Advice on avr upgrade

dollag

Well-known Member
I’m seeking some advice on what to do going forward.

Currently using my avr550 for both my music and movie needs; genuinely happy with the performance. Problem is I’ve upgraded my htpc which I use for gaming and due to hdmi 2.1, have plugged it directly to the TV and using arc for everything. I find myself using my pc or TV for everything so having eARC or getting a 2.1 compatible avr seems to be On the cards. The caveat is that whilst listening using roon on my pc, everything is converted to 48khz

I have no issue keeping my pc connected directly to the tv and using eARC as long as the avr I upgrade is roon certified so have come to the conclusion that I don’t really need hdmi 2.1. this begs the question, what do I do to obtain eARC? I did consider using a pi as an endpoint but the reality is what’s the point when there is avrs on the market that have this base covered.

shortlist:
Nad t778
arcam avr20
Arcam avr30

These both seem to be the logical choices and also throw in anthems latest range too although not sure if they are roon ready. One issue is the onngoing issues they’ve had, although I believe they have been rectified.

An alternative solution I’ve been considering is that I get something like a denon 3600 avr, along with a Lyngdorf tdai 3700. This is a more expensive solution but am willing to commit if the benefits are worth it. My use case is 50/50 so a good stereo amplifier wouldn’t be wasted, and being roon ready, can just slot in and cover all my music needs.

My biggest issue is room eq and the integration of using the 3400. Set up audyssey and bypass l&r whilst setting to full range would allow the 3400 to manage my mains and 2 subs. My concern is the LCR and how this would affect the lcr stage with room perfect doing lfe and mains whilst audyssey is managing the rest?

Would doing this be compromising the surround experience in any way rather than using a dedicated receiver and allowing Dirac to manage everything ?

Any feedback, experience would be appreciated
 

Tom @ Cinehome

Well-known Member
AVForums Sponsor
We have done a lot of integrations with AVR’s and the Lyngdorf TDAI’s. The combination of a TDAI 3400 and a Denon AVR will give you superb results for two channel and perfect sub integration along with excellent surround performance. This is a very logical way of proceeding and doesn’t compromise two channel performance.

Audyssey can be turned off for the Fronts allowing for only RP correction to these channels which is ideal.

The Anthem AVR’s are very stable now and do give excellent performance if a single box AVR is preferred.

Drop me a message if I can assist further.

Best, Tom
 

techted

Active Member
Watching this thread as am interested in people’s suggestions.

Just realised that when a PlayStation 5 is connected via an Arcam 850 to an HDR capable display, the PS5 can’t detect that the display is HDR/VRR capable. Works OK when the PS5 is connected directly to the display (an LG OLED C9). Wasn’t an issue with the PS4. I reckon it must be the HDMI 2.0 ports on the Arcam.
 

ShanePJ

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
If you are looking at the Arcam's as a one box solution, then you will be better looking towards the AV21 and AV31 as these have the latest HDMI board

You have many options available to you depending upon which direction you wish to route your system. As @SeanBrothers mentions, you can attach another box which should work as expected (although I haven't tried one and we know that Arcam can be temperamental with untested boxes, so if someone else has one working, then you should be safe)

As @Tom @ Cinehome has mentioned, you can also create a dual system which you can read more about the differing setups here. I've tried the Lyngdorf at home and its extremely good and for stereo will better that of your Arcam as I had an Arcam AVR600 at home when testing it musically with a Teac UD-501 taking care of the musical side using a HDCP and using the USB into the Lyngdorf produced an identical reproduction as my two boxes (which was a fantastic ability, as the combo with my speakers produced something quite special)

Denon are seen as a great system for cinema, but a little lacking for musicality whiles Arcam are seen as the best for both Worlds, But I'd say that using a USB DAC for music which uses its own drivers and not the generic driver will make a difference with musical playback. With video playback, this won't help you one bit though which means tis a none starter for you (but just a future upgrade path if wanted in the future)

I'd say that if you want a one box solution, then the latest Arcam's are certainly the right option for you although if you're after full fat HDMI bandwidth, then you'll still have to look at another brand as it seems they max out at 40Gbit's (as detailed in the manual) although this shouldn't be a problem as it also works with VRR (Variable Rate Refresh), ALLM (Auto Low Latency Mode), QMS (Quick Media Switching) and QFT (Quick Frame Transport) which is really what's import for your needs using a HTPC for gaming requirements and as far as I'm led to believe nothing apart from the odd projector will work at 48Gbit/s

Out of interest, what hardware/software are you using. I guess you are the latest chipsets in order to access the latest HDCP 2.1 certification
 

Tom @ Cinehome

Well-known Member
AVForums Sponsor
I’m seeking some advice on what to do going forward.

Currently using my avr550 for both my music and movie needs; genuinely happy with the performance. Problem is I’ve upgraded my htpc which I use for gaming and due to hdmi 2.1, have plugged it directly to the TV and using arc for everything. I find myself using my pc or TV for everything so having eARC or getting a 2.1 compatible avr seems to be On the cards. The caveat is that whilst listening using roon on my pc, everything is converted to 48khz

I have no issue keeping my pc connected directly to the tv and using eARC as long as the avr I upgrade is roon certified so have come to the conclusion that I don’t really need hdmi 2.1. this begs the question, what do I do to obtain eARC? I did consider using a pi as an endpoint but the reality is what’s the point when there is avrs on the market that have this base covered.

shortlist:
Nad t778
arcam avr20
Arcam avr30

These both seem to be the logical choices and also throw in anthems latest range too although not sure if they are roon ready. One issue is the onngoing issues they’ve had, although I believe they have been rectified.

An alternative solution I’ve been considering is that I get something like a denon 3600 avr, along with a Lyngdorf tdai 3700. This is a more expensive solution but am willing to commit if the benefits are worth it. My use case is 50/50 so a good stereo amplifier wouldn’t be wasted, and being roon ready, can just slot in and cover all my music needs.

My biggest issue is room eq and the integration of using the 3400. Set up audyssey and bypass l&r whilst setting to full range would allow the 3400 to manage my mains and 2 subs. My concern is the LCR and how this would affect the lcr stage with room perfect doing lfe and mains whilst audyssey is managing the rest?

Would doing this be compromising the surround experience in any way rather than using a dedicated receiver and allowing Dirac to manage everything ?

Any feedback, experience would be appreciated
Regarding integration of the 3400 and a Denon, we have done a lot of these and it works extremely well. We run RoomPerfect, with the Denon set to FL/FR Bypass, no sub(s), first and then run Audyssey. The results are fantastic in simple terms. The 3400 is a superbly flexible amplifier and will absolutely deliver in spades for music over an ARCAM AVR. If music is important to you, this is the way to go. Good as the Arcam AVR's are, you will still be compromising music performance over the combination of a 3400 and a Denon AVR.

Best, Tom
 

ShanePJ

Distinguished Member
AVForums Sponsor
Its funny how we all hear things differently @Tom @ Cinehome. I'd say the Lyngdorf 3400 sounds almost identical in my home setup as using my Teac UD-501 and Arcam. The sound was fantastic on both and virtually indistinguishable to my ears (although lets not forget the Teac was doing the musical processing with the Arcam just adding the power). I have to also admit I preferred the setting to bypass on the Lyngdorf as I could hear little indescrepencies with musical reproductions which my speakers failed to reproduce with room correction on, but I cannot take anything away from Lyngdorf as their room correction is the best I've ever heard to date, I'm just very finical and preferred not using it

So, I guess the expectations are not as clear cut and maybe more suggestive to the individuals ear. I guess it also depends upon the level of toys being partnered to. I have to say that if it's a one box solution @dollag, then using an external DAC into the Arcam will produce the same results (if the DAC is up to the job) speaking from experience if the Arcam fails to deliver the musical expectations you wanted. I will add I also use SOtM tX-USBexp USB cards within my HTPC and I feel this helps massively with PC noise filtering into the DAC
 

Steve356

Distinguished Member
I've not heard the latest Arcam AV21 or 31, but suspect they are very similar in terms of performance to the outgoing 20 and 30, of which I've heard the 30. Personally I thought the sound signature was very similar to my Arcam AVR850. In my room, my Lyngdorf 3400 is vastly superior to the stereo performance of my 850. The 850 is very decent compared to other AV amps at a similar price, but it simply can't compete with the 3400. Add on RoomPerfect, which for me yields significantly better results than Dirac has ever been able to achieve and I've been very happy with the performance of system for quite a while now.

Note, I've also tried a Denon 8500 and a Anthem 1120 connected with the 3400 with similar results.

So I have to agree with Tom on this one, based on my various testing at home. Rooms, our ears and our listening habits can be very different of course.
 

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