605 Crossovers HELP I'M CONFUSED!!

Discussion in 'AV Receivers & Amplifiers' started by steve69bez, Jan 24, 2008.

  1. steve69bez

    steve69bez
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    I have searched around the forums and have read mixed things about crossover settings, I have little knowledge of crossovers and what they should be and need some help,

    I have an Onkyo 605 connected to

    2x Gale 4040 Fronts:
    Power rating 120 Watt
    Impedance (nominal) 4- 8 Ohm
    Sensitivity for 2.83 V 90 dB
    Frequency response 39 - 20 kHz
    Driver details
    LF Driver 2x5.5” Woven Composite Cone /shielded motor assembly
    HF Driver 25mm soft dome
    Crossover 3 Way 1st Order

    Gale Centre 4050C:
    Power rating 80 Watt
    Impedance (nominal) 4- 8 Ohm
    Sensitivity for 2.83 V 87 dB
    Frequency response 80 - 20 kHz
    Driver details
    LF Driver 2x3.5” Woven Composite Cone
    HF Driver 19mm soft dome
    Crossover 1st Order

    Gale Subwoofer 4070:
    Power rating 65 Watt
    Sensitivity for 2.83 V 240mV for max output
    Frequency response 40 - 150 Hz
    Driver details
    LF Driver 8” long throw

    4x Gale Rears 3010S:
    Power rating 80 Watt
    Impedance (nominal) 8 Ohm
    Sensitivity for 2.83 V 85 dB
    Frequency response 90 - 20 kHz
    Driver details
    LF Driver 3.5” paper cone
    HF Driver 19mm soft dome
    Crossover 2 Way 1st Order


    My Audessey setup is this:
    Crossovers
    Speakers set to: 6ohms
    Fronts: Full Band
    Centre: 80hz
    Rears: 100hz
    Subwoofer: 80hz
    Deepbass: Off

    At the moment it sounds very good, and I must say I am very pleased with the gale speakers they have a real presence, but I am nitpicky and would like it to be set perfectly. Should my fronts be set to full band?, Will this damage them?
    Now, I have read that its best to have all the settings at 80hz, but it sounds a little flat, I have also heard that you should set the speakers to 10 or 20hz above the manufacturers lowest crossover specification, is it best to set the sub at 100hz? Please help my mind is boggled
     
  2. Andy98765

    Andy98765
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    Well looking at all the specs of the speakers the weakest are the rears as they do not start till 90Hz, on that information I personally would have the cross-over set to 120Hz on the AV amp which is a good mid point from were the rears start (90Hz) and the sub ends (150Hz).
    Setting the fronts to large should not harm them.
     
  3. stevelup

    stevelup
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    Everyone gets confused about the subwoofer setting.

    It's not the crossover frequency, it's just a low pass filter and it only affects the dedicated LFE channel. There should not be anything encoded in the LFE channel above 80Hz so the setting of this control is irrelevant and best left set at 80Hz.

    Make sure that the crossover setting on the subwoofer itself is either disabled completely or turned up as high as it will go.

    Although your front speakers claim to go down to 39Hz, that is a simply fantastical figure which is impossible to achieve with 5.5" drivers.

    I would recommend you try leaving the front speakers set no lower than 80Hz, the centre at 100Hz and the surrounds as 120Hz.

    If you do want to try leaving the front speakers in full range mode, make sure you select the 'Double Bass' option which mixes some of the LF from the left and right channels into the sub.

    With regards to it sounding a little flat - that is somewhat the idea of the Audyssey setup - it is supposed to make the frequency response as flat as possible.

    You could override this slightly by using the tone controls (they are in the Audio Setup menu). This will allow you to apply a bit of EQ without changing the overall balance of the system.

    Steve
     
  4. steve69bez

    steve69bez
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    With regards to it sounding a little flat - that is somewhat the idea of the Audyssey setup - it is supposed to make the frequency response as flat as possible.

    You could override this slightly by using the tone controls (they are in the Audio Setup menu). This will allow you to apply a bit of EQ without changing the overall balance of the system.

    Steve[/QUOTE]

    When I meant the sound was flat I meant more on the bass side of things (sorry I didn't make that clear)
    What does the Double bass effectively do? does this setting conflict with the bass from the sub
     
  5. stevelup

    stevelup
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    I'm still not quite sure what you mean!

    Does your subwoofer have a phase control on it - you could try changing that then rerunning the Audyssey setup. Also, make sure you have the microphone mounted solidly (preferably on a tripod) whilst you are running it. If the microphone is free to wobble around or is directly vibrated when the tests are taking place, the calculations will not be correct.

    You haven't changed the subwoofer distance have you? You need to leave it set at the calculated distance.

    'Double Bass' acts as if you have set your front speakers at 80Hz but still leaves them full range.

    In other words, any bass below 80Hz goes to both your front speakers and your subwoofer.
     
  6. mr leeches

    mr leeches
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    You think you have all the settings down and then a thread like this appears. If like me (which i think most people on here are) all settings need to be perfect.

    So without further ado.. help!

    I get the whole idea of cross overs but i dont get how to work out whats the best setting is.

    I hve the Q acoustics 1010i 5.1 system, ranges as follows

    Centre : 75 - 20kHz

    Surrounds : 68 - 20kHz

    Sub : 45 - 175

    The manual that came with the speakers was actually very thorough and recommended a crossover frequency (i cant remember what now as i am at work). I cant remember my Audyssey settings either.

    I do enjoy all the fidddling but it also drives me mad!

    There is also a setting for this on the sub itself, what should this be set too?
     
  7. steve69bez

    steve69bez
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    Thanks thats cleared the double bass thing up, I haven't changed any distances on the setup, I don't have a tripod for the mic I just did a home made tripod by resting a book on top of the sofa at ear height then I left the room to let it do its thing, the phase on the sub is set to 0 and the crossover set to maximum
     
  8. stevelup

    stevelup
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    After the Audyssey setup, what level did it leave your sub set at?

    Steve
     
  9. steve69bez

    steve69bez
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    The Level was set to -12db
     
  10. steve69bez

    steve69bez
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    I think where I was getting confused was that I had heard to set the crossover to 10 or 20hz more than the lowest manufacturers setting which i thought would be 40hz for the 3010 rears as the Frequency response is 90 - 20 kHz and I thought 20 khz was the lowest setting. What do these lower numbers mean?
     
  11. james.miller

    james.miller
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    those numbers are what they (the manufactures) rate the speakers at. its the frequency range they say the speaker will produce accurately and uniformly. more often than not, its a big fat lie lol

    audyssey will measure the actual response of your speakers and give you the crossover setting that it thinks are best, taking all the guesswork out of it for you, so start with those and you're on the right path...setting everything to 80hz is ideal but not if any of your speakers arent up to reproducing 80hz upwards with enough power and loudness to keep up with the rest of the system. Hence stevelup's suggestion to set the sats to 120hz is a good idea.

    one drawback with audyssey is that while it trys to configure the system with the flattest response possible, it doesnt take power handling in to account. audyssey set my little mission (m71i) front speakers to full range lol. thats fine but they cant keep pace when you turn the wick up, so i set them to 80hz instead. my subwoofer is far better at dealing with 10-80hz, obviously.
     
  12. Stoke192

    Stoke192
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    Hi,
    I'm a new 605 owner (first proper av amp) and have it paired with a set of Tannoy SFX 5.1 speakers.
    I've run the audyssey setup and it sounds a bit flat compaired to my old all in one Pioneer system.

    Could anyone recomend the crossover settings for these speakers as it's all a bit confusing :confused:

    Thanks
     
  13. thebassman

    thebassman
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    i would set all of them a 140Hz and let the sub deal with all the lows. :lesson: I had the same problem with my Mission speakers when i first got my 605, but after adjusting the frquency response as per the manufactures recommended levels it sounds awesome.
     
  14. Stoke192

    Stoke192
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    Hi,
    Cheers for the info,i've altered the settings to 150Hz (was either 120Hz or 150Hz) and it sounds much better :smashin:

    Thanks
     
  15. MysteryMan

    MysteryMan
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    I like the title of this thread as it sums me up, as well!!!!

    Some good info in it to help explain, but, I am not 100% sure I've got it, yet!

    I think for my setup, which is a Velodyne Deco sub/sat system.....

    For each speaker, you can set a crossover value (on the receiver) and whenever a signal is sent to that channel then any frequencies above the value will go to the speaker and any frequencies below the value will be sent to the subwoofer.

    Any crossover capability that the sub may have should be switched off or set to highest possible value

    Any LFE filter, on the sub, should be set to 80Hz and this just applies to the LFE channel

    Any corrections or comments would be most appreciated!
     

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