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5th Gear - Race between car, bike & boat

Discussion in 'TV Show Forum' started by DJW, Oct 12, 2004.

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  1. DJW

    DJW
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    Anybody see the race on the show last night ? I thought it was quite interesting the comparison between machines.

    Having had a high performance bike, with 130bhp & seeing what that did to ferraris & porches on the road, then taking into account the race bike was 200bhp, I thought it was frightening how fast the formula 1 car pulled away from the bike once it got full grip :eek: . It really put into perspective how fast that car is vs road going supercars.

    One thing that didn't seem fair though, was they used a £5M car, a £1M bike, but then only a £50K boat !! I would have thought a full blown racing boat would have been a fair match......in fact I though boats could accelerate faster due to not having the same problems with traction (eg. resistance of water aids acceleration from jets / props) ? I know for a fact they corner with more "G" than a race car......saw them in action once at Bristol docks....awsome :thumbsup:
     
  2. Roohster

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    Damn, missed it...what bike was it?
     
  3. DJW

    DJW
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    It was on again tonight at 7:30pm (hope you didn't miss it twice :mad: ) .......bike was Honda Fireblade, whilst F1 car was driven by our Jenson !!!
     
  4. cwick

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    I thought it was a bit silly - just a Honda plublicity stunt really - but fun to watch all the same. They milked it a bit - three runs down the airstrip, but not until the final one did the BAR Honda really hook it up. But christ did it go when it did ! It's not until you see the relative performance of these things that you really appreciate just how fast they are. Made the bike (WSB spec Fireblade, wasn't it ?) look like it was going backwards :)
     
  5. DJW

    DJW
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    Very true......shame they didn't chuck a NSX car in there...now that really would have shown difference in speed.......then again, wouldn't publicise road car too well :laugh: . Imagine a Civic !!

    Ref bike, think you are right re being WSB......I would hope so at £1M
     
  6. MartinImber

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    It was all Honda vehicles

    1) Bike is based on a road engine!

    2) I reckon there are quicker ones - but did you see how it kept lifting front wheel

    3) A PROPER boat with 3 litre 2 stroke outboard would have been interesting - it could have managed a standing start and may even have won - I don't know the figures but I remember seeing a race about 10 years ago.

    4) I have seen a boat called Cosworth because it was powered by the 3l V8
     
  7. markymark34

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    thought the race was a bit naf. the motorbike did unbelievable well concidering what it was up against. it was only 0.4 sec off the F1 car which is incredible considering the price difference. As martin says the bikes engine is based on a road bike.
    i would love to see a Moto GP bike up against an F1 car. The are producing 210bhp+

    mark
     
  8. Mylo

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    Rutters BSB fireblade does 203mph and has 200bhp. The cost is £250k to lease it for one year from HRC. Not the best bike for a drag race as the hydraulic clutch is notoriously bad for fast starts.
     
  9. DJW

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    There must be a point with Racing Motorbikes where you can't get anymore power down from a standing start....it either spins or flips. From memory didn't both the car & bike have to slip the clutch for the first 100 yds, therefore acting like a reduced powered engine ? Different game when the F1 got full grip & let the full 950BHP loose :laugh: . I remember seeing an article on F1 cars where they stated they have so much power they can wheel spin in every gear !!! God knows how they manage so well in the wet.

    I assume the boat had a different scenario where they need to minimise the amount of boat in the water, to ease resistance, but still enough in the water to stop the torgue of the engine flipping the boat over.
     
  10. Mylo

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    They had to detune the Honda v5 GP bike when first launched. Even Valentino Rossi couldnt control the 250+ BHP it delivered.

    Brainiac Science abuse did a similar test between a rocket, a golf ball and a Fireblade ridden by Richard Hammond.
     
  11. DJW

    DJW
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    Would loved to have seen how Hammond stayed on the golf ball ;)
     
  12. Mylo

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    I hoped it would hit him!
     
  13. alancolledge

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    I've done a few 1/4 mile runs at Santa Pod on my ZZR1100. Best time I got was 12.1secs at 119mph.
    The time done by the racing bike, low 10s is achievable on some of the top road bikes GSX1000, Hyabusa. You can start to bring those times down with a longer swing arm to stop them flipping.

    I saw the race last night and it really does put the F1 speed in perspective. Still boring to watch mind. :p
     
  14. alancolledge

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    Just finished watching tonights episode with the Merc/Maclaren SLR.
    Was it me or did Tiff say "stig that up your pipe and smoke it" towards the end!? :laugh:
     
  15. DJW

    DJW
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    Damn...missed it. Must watch tomorrow at 7:30 :smashin:
     
  16. markymark34

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    it sounded very much like 'stig that up your pipe'!!!
    Why on earth are they giving away a capri (sorry if i offend anyone)? It must be the only car ever given away by a car program that i wouldnt want!
    SLR isnt what you would call cheap is it! sounds great though

    mark
     
  17. explicitlyrics

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    I think they spent too much of the show on the SLR - I cant believe many watchers can afford it and although its nice to dream it doesnt deserve the majority of the show!
     
  18. MartinImber

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    This is WHY it deserves a big chunk.

    That engine note!
     
  19. vonhosen

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    I can't afford ANY of the cars they show so I would rather watch the more exotic & dream of a lottery win :D
     
  20. Steve_P

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  21. Roohster

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    Did anyone see last night's show?
    A Ducati 999 beat a Lamborghini Summatorother by a fraction of a second round a track.
     
  22. gringottsdirect

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    Yes, he definitely said Stig not stick, I rewound it a couple of times to make sure. :D
     
  23. DJW

    DJW
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    Yep....thought the bike would lose out on a tight track.....fair play to the rider, especially when he had the back sliding out under braking :thumbsup: Saying that, old Tiff drives a good drift :)
     
  24. smarty

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    Why is it that when car programmes and magazines run a car v bike feature they never do a fair comparison.
    In Top Gear's case, the WSB Fireblade is more equivalent to a Touring Car. If they're going to use an F1 car then at least put it against a Moto GP bike. Is it because they know the car won't win?
    Just to back that up, the Moto GP bikes on the same track as F1 cars use (Spain) are actually faster down the straights despite coming onto it slower due to the superior cornering speed of a car.

    Still, at least they didn't do what a fairly recent car magazine did. They put a £60k track day special car up against a bog standard R1 on a tight track and then declared that all cars are faster than bikes because it JUST beat the bike!

    Top Gear's a good show though and I don't suppose they had a choice of what was going up against what.
     
  25. Baigy

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    These are the facts if you never knew already,

    Basically straight line speeds you CANNOT compare cars to bikes, hear is the reasons why,

    Times all given in STANDING 1/4 mile

    Mclaren F1 = 11.1 secs
    2004 Yamaha R1 around = 10-10.5 tops secs ( with a good rider )

    Jenson Buttons Honda 900 bhp F1 CAR = around 9.6 secs
    Rytters 200bhp BSB = 10 secs.
    Valentino Rossi 260 bhp MOTOGP bike = around late 7 secs

    So this is why they neevr raced the best of cars(F1) vs best of the bikes (motogp) because the results would look a joke. You saw how far the gap was between Rutter bike and Buttons car looked far but was arounf 4 hundreds of a sec now a gap of well over 2 secs ................ exactly.
    These are the facts sorry to say.
     
  26. domtheone

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    Put the Moto GP bike against an F1 car round a track though and it'd be a different story, shirley..
     
  27. Baigy

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    yes true but lets be realistic, when will you race a Car in the streets and will be a tight and twisty clear road. Exactly 99.99% of races will take place at trafic lights or on a motorway where the cars will get Owned.

    Also if you looked around 2 years ago Cresent Suzuki made a 210 bhp ROAD legal bike and challanged any road legal bike or car to a race which included 0-60mph runs, 1/4 mile runs 1 mile runs and around a track (forgot which one )
    The cars included a Mclaren F1, JK,s Ferrari Enzo, audi rs4 and a rs6, lamboghini Murcielago, and a FEW more. It was around about £ 1 hundred thousand worth of bikeS VS around £3.5 million worth of cars Fair match up i think it was.
    The end result was that the bike was faster, so street legal stuff.... bikes are faster and a LOT cheaper :)
    so final Conclusion,
    MotoGp bikes are a lot faster than F1 cars in a straight line.
    F1 cars are faster around a Twisty track.
    And the Cresent teams Road legal Suzuki gsxr1000 has won against any road legal bike or car. To get profe of this Look up issues of Superbikes magazine issued 8th of June 2002.
     
  28. eurochamp

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    Baigy you are dillusional junior! ALL your figures are either made up or blown out of proportion except a few obvious like the Mclaren F1's 1/4 mile but funny you forgot to mention the top speed, 240mph!!! Which lets put it this way even a Moto GP bike can't do so suck on that! Not to mention the Buggati Veyron which would decimate any road Bike (and Moto GP for that matter) in a drag, topspeed or track racing.
    Spec:
    Veyron (official figures)
    0-60 mph: 2.5 sec
    0-100 mph: 5.1 sec
    0-300kph: 14.6 sec
    Topspeed: 253mph!!!!!

    Then theres the Arial Atom 300 here's a link: http://www.arielmotor.co.uk/04/frames.htm

    This thing kicks any bikes a** anywhere.
    spec:
    300bhp 450kg
    0-60mph: 2.8 sec
    0-100mph: 5.5 sec
    topspeed: Doesn't matter as this is a track car.
    I can't see that GSX-R beating the Atom around any track or any bike beating the Veyron in a straight line so that means road cars are quicker than road bikes and even MotoGP sometimes end of story even though there's plenty more to say but lets grt to the racing stuff.

    Now then a few facts about the awesome F1 cars:

    Yes Jenson Button's 1/4 mile (403 metres) speed was slow in context of fast 1/4 mile at the air strip with a 8.99sec (not the 9.6sec you quoted).

    the BAR 2003 005 spec:
    895BHP
    1/4 mile:8.99sec
    topspeed: 236mph (Monza testing) Quicker than a Moto GP bike.

    Anyway thats not even scratching the surface of an F1 car here's a few facts,
    Michael Schumacher raced an Eurofighter in his 2003 F2003 GA and heres the facts:

    Power: 925BHP, 600Kg with driver.
    standing 600m: 9.4 sec in the wet! Moto GP wouldn't come close!
    1/4 mile: 6.9sec!!! in the wet!!!
    topspeed: 230mph+

    Barcelona lap times:
    F2003 GA 1m : 14.667sec
    Moto GP: 1m : 42.337sec

    I'm not even gonna mention the difference in seconds you work it out for yourselves.
    The only reason the Bikes clocked a higher topspeed was because of the setup of the cars a Barcelona which was high downforce and the gearing it doesn't mean F1 cars are slower on the straight because its faster when needs to be like an F1 car will do 430Kph at Bonneville lets see Rossi do that! No chance.
     
  29. eurochamp

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    The bottom line is cars are quicker than bikes its just the laws of physics my friends! get over it, Moto GP bikes can't do over 225mph, or 1/4mile in under 8 sec but still very impressive for the money, likewise are the current crop of road going superbikes which makes a lot of exotic supercars look slow in a drag race i admit, but just remember when it comes down to it 4-wheels are quicker than 2.
     
  30. Baigy

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    Michael Schumacher raced an Eurofighter in his 2003 F2003 GA and heres the facts:

    Power: 925BHP, 600Kg with driver.
    standing 600m: 9.4 sec in the wet! Moto GP wouldn't come close!
    1/4 mile: 6.9sec!!! in the wet!!!
    topspeed: 230mph+

    Barcelona lap times:
    F2003 GA 1m : 14.667sec
    Moto GP: 1m : 42.337sec

    I'm not even gonna mention the difference in seconds you work it out for yourselves.
    The only reason the Bikes clocked a higher topspeed was because of the setup of the cars a Barcelona which was high downforce and the gearing it doesn't mean F1 cars are slower on the straight because its faster when needs to be like an F1 car will do 430Kph at Bonneville lets see Rossi do that! No chance.[/QUOTE]

    Ok facts LOOK at that bike to F1 car race again the F1 car modified 900bhp jenson buttons F1 car does a 1/4 mile in 9.0 seconds at the fastest and the 200bhp none modified bsb was 9.4 secs which makes it 0.4secs slower. Btw buttons car on the track is 800bhp not 900 hence it was modified. The bike was left the same no extra bhp added not fair i think but......
    also look at the fastest run for a 1/4 mile for a raod legal bike or car etc the record is help by a 550 bhp suzuki hayabusa which has done it in around 7.5 secs that the WORLD record so you know nothing is faster.(road legal)

    Basically if you look at it this way, if you spend the same $ on a bike and a car the bike will always be faster the reason being is its the bhp difference to the kg it weighs, its the equivelant to have the new buggati vernon(bugga) around 2000bhp and not 1001bhp the new 2004 yamaha r1 weight 172kg and 180 bhp 1bhp to every kg it weighs.
    BTW your facts are total lies when Michael Schumacher raced the Euro fighter his car it was again chiped to 900MHP not 925 as you claim, and they never mentioned how much it weighs or how fast it can do a 1/4 run in and they can not do a 1/4 mile STANDING start in under 7 secs. IF im wrong then send me the link to the same film and ill watch it AGAIN.
     
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