An underground duct is an alternative. (How was the mains power and ethernet got to the annexe? If it was via a cable duct it may be possible to feed another through / lay anther duct the same route.

Protecting the cable from accidental damage is the greatest challenge. Plastic conduit can be helpful. WF100 and similar cable will attenuate TV frequencies by 16dB per 100 metres: 4dB for 25m. A 2-way splitter loses the same amount. A low gain (8-12dB) amplifier will make up for those losses, if there's not enough in hand from the aerial. Amplifier must be as close to the aerial as practical to work properly though.

Catchup TV services and live-streamed TV (iPlayer etc.,.) may suffice for some people and negate the need for a TV aerial altogether?
 
Thanks. Yep, set top aerial has been useless. Unfortunately the annexe builders didn't ask if I required a tv cable installed and I completely forgot. We have all the utilities fed in, including an ethernet cable, but no tv cable.

I think the best option is cable to roof top aerial run along fence in some kind of duct.

Room/set top aerials seldom work well unless in a very strong signal area and mostly unobstructed view to transmitter. (Occasionally, upper floors may be OK while ground is impossible). Location is key to TV reception. Use Wolfbane to give a very approximate estimate of the signal available (postcode or OS grid centres will seldom equate to anyone's home) and post the results (Transmitter, Field in dBuV and distance are the most relevant/needed). Alter the antenna height down to 1 metre from 10 to get a pessimistic figure/see if the numbers alter - it will be closer to the height of an outside aerial on the annexe?

An aerial cable could be run from house to annexe some way and the house aerial used to feed that (via a splitter, either powered/amplified or passively; depending on the signal lev. Overhead via a catenary wire, well supported and fixed to a suitable pole/bracket to be well above people's heads. An underground duct is an alternative. (How was the mains power and ethernet got to the annexe? If it was via a cable duct it may be possible to feed another through / lay anther duct the same route.

Protecting the cable from accidental damage is the greatest challenge. Plastic conduit can be helpful. WF100 and similar cable will attenuate TV frequencies by 16dB per 100 metres: 4dB for 25m. A 2-way splitter loses the same amount. A low gain (8-12dB) amplifier will make up for those losses, if there's not enough in hand from the aerial. Amplifier must be as close to the aerial as practical to work properly though.

Catchup TV services and live-streamed TV (iPlayer etc.,.) may suffice for some people and negate the need for a TV aerial altogether?
 
Wolfbane results from our area.
 

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Get the annnexe TV (or another small TV set) tuned in on the house aerial to allow it to be used with a 'test aerial'.

Wenvoe at 85dBuV (at 10 metres above ground or 1m?)... with that level, try a directional set top aerial on an extension cable OUTSIDE the annexe. High as you can on a pole (ue/g/ use broomstick) aimed like the house aerial.
Any joy with reception? Many TVs have built in level and quality metering that may be useful to check for every received multiplex rf frequency).

Much insulation nowadays has foil backing so stops TV signal dead. Same with the glazing, metalised films to reflect heat. Hence taking the aerial outside. Even partly blocked by other buildings the signal from Wenvoe should be pretty high? {Unless terrain is really against you}.

A proper external log periodic on a pole attached to annexe or fence post on slightly higher ground might work? ATV`s Choice Of Aerials for digital TV Otherwise cable back to house aerial. I'd not expect you to need an amplified split off the aerial (unless it is feeding a lot of other TVs in the main house via passive splitting).
 
Great, will try that when the weather clears up. The roof aerial is currently only feeding one TV occasionally.

Get the annnexe TV (or another small TV set) tuned in on the house aerial to allow it to be used with a 'test aerial'.

Wenvoe at 85dBuV (at 10 metres above ground or 1m?)... with that level, try a directional set top aerial on an extension cable OUTSIDE the annexe. High as you can on a pole (ue/g/ use broomstick) aimed like the house aerial.
Any joy with reception? Many TVs have built in level and quality metering that may be useful to check for every received multiplex rf frequency).

Much insulation nowadays has foil backing so stops TV signal dead. Same with the glazing, metalised films to reflect heat. Hence taking the aerial outside. Even partly blocked by other buildings the signal from Wenvoe should be pretty high? {Unless terrain is really against you}.

A proper external log periodic on a pole attached to annexe or fence post on slightly higher ground might work? ATV`s Choice Of Aerials for digital TV Otherwise cable back to house aerial. I'd not expect you to need an amplified split off the aerial (unless it is feeding a lot of other TVs in the main house via passive splitting).
 
Thanks for your help. Did exactly this and signal was perfect so I just need a suitable aerial to mount outside above the annexe. I'm guessing a caravan type one would suffice?

Get the annnexe TV (or another small TV set) tuned in on the house aerial to allow it to be used with a 'test aerial'.

Wenvoe at 85dBuV (at 10 metres above ground or 1m?)... with that level, try a directional set top aerial on an extension cable OUTSIDE the annexe. High as you can on a pole (ue/g/ use broomstick) aimed like the house aerial.
Any joy with reception? Many TVs have built in level and quality metering that may be useful to check for every received multiplex rf frequency).

Much insulation nowadays has foil backing so stops TV signal dead. Same with the glazing, metalised films to reflect heat. Hence taking the aerial outside. Even partly blocked by other buildings the signal from Wenvoe should be pretty high? {Unless terrain is really against you}.

A proper external log periodic on a pole attached to annexe or fence post on slightly higher ground might work? ATV`s Choice Of Aerials for digital TV Otherwise cable back to house aerial. I'd not expect you to need an amplified split off the aerial (unless it is feeding a lot of other TVs in the main house via passive splitting).
 
Thanks for your help. Did exactly this and signal was perfect so I just need a suitable aerial to mount outside above the annexe. I'm guessing a caravan type one would suffice?
The style I'd recommend is the one that Justin of ATV aerials recommends the log periodic. See link in my earlier post #11. That site is wealth of useful information freely provided by a working TV aerial installation company.

A caravan kit of log periodic aerial, pole and cable might suit; but compare the cost to buying bits separately and ensure any cable is foam filled, all-copper (core, braid and screen foil) rather than cheap rubbish (which will likely eliminate most low-priced kits).
 

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