Advice on switches to use with Shelly 2 dimmers

Amaster

Standard Member
Hi all

New to this side of the forums and have asked a few of you for some advice,

I have found the 3 position retractive switches from scolmore and varilight in the screwless design I’m looking for. And I thank many of you for the advice.



I will be buying some Shelly bypasses for each circuit to be used on the ceiling rose with each shelly device (as per the diagrams for low load circuits) but will probably use one for each circuit regardless.

I have come across an issue with using these switches that needs some clarification as I’m new to buying these switches in that the apparently to use the 3 position switches to turn on and dim on their own would not allow this functionality alone and must be used with LED fittings (I assume this mean LED dimmable bulbs) or drivers that have the switchDIM functionality? Can anyone clarify what these drivers are? Or whether I would need them if I installed a Shelly dimmer 2

from what I hear having a neutral to the ceiling rose would be preferable, how hard would this be for my electrician to run now that everything’s has been plastered?

also does the Shelly dimmer have to be installed in the back box or could it be installed closer to the ceiling rose?

Thankyou for your help in advance.
 

Seb Briggs

Well-known Member
I have come across an issue with using these switches that needs some clarification as I’m new to buying these switches in that the apparently to use the 3 position switches to turn on and dim on their own would not allow this functionality alone and must be used with LED fittings (I assume this mean LED dimmable bulbs) or drivers that have the switchDIM functionality? Can anyone clarify what these drivers are? Or whether I would need them if I installed a Shelly dimmer 2

The switches must be used with a Shelly module and dimmable LED bulbs to be able to use them at the switch location. The shelly Dimmer 2 is 230v so the led fittings need to be 230v

What do you have at the moment ?

The Shelly dimmer can be installed either behind the switch or at the ceiling rose, though if at ceiling rose you will have extra cables to install from the switch to get the dimming at the switch function.

A neutral is recommended whether at the switch or at the ceiling rose

With the neutral you may not need the bypass
 
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Amaster

Standard Member
The switches must be used with a Shelly module and dimmable LED bulbs to be able to use them at the switch location. The shelly Dimmer 2 is 230v so the led fittings need to be 230v

What do you have at the moment ?

The Shelly dimmer can be installed either behind the switch or at the ceiling rose, though if at ceiling rose you will have extra cables to install from the switch to get the dimming at the switch function.

A neutral is recommended whether at the switch or at the ceiling rose

With the neutral you may not need the bypass
Thankyou for your reply

at the moment we have nothing as we gutted the property and refurbished, i will be buying new switches and light fittings and bulbs.

i have sorted the light fittings with dimmable LED bulbs but you specified 230v is that something a need to check on or is it not standard that they work at this voltage?

how easy or hard is it for the electrician to run a neutral from each switch?
 
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Seb Briggs

Well-known Member
Most fittings are 230v but there are also low voltage versions as well 24v so worth checking

running a neutral to the switch should be straightforward for the electrician but get ready for an argument with them when they don’t want to 😀
 
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Seb Briggs

Well-known Member
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Amaster

Standard Member
Thankyou

if there was a circuit I didn’t want to use a Shelly dimmer then would I need anything extra to allow the dimming from the switches directly? (What is the switchDIM?)
 
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Seb Briggs

Well-known Member
Yes you would need a different dimmer module that works with a retractive switch

Never heard of a SwitchDIM but suspect they mean a dimmer module
 
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Amaster

Standard Member
just recieved this advice from scolmore on retractive switches can anyone translate this into more plain english if i am going to be using the shelly dimmer 2 module for all of my circuits?


From Scolmore:
"Using retractive switches for dimming is dependent on the type of LED driver that is used. Not all LED lights can be dimmed with just the switch. If the drive states “Switch Dim” then they normally use retractive switches for control.

With conventional dimmers, you can only have one dimmer in a circuit if the lights (or set of lights) are being controlled from more than one location.

If you are switching from two locations, you also need to use 2-way switches for both the plain switches and dimmers (many dimmers are 2-way compatible). You can only have one dimmer on the circuit.

Our 2-way and 3-way retractive switches are standard push to make type and should work in most applications. Please check with the lighting manufacturer for details on compatibility."


its left me confused again.

I will be buying dimming LED bulbs for all of my lights I was hoping to use the shelly dimmer module instead of buying a seperate LED driver with dimming if that still works.

regarding the 2 way controlled lights I have 2 sets
1) outdoor lights controlled from two locations (i was hoping to have simple on/off 2 way retractive switches) do I need anything special from the switches in terms of set up?
2) stairwell light controlled from 2 locations, I wanted to dim with 3 way retractive switches at both locations, is this still possible?
 
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Amaster

Standard Member
Yes all possible is the simple answer

do you have neutral at the switch location
not currently to the switch but he said he can do something to change the wires at the ceiling rose to allow a neutral to the dimmer module if we put all the dimmer modules there instead of directly behind the switch, would the same wiring diagrams you have posted here and on the shelly dimmer thread work for that set up?

my electrician was asking if you know of a shelly support number or email for someone he can contact just to discuss if you know of anyone?
 
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AndreNewman

Active Member
just recieved this advice from scolmore on retractive switches can anyone translate this into more plain english if i am going to be using the shelly dimmer 2 module for all of my circuits?


From Scolmore:
"Using retractive switches for dimming is dependent on the type of LED driver that is used. Not all LED lights can be dimmed with just the switch. If the drive states “Switch Dim” then they normally use retractive switches for control.
I got similar from them, they are just covering themselves against people who buy the retractive switches, wire them to conventional dimmers or direct to lights and wonder why the lights flash when you press the button and don't stay on! :-O

The dual retractives are great if you have Shelly dimmers everywhere but it's a great deal easier if they are installed at the switch not at the rose. You need two switch wires from the rose, one for fade up one for fade down, if you have two wires one of them might as well be a neutral! There are also stories on the Shelly forums of people getting interference on the long wires and having spurious ons offs and flickers (lots of on offs).

I have some of the Scolmore dual retractives but I think I'm going to standardise on single retractives everywhere, it's a lot less confusing for visitors, I'm planning ahead for the end of lockdown...

Even if you don't use the switches to control the dimmer, the slow fade up fade out is really pleasant and night mode on the dimmer is fantastic for those of us you get up in the dark hours for a pee or to get ready for work. Circadian lighting it's called, it's a wonderful thing, I will be putting Shelly Dimmers on all our lights just for that.

Edit: sorry I might be the cause of the out of stock, with the price of the scolmore minigrids, I bought loads of every possibility to cover everything I could think of for now and future matching replacements. There are a few things on my order they haven't sent yet due to exhausted stock.
 
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Amaster

Standard Member
I got similar from them, they are just covering themselves against people who buy the retractive switches, wire them to conventional dimmers or direct to lights and wonder why the lights flash when you press the button and don't stay on! :-O

The dual retractives are great if you have Shelly dimmers everywhere but it's a great deal easier if they are installed at the switch not at the rose. You need two switch wires from the rose, one for fade up one for fade down, if you have two wires one of them might as well be a neutral! There are also stories on the Shelly forums of people getting interference on the long wires and having spurious ons offs and flickers (lots of on offs).

I have some of the Scolmore dual retractives but I think I'm going to standardise on single retractives everywhere, it's a lot less confusing for visitors, I'm planning ahead for the end of lockdown...

Even if you don't use the switches to control the dimmer, the slow fade up fade out is really pleasant and night mode on the dimmer is fantastic for those of us you get up in the dark hours for a pee or to get ready for work. Circadian lighting it's called, it's a wonderful thing, I will be putting Shelly Dimmers on all our lights just for that.

Edit: sorry I might be the cause of the out of stock, with the price of the scolmore minigrids, I bought loads of every possibility to cover everything I could think of for now and future matching replacements. There are a few things on my order they haven't sent yet due to exhausted stock.
Haha yes I went to order and the scolmore stuff is out of stock in many lines! So ordering the varilight instead as they are in stock. Prices were pretty equivalent anyway.
Should arrive this week and then need to get the electrician in to install.
 
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