Question A Choice of 3 Very Different Cameras

I've been into photography for many years with my first DSLR being the Canon EOS 10D but in recent years I admit that my photography has taken a back seat. This is for 2 reasons.

1. I took up another hobby which takes up a fair amount of my free time and a lot of my money.

2. Before I started the other hobby I found that I was getting increasingly disappointed in the quality of my photos, just finding that they lacked detail. This is not surprising seeing as I'm only using a Canon EOS 30D.

I've stuck with this camera for the simple reason that I've never been able to afford to upgrade it. When the 5D MKIII was released I knew that this was the camera I wanted but there is no way on Earth I can afford it, even second hand.

I've been looking around at finance deals and have made a short list of 3 cameras that I could probably afford to get. Before I list them though, this is the type of photography I do.

I own 3 lenses, Sigma 10-20, Sigma 24-70 f/2.8, Canon 70-200 f/2.8 L USM. I rarely use the Canon but would never part with it as it's stunning! 90% of the time the 10-20mm lens is on my camera. The 24-70 is my 'general stuff' lens but I'd love (but again can't afford) to replace this with a Canon 24-105 f/4 L USM.

I'm also quite keen on shooting 35mm film still (I know, I know) and in doing this it made me realise that going for a full frame DSLR was probably a good idea, but not without it's downsides too.

If I'm going out to take photos then I tend to shoot mostly landscape, architectural and street photography. One of the things though I don't like about using the 10-20mm is how soft it is at the edges but I do like how wide it is. I do occasionally shoot some sport but very rarely and only for my own amusement. I do shoot wildlife but it's not exactly wild but in a Zoo. Whilst I do own a speedlight I hate using flash and much prefer to whack up the ISO. I really only use flash creatively unless I have no other choice.

I do tend to shoot in burst mode quite a bit but from memory I think that the 30D only does something like 4fps and to be honest most times thats enough but a bigger buffer would be useful. The number of AF points isn't really an issue for me, I only ever use 1 anyway.

So on to the cameras.

I've boiled it down to:

1. Canon EOS 6D

2. Canon EOS 7D MKII

3. Canon EOS 70D

Admittedly 3 very different cameras.

Canon EOS 6D
Pros:
Full frame
Good High ISO Performance

Cons:
No built in flash
Slow burst mode
Seems like a bit of a basic camera in comparison to the others (perhaps I'm wrong)
Only Digic 5 processor

If I bought the 6D I'd obviously have to sell my 10-20 but then maybe I could sell the 10-20 and 24-70 and buy the 24-105 f/4. Admittedly 24mm isn't as wide as 10mm even allowing for the crop factor and if I'm honest I would end up wanting to buy the 16-35 f/2.8 (but the wife would kill me if I did) but I could 'live' with 24mm for some time.

Canon EOS 7D MKII
Pros:
High burst speed
Digic 6 Processor
Good AF system

Cons:
High ISO performance not as good as FF cameras

Canon EOS 70D
Pros:
Much cheaper than the others
Reasonable burst speed
ISO Performance not far off that of the 7D MKII in the same ranges

Cons:
ISO range not that wide
Only Digic5+ processor

Which would you go for if you were me?
 

snerkler

Member
It's a tough call this one. I would probably opt for the 6D as it has the better DR (although typically low), decent colour depth and the best noise handling. I say this as, from what you're saying having the best autofocus system isn't as important to you. If it were I'd opt for the 7DII.

I'm guessing you're absolutely stuck on Canon?
 

newbie1

Distinguished Member
If budget is the main concern then I would go for the 70d. I have used it, it's a great all rounder.
 
Hmm think I'm coming down on the 6D a bit more. Just been looking on Flickr at full sized photo from all three cameras and when pixel peeping the 6D was the only one where I thought "yeah that looks good". Photos from the 7D MKII and 70D 'all' seemed to show the same lack of definition that my 30D has albeit that of course the overall photos are way better than my 30D. I just wish the 6D had a slightly bigger buffer and a built in flash.
 

newbie1

Distinguished Member
if you stretch to it then go for the full frame! try second hand to save some cash....
 

snerkler

Member
Hmm think I'm coming down on the 6D a bit more. Just been looking on Flickr at full sized photo from all three cameras and when pixel peeping the 6D was the only one where I thought "yeah that looks good". Photos from the 7D MKII and 70D 'all' seemed to show the same lack of definition that my 30D has albeit that of course the overall photos are way better than my 30D. I just wish the 6D had a slightly bigger buffer and a built in flash.
I never use my built in flash, built in flash is awful :p
 

1080 jawbreaker

Well-known Member
as for the canon 24-105, you might want to consider the sigma as a cheaper option
 

denno75uk

Well-known Member
...I'm only using a Canon EOS 30D.

If I'm going out to take photos then I tend to shoot mostly landscape, architectural and street photography. ...I do shoot wildlife but it's not exactly wild but in a Zoo. Whilst I do own a speedlight I hate using flash and much prefer to whack up the ISO. I really only use flash creatively unless I have no other choice.

I do tend to shoot in burst mode quite a bit but from memory I think that the 30D only does something like 4fps and to be honest most times thats enough but a bigger buffer would be useful. The number of AF points isn't really an issue for me, I only ever use 1 anyway.

So on to the cameras.

I've boiled it down to:

1. Canon EOS 6D

2. Canon EOS 7D MKII

3. Canon EOS 70D

Which would you go for if you were me?

So, apart from your lenses, this is EXACTLY the position I'm currently in. Pros and cons for all three models and I'm seriously struggling to make up my mind.

I'm starting to think the 70D would be a significant enough upgrade, better than my 30D in every conceivable way, with the main selling point being its price.

The 6D has the best ISO and my understanding is that its centre AF point (like you I shoot exclusively centre) is as sensitive at low light as the 7DMkii. I also have lenses that would be compatible, though I'd want a better everyday lens at some point in the future.

The 7DMkii is the camera that I lusted after on its release. It's top of its range. However, I do think its main selling point of the speed is perhaps going to be wasted on my general photography.

The 70D is the one I think I want the least, but I think it would be enough and I can't avoid that price. I keep thinking about what else I could buy with it for the same price as a body only option of the other two.
 
So, apart from your lenses, this is EXACTLY the position I'm currently in. Pros and cons for all three models and I'm seriously struggling to make up my mind.

I'm starting to think the 70D would be a significant enough upgrade, better than my 30D in every conceivable way, with the main selling point being its price.

The 6D has the best ISO and my understanding is that its centre AF point (like you I shoot exclusively centre) is as sensitive at low light as the 7DMkii. I also have lenses that would be compatible, though I'd want a better everyday lens at some point in the future.

The 7DMkii is the camera that I lusted after on its release. It's top of its range. However, I do think its main selling point of the speed is perhaps going to be wasted on my general photography.

The 70D is the one I think I want the least, but I think it would be enough and I can't avoid that price. I keep thinking about what else I could buy with it for the same price as a body only option of the other two.

It is a difficult choice because our cameras (30D) are so old anything new is going to be loads better. However the thing that made my choice clearer was this.

The biggest 'problem' I have with my 30D isn't it's speed, buffer size, fps, lack of live view, lack of video. It's that when I edit in Lightroom/Photoshop and view at 100% I see a lack of definition and loss of clarity. Now I realise and fully accept that you shouldn't really let this influence you because you never view one of your photos at 100% from a distance of a few inches. However I know it's there and also some of the tonal editing I like to do in Lightroom can make these 'inadequacies' more obvious.

I started looking at photos posted to Pixel Peepers and just about every photo I looked at shot on a 70D & 7DMKII still showed some of these artifacts. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying for a second that these are bad cameras or that photos taken on them are inferior. They absolutely aren't. In my opinion though they do exhibit the limitation or drawback or a smaller sensor. Those taken with a full frame sensor just didn't show these artifacts and so whilst the 7DMKII may be the better performer in terms of speed of operation for example, the 6D IMO, produced photos I think I will, finally, be happy with.

These are photos shot on a 70D

These are photos shot on a 7DMKII

These are photos shot on a 6D

To me the 6D just has less noise, more sharpness, clarity and definition. Yes the 5DMKIII is better in terms of performance BUT it's a heck of a lot more expensive. The 6D essentially is the same quality of image resolution and is still massively better than my 30D.
 

snerkler

Member
It is a difficult choice because our cameras (30D) are so old anything new is going to be loads better. However the thing that made my choice clearer was this.

The biggest 'problem' I have with my 30D isn't it's speed, buffer size, fps, lack of live view, lack of video. It's that when I edit in Lightroom/Photoshop and view at 100% I see a lack of definition and loss of clarity. Now I realise and fully accept that you shouldn't really let this influence you because you never view one of your photos at 100% from a distance of a few inches. However I know it's there and also some of the tonal editing I like to do in Lightroom can make these 'inadequacies' more obvious.

I started looking at photos posted to Pixel Peepers and just about every photo I looked at shot on a 70D & 7DMKII still showed some of these artifacts. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying for a second that these are bad cameras or that photos taken on them are inferior. They absolutely aren't. In my opinion though they do exhibit the limitation or drawback or a smaller sensor. Those taken with a full frame sensor just didn't show these artifacts and so whilst the 7DMKII may be the better performer in terms of speed of operation for example, the 6D IMO, produced photos I think I will, finally, be happy with.

These are photos shot on a 70D

These are photos shot on a 7DMKII

These are photos shot on a 6D

To me the 6D just has less noise, more sharpness, clarity and definition. Yes the 5DMKIII is better in terms of performance BUT it's a heck of a lot more expensive. The 6D essentially is the same quality of image resolution and is still massively better than my 30D.
I still maintain that FF gives you more flexibility in PP too. It's hard to quantify, but I certainly notice it. I've just been away with my EM5-II and noticed the difference again (been a while since I've used it). Initially I thought I must have accidentally imported the JPEGs as JPEGs don't have the same control in pp, but then twigged on I was processing my Olympus RAWs and not my D750 RAWs :facepalm:
 

denno75uk

Well-known Member
I'm still struggling with the decision. As time goes on and I do more research, I think I'm narrowing it down to the 70D and 6D. I think the 6D is the camera I want, but the absolute desire I'd have to get a better wide-mid lens asap means the 6D would require more significant cash spending on top of the camera purchase. The 70D is obv significantly cheaper and a very capable camera.

But mainly, my other post still stands :confused:

This certainly isn't easy.

I think I need to get my hands on them. Have a feel. See if any just feel right. A friend has a 6D. I think I need a fondle.
 

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