Active or passive? Multiroom?

Active speakers can do a very good job, but you have to understand what you are getting. These tend to be Single Purpose speakers. That is, they typically have a single input, and they typically do NOT have a Remote Controls. So in a Music or Home Theater system, they need some type of generally expensive Pre-Amp to expand the number of inputs and give you remote control of the volume. Off the top of my head, the only Pre-Amps I can think of tend to run about £800.

Sorry I don't quite understand you. Except for the wireless inputs the SA Saxo 5 has 2 x optical, 1 x analog 3,5 mm stereo-jack and 1 x analog stereo-RCA. The Yamaha NX-N500 has optical, Ethernet, a 3.5mm mini-jack input and a Type-B USB port. I play from the laptop, my phone and maybe the TV, each with their own volume controls. Would that be a problem?

On the Sonos Website, the question was asked, which is better, TWO Play:1 or ONE Play:5? Sonos said 1 Play:5 is better, more and larger speakers with deeper bass.

I checked these out in the store today and man are they small! Can't judge them until I've tried it in my own home, but I find it hard to believe that a single Play:5 would provide enough bass in a normal sized living room. Actually I'm almost positive it won't. It's just too small.

But don't spend a fortune on something you will rarely use. How often will you really need the same music playing in every room? Chance are you son in his bedroom wants different music than you wife in the kitchen, and yourself in the main room. That probably represents how the system will most often be used.

I'm sure that's what it will be in a couple of years. But as of now, I'd play the same in both rooms. Flexibility is definitely a factor

There is a Sonos:Connect:Amp that has a decent amp built in. You could use this in the lounge on the main system. The Sonos:Connect:Amp does have an additional set of Analog Inputs, but it is meant to be a streaming device, so the Network connection is the main input.

That means if you intend to use this with your TV for TV/Movies, then you will need an additional DAC (digital to analog converter). Today most TVs only have Digital Output. These can cost anything from £25 up to £500 and more.

Ok, doesn't sound appealing at all.

Or for about £530 you could have the Yamaha RN602 Network Receiver with DAC and a decent pair of Passive Bookshelf Speakers.

If you have an existing main stereo system, and you want to upgrade incrementally, then adding Sonos Connect to the existing system, and later adding the Sonos Play in the kitchen and other rooms as needed, would probably be the best choice.

However, if you are starting with essentially nothing, then the Yamaha RN602 plus speakers, and a separate independent system in the kitchen is the best choice for limited money.

Yeah, this option is definitely alive. But if I go for the amp+passive option I'll probably skip Sonos and connect the different speakers with a Chromecast instead. I actually bought a nice bluetooth speaker for the kitchen today thats sound really good: Audio Pro Addon T5 review

If it's a temporary or permanent solution I don't know. But it fills today's kitchen needs. Living room's next.
 
You haven't indicated the layout of your Living Room - that will likely guide you to the type of speakers to consider.

I imagine many of the 'active' speaker options within your budget are going to work well if you are sitting close to them - as you would in a 'studio' type setup.

Not convinced I'd use a pair of PLAY:1, 3 or 5 as my 'main' speaker system - great for bringing music into rooms around the house but not my main system.

If your Living Room system is to cater for the Optical Out of your TV it would be good if your Amp has a User adjustable Digital Audio delay to ensure you have the ability to keep Video and Audio in sync.

Yamaha MusicCast is a good option to SONOS - you could use the Networked Amp BlueWizzard suggests and add in MusicCast streamers (similar to SONOS PLAY devices) in other Zones.

Joe

It's 3,5x6m, and I'll essentially be 6 m from the speakers most of the time. And after seeing the Sonos play:5 in the store today I find it hard to believe that one of those small boogers would be able to fill my room with enough bass.

I'd rather go soundbar+sub than excellent-sounding-but-to-small-stereo-speakers. I'm sure there's a good option out there
 
Room/Room Layout - is where your discussion should start not end up back at, though that is often the way as folk get tied up early in kit choices :)

Use scenario - again a good place to start and from experience I'd say folk change their listening habits quite markedly once they have the capability to 'zone' music around the house. Folk agonise over the cost of a two zone system then quickly add more Zones as they find how much use they get out of a system once they take that initial step.

TV/Music system - I wouldn't use a PLAY:5 or 2x PLAY:5 and personally I'd be unlikely to use a PLAYBAR + SUB (in preference to an Amp with HDMI/Digital Inputs + a decent pair of Speakers or Speakers + Sub*) though we have many customers who do and are more than happy with how it sounds and the ease of use of the system.

*I prefer the flexibility of the Amp + Speakers + (where required) a Sub, even though it is a less 'compact' solution.

Yamaha MusicCast is an option, to SONOS, as the Main system can be Soundbar or AVR/Stereo Amp based and then add additional Zones using MusicCast Zone Players as and when required.

There are plenty of small loudspeakers which produce a 'big' sound or blend well with a decent compact sub - the Yamaha MCR-N870D is part of the MusicCast range and whilst the speakers (NS-BP401) are pretty compact they produce a big sound (without having to revert to a Sub).

We have installed/supplied that system using Optical Out from a connected TV and no complaints so far - MCR-N870D - Overview

Joe
 
Joe (Joe Fernand) has a point. The goal isn't to find Zone or Streaming equipment, but to find Zone or Streaming equipment that works for you in your circumstances with your budget and in your space. But, for us to make good recommendations, we need to know the circumstance, budget, and a sense of the layout and the spaces.

You need to understand what it is you want to accomplish in each space. For a main system, I'm always going to go for a full size Amp and Speakers. However, for secondary spaces, lesser systems are workable but you have to take those spaces and their demands into consideration.

I would not use Play:5 or even two Play:5 in my main space, but in a bedroom, home office, kitchen, or other secondary space, they would work fine.

You have to understand yourself, your space, and your requirements to know what equipment best suits the task.

You can't get what you want until you know what you want.

Which echos the sentiment already stated. The more you and we understand the space and the circumstances, the better and more suitable recommendations we can make.

Steve/bluewizard
 
There's one thing I still don't understand. What do I gain in choosing one of the "streaming" amps you suggest compared to buying a simple amp and connect it to an apple TV or chromecast?

If I'm going amp-choice, it should have DTS/Atmos or whatever is the latest surround solution. Ie an "All Inclusive amp".

I'll either go amp - and if I do, I'll connect it to 5.1/5.0 and and possibility to stream music from my phone (built in or something connected to it doesn't matter, will be hidden anyway).
Or I skip the amp, and focus only on streaming music from my phone. And then I'll probably buy a soundbar to the TV some day, and keep that separated from the music system.
 
'I've been spending a couple of days reading now and I feel like I'm banging my head in a wall over and over...' - I think a few folk are feeling that trying to keep up with your requirements :)

I think first choice has to be your Music Streaming Source - you said earlier on that your current system is inconsistent, that is where the likes of SONOS, MusicCast or HEOS will come in and potentially offer you consistency plus the ability to grow the system (additional Zones) as required.

If you want to include Surround Sound/Immersive Sound in the capabilities list for the main Zone Amplification an AVR is your only real option - even if you initially use it as a Stereo amp.

A MusicCast or HEOS enabled AVR will give you the option to grow the system and have a common platform across all Zones - likewise you could add a SONOS CONNECT to any AVR and then add additional SONOS Zone Players in your secondary Zones.

I've never used my Phone as a 'Source' though do use it as the Controller of my music streaming - my phone is too busy with calls, messages, notifications etc to be a realistic 'source'.

Joe
 
Ed and Phil mentioned on the podcast this week how audio solutions today are so different to a decade ago it's almost unrecognisable. I'm 100% behind Phil when he suggests a NAS is part of a modern solution today, where the likes of Sonos, Bluesound, MusicCast will all be able to grab local content. And Joe's right, using a phone as a primary source is probably stretching things a little too far IMO, but as a controller, simply brilliant. So much so that Sonos haven't done a stand-alone controller in years!

My advice is to look for an ecosystem first. There are many to choose from, all of which have plus and negative points. For instance, Sonos doesn't play with Bluetooth or AirPlay so can be limiting getting sounds from apps to work which is more limiting than you first think. Bluesound is supremely expensive. MusicCast is growing in popularity and individual product solutions, and would probably get my vote now, although I myself have gone the Sonos route. Sometimes I wish I hadn't, but it's a very strong reliable contender, and that's so key.

BTW, Sonos Play 5 will fill your main room with (reasonable, not deep) bass as a stereo pair. They are astounding when 'tuned'. But like others have said before, I still wouldn't, it's too limiting.
 
First, I'd definitely make use of Sonos' excellent 100 day trial. If you don't think they're worth the money - just send them back. You haven't lost any money.

If you do, then great - you've just saved yourself some time!

Edit:

The Sonos Play 5 definitely provide enough bass for your sized room. I used to work in John Lewis (a department store here in the UK) and would use the Play 5 we had on demo as my morning music source (before the shop opened of course) and the bass was substantial, given the size of the speaker and room (if you can call a shop floor a room).
 
the only source I need is my phone. I'm thinking bluetooth is fine, but if I want to be able to play the same music in both rooms (which surely will be multiple rooms in the future), I need some way of connecting them.

Did you consider Dayton wireless, yet ?

The Dayton Audio Sub-Link XR is a versatile audio transmitter system to use with subwoofer, surround speakers, second zone speakers, or feed TV audio to an amplifier, wirelessly.

With a single transmitter connected to the headphone output of the cell phone
the same sound can be received by max 3 x Dayton receivers,
see the video on the link below on how it works:

"Dayton Audio Sub-Link XR 2.4 GHz Wireless Audio Transmitter Receiver System for Subwoofers" from www.parts-express.com!


hth
 
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As others have said if you want consistency you have to choose the right system first whether it's Sonos, MusicCast, HEOS, Bluesound etc. Then it can be tailored to multi-room functions regarding the size and layout of your rooms. For your main listening space I'd use an amp and speakers, as you want bass presence, of which there has been numerous suggestions on this thread.
As you have an Audio Pro Addon T5 maybe look at their products which includes a bookshelf and floorstanding speakers plus a subwoofer:
Link 1 - Audio Pro
 
Sorry for the late reply, I stopped getting emails notifications for some reasons.
This post is very interesting, but there are a few things I don't quite understand.

Ed and Phil mentioned on the podcast this week how audio solutions today are so different to a decade ago it's almost unrecognisable. I'm 100% behind Phil when he suggests a NAS is part of a modern solution today,

Why do you need a NAS? Isn't a NAS just a device that I transfer files such as ripped CD's etc. from? Sure I have a bunch of old mp3's on my laptop that would free up space if transfered, but not worth buying an additional device for.. What am I missing?

And Joe's right, using a phone as a primary source is probably stretching things a little too far IMO,

Why is that? You always carry it with you, you can stream just about any song and podcasts. What's missing?

Sonos doesn't play with Bluetooth or AirPlay so can be limiting getting sounds from apps to work which is more limiting than you first think.

So what do you mean, does the Sonos transfer only work with specific apps? I thought it was like airplay; just swipe up a menu on your phone, choose Sonos and whatever you play will be transferred. I always thought Sonos was king of simplicity, so please do explain in what ways it's not.

BTW, Sonos Play 5 will fill your main room with (reasonable, not deep) bass as a stereo pair. They are astounding when 'tuned'. But like others have said before, I still wouldn't, it's too limiting.

I'm not looking for a bass that hits the chest so deep you can't think of anything else (although I love that feeling), but considering I'm mostly listening to house/deep house/techno it need to be quite strong. And for the price of two Sonos play:5 I expect to be impressed not only by sound quality, but also by bass. With that said, I'm thinking Sonos wouldn't be my best choice.
 
First, I'd definitely make use of Sonos' excellent 100 day trial. If you don't think they're worth the money - just send them back. You haven't lost any money.

If you do, then great - you've just saved yourself some time!

Edit:

The Sonos Play 5 definitely provide enough bass for your sized room. I used to work in John Lewis (a department store here in the UK) and would use the Play 5 we had on demo as my morning music source (before the shop opened of course) and the bass was substantial, given the size of the speaker and room (if you can call a shop floor a room).

Thanks, I didn't know they had a trail policy.
 
Sorry for the late reply, I stopped getting emails notifications for some reasons.
This post is very interesting, but there are a few things I don't quite understand.



Why do you need a NAS? Isn't a NAS just a device that I transfer files such as ripped CD's etc. from? Sure I have a bunch of old mp3's on my laptop that would free up space if transfered, but not worth buying an additional device for.. What am I missing?
OK, a few CDs probably won't justify a NAS, but there are many music lovers who have hundreds, thousands, maybe even 10 thousand plus CDs. That's where ripping to lossless audio formats and storing on a NAS comes in.

That's not the only benefit. By virtue that they can store audio files, they can store any file type for access across a network from other computers and network devices. And modern NASes also run their own software packages so can act more or less like servers. Mine's also an Apple Time Machine backup repository, and CCTV system.


Why is that? You always carry it with you, you can stream just about any song and podcasts. What's missing?
SmartPhones aren't the most reliable source: fact! Just because you can doesn't mean it's the best approach. Other members have offered up suggestions of better approaches. Don't be so quick to dismiss them, but I understand convenience is very high on your agenda. Your approach works, and if that's good enough for you, that's fine also.

So what do you mean, does the Sonos transfer only work with specific apps? I thought it was like airplay; just swipe up a menu on your phone, choose Sonos and whatever you play will be transferred. I always thought Sonos was king of simplicity, so please do explain in what ways it's not.
Search for the Sonos controller and the Sonos app. You have to use the app, full stop. You can also get the app for Windows and MacOS to use on computers. On IOS, you can access your music and podcasts stored on the device. But what you cannot do is get other apps to route their sound through Sonos. There's a workaround: Use an AirPort Express, connect that to any of the Sonos devices that have Analog Audio In sockets, you can then get sound from apps.


I'm not looking for a bass that hits the chest so deep you can't think of anything else (although I love that feeling), but considering I'm mostly listening to house/deep house/techno it need to be quite strong. And for the price of two Sonos play:5 I expect to be impressed not only by sound quality, but also by bass. With that said, I'm thinking Sonos wouldn't be my best choice.
This sounds quite contradictory to me I'm afraid. Deep bass doesn't automatically mean loud. However the best advice is just as other members have said: get demos, test, understand the pros and cons of each solution, pick the best one to fit your needs. So go have a listen and see if it would work for you. The offer Sonos make over 120 days, in your room (and the room has the biggest influence on the sound) is quite compelling, but I'd probably make that your last test.

One last thing, I echo the sentiment of others that you're probably better served by non-smart speakers in the main listening space; and I use that term rather than active as that's something entirely different. With Sonos, you could choose a Connect with active speakers, or Connect Amp with passive, the latter also providing a subwoofer socket. The Connect Amp can be hidden away anywhere you like, and a subwoofer can also be placed out of sight depending on your room and a crawl test, etc. The reason is all about choice and upgrades. You can tailor the sound more specifically to what you're looking for with a choice of speakers. I think a subwoofer would work for you because it sounds to me as though you don't really want to have the floorstanders in the main room any more, but you could swap those out over time and go to book shelf speakers plus sub.

To re-iterate, I realise your goal isn't huge volume, but with your music choice, I'd suggest being able to reach the low depths of bass is absolutely essential, and I'd suggest a subwoofer would give you access to a compact system that's capable of reaching those depths. Even Q Acoustics Concept 500 only gets down to 41Hz, and my bass guitar has 5 notes that go lower than that with standard tuning, and I sometimes go lower still (low A)!
 
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The Sonos Connect or Connect Amp sound like good places to start. Then work out what to add and demo. Here's a more straightforward link for Audio Pro products if you are interested:

Search results for: 'audio pro' at Audio Affair
I should really have added this link above! It's a link from the Audio Pro website to UK retailers.
 
'Why do you need a NAS?' - you don't! Its simply far more convenient to have your Music on an 'always on' NAS than on a Laptop (unless you always plan to have the Laptop On and available to the music system).

'What's missing?' - interruption free playback, unless you are 'billy no mates' :)

SONOS PLAY:5 x2 vs. SONOS CONNECT + Stereo Amp + Pair of Loudspeakers - assuming a similar budget for both options they will both 'impress', where the latter has an advantage is you have more options to choose loudspeakers which suit your room (and or decor).

Joe
 

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