1. Join Now

    AVForums.com uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

A few simple questions

Discussion in 'Televisions' started by Pecker, Jul 31, 2005.

  1. Pecker

    Pecker
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2004
    Messages:
    22,114
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Huddersfield, People's Republic of Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +4,342
    1 - Has anyone seen a 1080p picture up against a 720p picture? If you have, was there as big a step up in difference as there is between PAL & 720p?

    2 - PAL 50 has been criticised for 'flicker'. Is the flicker problem noticeable on 720p/50 displays? Is it noticeable on 1080i/50 displays?

    3 - Have either BluRay or HD-DVD announced which format they'll be using on their discs (720p, 1080i, 1080p)?

    4 - What will Sky Boxes be outputting (720p, 1080i, 1080p)?

    5 - Have NTL said anything at all about HiDEf?

    Many thanks.

    Steve W
     
  2. Stephen Neal

    Stephen Neal
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2003
    Messages:
    6,080
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +681
    I've seen 1080/25p and 720/50p - but not at the same time, not on the same type of displays, and not of the same scene. I've also seen prototype 1080/50p material (though this was demonstrating compression systems)

    Can't make sensible comparisons because they weren't showing the same stuff and I wasn't thinking about comparison. Also - it would be unfair to compare 1080/25p with 720/50p on anything but static picture information, as the motion rendition of the two is very different.

    Do you really mean the difference between PAL and 720p or the difference between 576/50i component and 720p?

    The improvements of digital component over composite PAL are pretty obvious - even though they have the same number of lines...

    I think you mean that 50Hz systems (the PAL, SECAM or Digital component aspect is irrelevant) have often suffered from more visible "large area flicker" than their 60Hz relatives. However this is usually with relation to CRT displays - hence the development of 100Hz interlaced TVs (with all the appalling processsing this usually introduces)

    Plasmas and single-chip DLPs often actually display images at much faster refresh rates (they have sub-fields for grey scale and colour reasons) - and so the large area flicker is often at a rate higher than 50Hz - so less visible.

    LCDs still have response times that mean you don't see flicker, and the nature of LCD, DLP and Plasma is that they often don't display in the same way as CRT. However I have seen large area flicker on some plasmas.

    I think just as DVD can be 480/60i or 576/50i on disc, so there may well be a format choice for studios and disc producers, with the BluRay and HD-DVD camps allowing for more than a single format.

    AIUI both will allow 1080/24/25/30p and 1080/50i and 1080/60i - but neither cater for 1080/50p or 1080/60p. I think both also allow for 720/50p and 720/60p (not sure about 720/24/25/30p)

    I think I read that HD-DVD encapsulated 1080/24p as 1080/48i or 1080/60i - but this doesn't mean it is the same quality as 1080/48i or 1080/60i origination.
    Sky boxes will support 720/50p and 1080/50i broadcasts. There is no 1080/25p or 1080/50p support.

    What format broadcasters chose, and whether the box will cross-convert between formats remains to be seen. (Most US boxes cross-convert - allowing 720p and 1080i broadcasts received by the box to either be output natively, or cross converted to a fixed output of 720p or 1080i)

    Think they've announced a PVR with HD capable outputs - but haven't heard anything more on this.
     
  3. pjskel

    pjskel
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,676
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +124
    1-4 has been covered as well as it could by Setphen, but the answer to 5 is thus:
    NTL are 12 months (at least) behind Sky on HD - they spent their time getting VOD (video on demand) sorted as a priority. That and the Telewest merger.
    They are still yet to decide on delivery of HD - either via co-ax or broadband. With new improvements in ADSL+, this is an avenue open for investigation.
    PVR is due soonish (could be next month, or end of year/start of next - nothing specified or committed to), but I don't believe there's HD outputs, unless it has all the decoding HW, which will be activated whent they start transmissions. Makes a good deal of sense, but then again, common sense and business decisions don't always go hand-in-hand, now do they?

    I will say one thing on Q's 1-4 - forget or cease worrying about 1080p. If it ever makes an appearance, it's way off in the distance. 720p is the main HD signal you'll need to concern yourself with. Certainly 1080 panels like that of the Sharp GD1 at £4.5K aren't likely to be had for £2K for at least another 3-5 years, IMO anyway.
     
  4. Pecker

    Pecker
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2004
    Messages:
    22,114
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Huddersfield, People's Republic of Yorkshire
    Ratings:
    +4,342
    Cheers.

    So, the general consensus of opinion appears to that:

    - 720p is just around the corner

    - 1080i isn't necessarily that much better (if at all) than 720p

    - 1080p may never happen on broadcasts & HD-DVD/Blu Ray. If it does, it's as far away as hoverboards

    The implication is that buying 720p is a sound bet. Or have I missed something?

    Steve W
     
  5. pjskel

    pjskel
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,676
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Location:
    UK
    Ratings:
    +124
    Pretty much spot on. Only worry about 1080p if or when it becomes a de facto standard on broadcast or pre-recorded material. Until then, enjoy the marvel of 720p - or just enjoy it period. Let others worry about having cutting edge.
     

Share This Page

Loading...