acourate: an audio toolbox

Thanks Matt! You're a star!

Very confused about the mic stuff. Uli said the XTZ should work. But I'll go with the tried and tested. Cheaper too!

As for the DAC options, now that is very interesting.

As a single box solution, I think the E28 is hard to beat. But I suspect I would still prefer the sound of the Hugo for stereo listening.

I thought about switching the 2 DAC sources. But its a bit clunky. Even if using 2 separate DACs for multichannel audio is possible, it seems like a waste of the E28.

The Lynx looks like a good compromise. Although spec wise is a bit below the Exasound and Chord.

Given I only have 5 speakers, the Aurora 8 with USB interface should be sufficient.

Its just a question if the soundfield will integrate between different DACs.

Hmmmm
 
The xtz mic will work for acourate, it's just a q of whether you want to take measurements outside of acourate that require a loopback connection. I like to have that capability & do use it quite a lot.

The other thing to bear in mind is whether your device has a mixer app and provide software loopback, doing a multichannel setup with acourate without a mixer app would be pretty tedious with all the cable swapping required. A mixer app means you can just leave the cables in place and then do the channel routing in software. This is another thing that is standard with pro audio kit but not with consumer kit.
 
Its just a question if the soundfield will integrate between different DACs.
not sure what you mean by this btw, I don't see how you can play the same track to 2 different DACs simultaneously
 
Argh! choices choices choices!

Yes, need to check out how Exasound's ASIO drivers work out. I thought there is a mapping function with Acourate?

I'm not 100% sure, but in JRiver couldn't you use different DACS for difference channels?

With the Pro Audio route, I presume I can route the main channels from say the Aurora to the Hugo via Optical SPDIF (I want to use the USB on the Hugo for stereo music streaming.)

Actually, with volume matching etc, I think will be too much of a hassle...
 
I thought there is a mapping function with Acourate?
let me give you an example to illustrate. Acourate is designed for 2 channel use so it always talks in terms of L and R. Lets say you generate a 2 way crossover, e.g. for a 2.1 setup. The filters are dumped out as files

XO1L48.dbl
XO1R48.dbl
XO2L48.dbl
XO2R48.dbl

to measure the system, you create a multiway wav from these files. This puts them into a wav file in channels 1-4 of that wav. You now want to measure with that crossover in place so you load the wav into the logsweep recorder, you now need your signal chain configured so that channel 1 goes to your sub, channel 2 to your sub, channel 3 to your L speaker and channel 4 to your R speaker.

Here's my mixer app

upload_2015-2-21_21-34-34.png


the bottom row contains the physical output channels and the bulk of the top row is the channels seen by the computer. Note on the right that there are a load of layouts listed (playback, Ac LR, Ac LSL and so on), Ac LR is selected. At the bottom AN 4 is highlighted, this is physically connected to my subwoofer power amp. Note how AN1 and AN2 in the top row have the sliders at the max. This means the software channels 1 and 2 will be routed to my subwoofer.

Now note that I've highlighted the AN 1 output, this is my L speaker. Note the AN 3 slider is maxed on the upper row. This means that the 3rd channel of that wav file will be routed to my L speaker.

upload_2015-2-21_21-37-1.png


Ac LC/Ac LSL/Ac LSR repeat this same pattern but route the R seen by acourate (AN 4 on the upper row) to the C/LSL/LSR as appropriate.

This would be quite painful without a mixing app, you'll be fiddling with cables for ages instead of just blasting through the measurements.

in JRiver couldn't you use different DACS for difference channels?
no, you can configure a single output devices (DACs) per zone. Therefore you could have a stereo zone and a multichannel zone and send the content to different DACs but if you are using the same speakers in each zone then you need to handle that from the DACs to the power amps somehow.

With the Pro Audio route, I presume I can route the main channels from say the Aurora to the Hugo via Optical SPDIF (I want to use the USB on the Hugo for stereo music streaming.)
I would think so yes though I guess it depends whether the hugo needs to be seen by the computer?
 
Hey Matt. Just taking it all in, life getting in the way etc. Will reply when I've digested everything.
 
I've spent way too much time in the last couple of months, since changing my sub, on measuring/listening/measuring/analysing results/repeat to fade. One rushed, slightly borked but not borked enough to be immediately obvious, measurement has led me thoroughly down a rabbit hole :)

Things I have uncovered along the way;

- how to use acourate to examine excess phase response (aka the phase response that is in excess of a minimum phase response)
- how to use that capability to linearise the phase response of a loudspeaker independently of its magnitude response
- how to properly measure on the basis of electronic correction of the speaker itself (no need to bake DSP into the speaker here, just tweak the XO and remeasure)
- how to do bass mgmt manually properly leveraging jriver DSP and my prepro to recover some gain lost in the DSP

I think I might just possibly be an intermediate acourate user at this point given that I know what about 20% of the menu items do and how to use them :D

I need to do some proper blind testing of a setup that has corrected the phase response of the speaker itself before then also correcting the room vs just correcting the room. It's quite hard to do this and level match though thus rendering all my sighted tests utterly invalid. I am pretty sure I'd need a week off with no family to get through that o_O

It's interesting how different things sound though when you really change your approach, you tune in a bass heavy mix and can kick back and enjoy the bass but other times you can end up with something quite sparkly and light (NB: my basic setup is quite repeatable at this point so it's only when you start playing with it that things change)
 
If you ever need assistance with the blind testing aspect you only have to ask. ;)
 
If you ever need assistance with the blind testing aspect you only have to ask. ;)
I have been working through lots of changes recently off the back of the bass management snafu noted on data-bass & also in prep for building some speakers. As a result so am almost at the point where it will be possible to do a blind test of

1) room correction only
2) as 1) but sub has LT applied (thus sub is theoretically "tighter")
3) as 2) but main speakers are amplitude corrected based on quasi anechoic response
4) as 3) but main speakers are also excess phase corrected based on quasi anechoic response

I would just need to work out how to actually execute as a level matched blind test to make it worthwhile :) If you're interested in being in a guinea pig then I'll let you know when I have that process worked out!

the purely subjective, totally sighted (i.e. don't trust me!) view is something has made a real difference reality in sharpness & clarity, the 2 changes are adding an analog gain stage to recover SW gain lost in the bass management (as opposed to attenuating other channels digitally) and running with option 4 above

I need (well "need" is relative but it's too late to complain about being OCD on this subject :)) to verify that the signal is preserved all the way through the signal chain still. I wired up a voltage divider into an RCA cable so I plumb my prepro output into a soundcard to verify this. Results when I get round to it :)
 
I'm all yours... :)

It might be most useful for you if you show me how to effect various changes (given that your equipment is out of sight to your MLP) and you make those judgments.
 
I'm all yours... :)

It might be most useful for you if you show me how to effect various changes (given that your equipment is out of sight to your MLP) and you make those judgments.
I think we can do it automatically in jriver using zoneswitch (ABX Testing and MC? I would just need to setup a few zones with the different filters (after testing that they are level matched correctly), create particles for each track we want to test against and then get my wife to rename the zones without me knowing which one is whic. I think that would work as an automated double blind test.
 
@mattkhan Just a quick update. Life's been hectic as usual.

But I've ordered the mic. I've booked a demo of the exasound e28 at the end of next week.

Will download drivers and see what its all about and look into purchasing the Acourate from Uli.
 
Mic is stuck in customs.

Exasound is stuck with TNT! Should finally receive it tomorrow.

Meanwhile JRiver trial period has expired <LOL.>
 
Been playing with the exasound e28 for a couple of hours. Very impressive. I always fel a bit underwhelmed with the Anthem when it comes to dramatic moments with a full orchestral score blasting in with all the effects. I have a monster power amp and floorstanders. So those can't be the problem. With the e28, all that is solved.

Yet unlike Yamaha AVRs, its not forced or piercing. Just feels like everything expanded.

The only issue now is how to integrate with Acourate.

The driver is ASIO and crude compared to the RME. It mainly runs through JRiver. Can't even see it on playback devices!

Maybe its the JRiver plugin. We'll see.

But with JRiver, I can do a channel offset, but not map individual channels. Looks like its cable switching or Dirac!
 
But with JRiver, I can do a channel offset, but not map individual channels. Looks like its cable switching or Dirac!
You can mix channels in jriver, drag the PEQ block before convolution and then add a "mix channels" entry to it. You can then choose to copy/move/swap channels. You can then add the PEQ2 block after convolution if you need to do anything to the output channels.
 
Being in London too, I'm sure you can hear that penny dropping in my hollow head!

So that's what its for. I can remap channels. Doh! Cool.

Thanks Matt!!!
 

The latest video from AVForums

Is 4K Blu-ray Worth It?
Subscribe to our YouTube channel
Back
Top Bottom