800x600 versus 640x480

Discussion in 'Desktop & Laptop Computers Forum' started by Comer, Jul 16, 2002.

  1. Comer

    Comer
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    Hi all

    On an 800x600 projector how much difference shoukd I notice to picture sharpness/clarity if I run the pj at 640x480 instead of it's native 800x600?


    Thanks


    Conor
     
  2. rob_w

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    on my plus dlp it is clearest/sharpest at native (800x600)

    every other res shows scaling up by blurring (esp. text)

    cheers

    rob
     
  3. jonny m

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    comer
    Im running my mpact2 at 640x480 as its the only resolution i can get no tearing or judder.

    After viewing both I don't really see much difference, it is there just not that signifiant I find. which is just as well!

    j
     
  4. JSW

    JSW
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    Why would you want to run at a lower resolution ???
     
  5. rob_w

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    good point, jsw - i was thinking that!

    maybe to run games better on pj?


    let us know, comer:)

    btw, i use pj on 6`x4.5` screen and play defender @ 292 x 240 scaled and it looks fantastic!- res is not always important!

    rob
     
  6. Comer

    Comer
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    Why run at he lower resolution?

    Because I have a projector that does not seem to run best at it's native resolution (just don't figure). I have judder and tearing and I think that the judder is reduced and the tearing is eliminated at 640x480 but I reckon there is a slight loss of sharpness/clarity. It is very obvious on the likes of subtitles or copywrite warnings.

    i think that with this projector, this may just be the best that I'm gonna do. I was watching The Last Castle (good movie by the way) last night and the judder was driving me mad...mad I tell you, MAD! so (remembring somehing that jonny m posted recently) I changed the resolution to 640x480x16bit colour and I did not notice any more judder. However I did have the feeling that I has lost some sharpness in the image, what I'm wondering is wheather I really do notice a loss in sharpness or perhaps it's all in my mind (which over the past few years I have begun to trust less and less.)


    Well, you did ask



    Conor
     
  7. JSW

    JSW
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    ahhh so what your really saying is, your HCPC isn't up to the task of 800 x 600 !!!
     
  8. Comer

    Comer
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    No, what I'm saying is that my projector is not up to the task of 800x600.



    Conor
     
  9. JSW

    JSW
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    But thought your pj had a native resolution of 800 x 600 ???
     
  10. rob_w

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    there is definitely a loss of sharpness on text, however you may not really notice on films so i wouldnt worry too much - trust your eyes! - if you have to ask people whether it is less sharp or not then it cant be too bad!

    btw, what spec is your pc?


    rob
     
  11. Comer

    Comer
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    Yep but it seems to be a problem with my Toshiba projector and from what I can gather from this forum it is not pecular to just my toshiba but others also. It's a pity because my pj gives a very clear picture.

    Conor
     
  12. Comer

    Comer
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    Rob

    I'm running a PIII 600 with 256 RAM, Radeon 32 MB VE graphics, MAudia Delta Dio 24/96, Pioneer 106 DVD player with Theatretek software player. I have changed every haedware and software component on the PC, I pretty sure at this stage that it's the projector.


    Regards


    Conor
     
  13. JSW

    JSW
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    Sorry m8 but I think its your pc thats not up to it.

    I have a P3 1Ghz Laptop that can sometimes struggle with some dvd's.


    My main pc Athlon 1900XP with ati 8500 has no probs though.

    Do you use the pc for anything other than watching dvd's ???

    What speed is your hard drive ?? it can be a factor in slowing down performance.

    Have you tried watching dvd's through a monitor instead of the pj at 800 x 600 ??? do you still get tearing or is it all ok through a monitor ??

    Have you tried a different dvd software instead of theatretek ?

    Sorry for so many questions but only want to help.

    Cheers
    Bry
     
  14. rob_w

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    i`ve got to agree with jsw a bit, cos i`m running an athlon 850 and that can give grief on certain discs - usually not a prob though.

    make sure that no background tasks are running - going by your setup though i`m pretty sure you`ve researched the hcpc bits well and done all the obvious stuff

    i havent tried theatretek,but am wondering if it is hard on processors? - i know power dvd tears on my pc, whereas windvd runs great (most of the time. )

    rob
     
  15. Comer

    Comer
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    Thanks Guys

    But I've ben through all of this a hundred times. I've tried a P4 1.7, and an athlon 1.6 (or something like that, I forget) I have tried four DVd software players, three graphics cards, two DVD drives, more reformats than I can count, move drivers than I can count, absolutely nothing else running on the PC and it's always the same: tearing and judder. The only constant has been the projector. Also I run Theatretek with hardware acc on so that should take some of the pressure off the procesor

    I'm going to watch a full movie at 640x480 and see how I feel about the clarity and judder then

    Conor
     
  16. JSW

    JSW
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    Holy cow !!!

    Think i'd of changed the PJ by now.

    Having been through all you have sorry I cant be more helpfull :(
     
  17. Comer

    Comer
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    Thanks for the words of kindness and sympathy...but they are wasted for I am (for the first time in 12 months, since I bought the projector) a very very very happy man. I watched Behind Enemy Lines tonight for the second time, the first was at 800X600 about a couple of weeks ago and the stuttering and tearing absolutely ruined the movie for me. But I was impressed with the clarity of the image. Tonight I watched it at 640x480x16bit. still very impressed with clarity and no vertical banding (the curse of he Tosh MT1/3 projectors) But there was vertually no stutter and only once I noticed a flash of a tear on a column in the mess hall about half way through the movie.

    Yep, at last I happy with my picture quality...I just wonder how long it will last until something else crops up to drive me crazy.



    "What did the sadist do to the Masochist? "Nothing!" I hear u say, but you're wrong, he set up his home cinema kit to perfection!



    Bye



    Conor
     
  18. jonny m

    jonny m
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    Comer

    Good to see you've had some success at last:D

    You should be able to pull it off at 640x480x24 bit colour to give your pictures the extra edge.

    I think with your tosh's the chips they use to sample the analogue video signal are probably designed for max 720x576 at 60 htz sample rate, when running at 800x600 you exceed this and therefore the image tears.

    Im abit worried about the banding you mentioned with component input, as Im thinking of getting a pal prog player. Was it very noticable with your xcard?


    j
     
  19. Comer

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    Hi Jonny

    The vertical banding on the MT3 pj using any of the video inputs (composite, svideo and component) for me at least, makes the image unwatchable. I sent the pj back to Toshiba and they said that that's as good as it gets. In fact the engineer I spoke to said that he compared my pj to one from the box and that mine was much better. using a HCPC the banding is very indistinct.


    Regards

    Conor
     
  20. jonny m

    jonny m
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    Hey Comer,
    Are you still running at 640x480 if so does running at 16bit make a big difference from 24bit?

    Cheers
    John
     
  21. ROne

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    16bit or 32bit on the graphics card won't make any difference to PQ with regard to the video overlay.

    The overlay presents its data on top of windows screen graphics, irrespective of the bit depth.

    In fact there is a argument which says you should run in 16bit as there will be less overhead on the system, therefore less playback problems.

    Comer what's your take on this new ATI YUV dongle? I might try one, somebody will probably figure out how to get more than 480p from it.
     
  22. Comer

    Comer
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    Hi ROne

    I've tried the transcoder and the xcard and using the component input on the MT3 just doesn't cut it for me. I'll just stick with what I have (HCPC running at 640X480x16bit) until I'm in a position to change the projector in couple of years or so. The way things are going I expect to get, the by then equivalent of, the Sim2 HT300 for about £99.99 (and that will include two replacement bulbs:) )

    Conor
     
  23. ROne

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    Got to admit that my set up with the key digital YUV is pretty good, although not quite as good as the VGA mode. I just can't go there becauase of the tearing.

    I still do believe that its the VGA input that causes the problems.
     
  24. Comer

    Comer
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    Couldn't agree with you more, but as you said in another post, the difference (in my opion) between progressive component in and VGA in is "night and day". Night that is on Pluto and day on Mercury:)

    Conor
     
  25. Guest

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    Hi Comer,

    I had a Toshiba MT2, but sent it back because of the verticle line problem. They are sending me a MT3 for a replacement. I should get it today or tomorrow and I'll hook it up to a HTPC and see if I get any tearing. What resolution are you running? I assume you use 800 x 600 at 60hz? I'm interested if the increased lumens and contrast make that much of a difference over the MT2.

    If the MT3 is no better, I'm trading up to a Panasonis 75U.

    Scott
     
  26. Comer

    Comer
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    Scott

    One of the main complaints regarding the MT3 is that it's not really any improvement over the MT1/2. I hope that they are wrong regarding your new projector. I am running at 640X480X16 bit at 60Hz, if you read this full thread you will know why. The vertical line structure is hardly noticable using a HCPC but it is apalling using composite, svideo or component inputs.


    Let us know how you get on


    Conor
     

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