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600mr

Discussion in 'TAG McLaren Audio Owners' Forum' started by pbains, Aug 1, 2005.

  1. pbains

    pbains
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    Hi,

    I was reading through the 250x3R ownsers manual and came across the following.
    "There are many design features which have
    been derived from our excellent 100x5R
    and our F1-600MR amplifiers to make
    this amplifier very special. We have listed
    a few of these very technical items on
    the following pages."

    Is F1-600MR a mistake in the manual? Just curious.
     
  2. PhilB1234

    PhilB1234
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    From the F1 range that only sadly included the speakers so far was the 600mr monobloc which was on display in the foyer of the Huntingdon HQ. They looked great in blue and black and were covered by a huge heatsink and had features like a CAST connection as developed by Krell.
    Anyone know if the prototype versions of these are anywhere? Or have they been whisked home by an ex-TAG employee.
     
  3. PhilB1234

    PhilB1234
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  4. roversd1

    roversd1
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    I dont know what happened to them!

    One was definitly dismantled and one was kept on display. Unfortunately what happened during the 'great chaos' is beyond me, although they might still be at IAG.

    I only got away with the Wilson Watt Puppy, Krell FPB350Ms, Krell KAV300i etc, etc :D
     
  5. Plump

    Plump
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    Mark, how functional were they?
    Also how far from real prototype model wirh all internals?

    P.S. was it really supposed to implement CAST?
     
  6. roversd1

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    They were perfectly functional and used on many occasions.

    Whether actually complete or not, I never knew.

    THe CAST bit was part of the basic design.
     
  7. GrahamMG

    GrahamMG
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    Why didn't they enter production or was the price ridiculous compared with the equivelent Bryston?
     
  8. pbains

    pbains
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    I remember one of the helpdesk guys telling me he had the only pair of active speakers developed by Tag.
     
  9. roversd1

    roversd1
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    I dont think there were ever any solid plans to release them, as documented elsewhere, in the days of the 'golden light' of TMA, there was to be a teered product range - F1, F2 and F3

    The F1 products were to also include that big Aphrodite reciever thing (the name of I forget), the amps, the speakers etc.

    There was to be an F2 range which never, ever saw itself beyond a basic display model stage.

    And finally, there was the F3 products that made it out into the world.

    Interestingly, when I was ferreting around the bilges of the TMA factory, I came across some Audiolab prototype products, these were the forunner to the AV32R, DPA and some othe exciting bits. Some were models only but there was one near working Audiolab AV processor!

    It even had the TAGtronic bus feature. Now I dont know if it was a pre TMA prototype or a crossover product, but I knew that Audiolab were working on something just before TMA took over.

    Chew on that one...
     
  10. roversd1

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    These were to be the Calliope actives with something like 100w per speaker. Unfortunately, they failed to make it as heat disipation was, apparantly, the problem. The pair that were floating around never seemed to have any heat worries, so (cant remember who got them), whoever did, got something pretty decent
     
  11. Plump

    Plump
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    cleopatra?
     
  12. Miron

    Miron
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    I think it would be very interesting to find out if TAG was seriously developing F1 monoblocks or not. I was always under impression there was something going on, but of course that means nothing.
     
  13. PhilB1234

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    I used to have a couple of pictures of the monoblocs taken in the foyer but I can't find them... I'll try and track them down and post them.
    Cleopatra prototype looked quite bulky and not as sleek as the Aphrodite. It was a utalitarian looking beast! I didn't realise it was from the 'F1 range'.... it just looked like an alternative design to me.
    At the VIP night did anyone else have a look at the CD player and integrated amps that were in a glass case just through the foyer? They looked seriously high-end (casework-wise) I'd be interested to know if they've found a new home!
     
  14. Plump

    Plump
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    Uf Uf Uf,
    this reminds me on Ripley scene in the last part when she enters the room with non-successfull clones of her....

    Miron, I am sure there was real intention to produce F1 monoblocs. There was too much said about them at some point in the past not to be real.
     
  15. Dr Udo Zucker

    Dr Udo Zucker
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    Hi Mark, when TAG McLaren Group acquired Cambridge Systems Technology (CST), there were no new products beyond their existing 8000 model range. What existed were an stylist's (=industrial designer's) idea how the next generation of Audiolab products could look like. Therefore, as there was definitely no Audiolab AV processor design, I guess, you might have seen one of those space models which lacked the all important part: electronics and software :(

    Well, how did these artist impression look? All I can say, is that the team of industrial designers designing the TAG McLaren Audio range, consisting of such famous people like Peter Stevens (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Stevens) and Clive Grinyer ( http://nelly.dmu.ac.uk/4dd/ddr3-cg.html ), had other ideas :)


    Furthermore, at the origin of "old" TAG McLaren Audio we had the idea to develop three distinct product ranges, but soon we learnt that very few retailers could actually sell such complete range. Different to, say a Mercedes-Benz dealer, who will be able to sell an A Class as well as an S Class Mercedes, very few retailers can sell products beyond approx. GBP 2000.

    Worse than that, some countries do not even have a real market for the very high cost products, and as special difficulty, in the UK, most retailers of high cost products (say Krell, Wilson etc) were discouraged by their distribution network to stay away from TAG McLaren Audio products :D

    In the end it didn't matter, TAG McLaren Audio pushed the F3 Series (although the name was silently dropped and replaced by AvantGarde) into the F2 field (AV32R DP) and F1 (AV192R).

    The monobloc amplifier 600MR was about 75% ready when it was decided to put its development "on ice" until such time TAG McLaren had opened the US market. This because those big (physical size!) amplifiers sell mainly there.

    For Europe the answer was the 250MR. Its a great amplifier, I personally replaced 5 Krell 600FBP monoblocs with 5 little 250MRs. Now I have gained space, low heat dissipation whilst remaining great sound.

    P.S.: Cleopatra, an Aphrodite with DAB radio and a somewhat more powerful amplifier, did not belong to the F1 range. It was dropped after we found the UK, "old" TAG McLaren Audio's largest market, was unable to sell integrated products. Aphrodite, a superb sounding product, received great reviews all over the world, but was unsuitable for the traditional, often inflexible audio retailer.
     
  16. laalves

    laalves
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    Very interesting post, as always Udo.

    So I figure both the 250MR and 250x3R would be F2 whereas the 600MR the F1 amp, although actually all were Avantgarde, really....

    Such are marketing dictations...

    Luis
     
  17. Kenny Glasgow

    Kenny Glasgow
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    Great post Udo. What products do you think the old TMA would be ready to unleash to the market now if things had turned out differently?
     
  18. Miron

    Miron
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    I'd say the product to cry after the most would be automobile version of AV32R. I know there was concept but it was shelved at one point.
    It would also be very interesting to hear if it was 4.1 or 5.1 concept. (Normaly you don't get centre speaker in the car)
     
  19. Dr Udo Zucker

    Dr Udo Zucker
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    Hi Miron, it was 5.1 (as there are cars with centre speaker).
     
  20. johnson

    johnson
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    Hi, Yes mine has a center speaker, and Logic 7 processing.Sounds nice, but no exactly Audiophile.
    I remember seeing a car with an av32r built in.It was in an American magazine and I think the install may have been by Dolby.
    Regards
     
  21. Miron

    Miron
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    Simon, yes of course, but most of them neither have that option nor space to mount centre.
    For an example, there was a lot of discussion going on how to mount it in old Passat (I saw pics of few funny user DIY solutions). I also do not know how it looks now in a new Passat (now they have Dynaudio speakers), but it should be better.

    I know that some newer cars have this (like new Mercedes B-Class which I actually considered but it turned out to be too small for my taste) but majority surely don't.
     
  22. audionutter

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    Dr.Z, is it possible to reveal more info on the abandoned car audio version of the AV32R? I for one would be very interested in knowing more, since I am also into car audio. It's a shame it was shelved, was it due to technical problems or just financial?
     
  23. Kenny Glasgow

    Kenny Glasgow
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    Udo

    Do you have any pics to post of the car system or any other TMA project that didn't see the light of day?
     
  24. roversd1

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    Now, again if memory serves me correctly, the Mercedes McLaren SLR was to have AV32R / 100x5R dreviatives.

    I forget what eventually ended up in the SLR - Bose was flavour of the month for most manufacturers at the time.
     
  25. PhilB1234

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    I knew I'd seen the picture recently... Audiovenue are using the pictures of the 600mr on their site...
    Here's an image for anyone who hasn't seen them.
     

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  26. Kenny Glasgow

    Kenny Glasgow
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    Beautiful :thumbsup: .....if only.... :suicide:
     

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