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4 stage AV upgrade, advice on next 3

Discussion in 'Home Cinema Speakers' started by ditton15, Oct 21, 2002.

  1. ditton15

    ditton15
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    Have been trying to upgrade
    1) to entry DVD player
    2) from 21 inch to 32inWidescreen
    3) from DolbyPro to 5.1
    4) from main to many speakers

    Would not like to admit how much timw I've spent reading mags,browsing shops & lurking on this (most excellent) Forum. So far, I've made first base, and bought the Tosh 220. And even successfully ordered and played 4 Region 1 DVDs - first just had to be Blade Runner.

    So now I have three stages to go to complete the home cinema run. I seek advice on the rest.

    The first, on TVs, I must put to that other thread, but if I tell you its Tosh vs Phillips, that'll be enough.

    My existing kit, with the 'at risk' components maked *, are:

    TV: 21 inch Sony Tinitron *
    VCR: Panasonic NVF55
    Digital cable: Telewest

    Yamaha RXV660 Dolby ProLogic Receiver (65x2; 25; 25 x2) *

    Yamaha CDX-670 + KX-650 + Systemdek
    Celestion Ditton 15s

    I have in mind to have a straight Yammy upgrade to the receiver, the 530 seems the one. It also makes much of its phantom centre, and has taken this further, saying that it "employs aggressive crosstalk cancelling technology" to create 'virtual centre and read left/right speakers'!!

    So onto (4) what to do about speakers? The Ditton 15s date from the mid-1970s, cost me £109, half my then budget (rest on Pioneer receiver & turntable). They have been a delight, with a good spec: 30 - 15kHz, 30W, & 90db, and with the 'phantom' have enlarged my TV - though not to 32 widescreen.

    So do i now add those centre, rear and sub? and what would blend? or do I just do the package route?

    I have some products in mind, and will post these once I know this longish first-time post has arrvied safely.

    ta
     
  2. ditton15

    ditton15
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    OK, now I say what options I've been considering.
    Have been looking at a number of packages but I'm told that the bottom end (Klegg/MissionAv) will deliver less than the Ditton15s, but next step up is over £600, and that's a lot.

    So have been checking out adding a centre and some rears, but these need to blend. I could stick with Celestions (centre C2, F4C, A4C with rears, C1) or switch to those Missions (7c1 & 7ds). Even considered picking up a bargain set of Yamaha 105s.

    But am I missing the point. Should I end my Ditton fixation?

    :confused:
     
  3. Desticado

    Desticado
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    Hi Ditton and welcome to the boards.

    You've made a good choice (IMO) on the DVD player. I have the 210 which I've had for a year now and im more than happy. It will probably get upgraded at some point down the line (doesnt everything?) but probably not until I have the space for a projector.

    On the TV issue, I'd go for the Tosh. The tosh set should have Component inputs which you can marry with the DVD player to get the best picture possible out of your gear. I've got the 36zp18 set which im verry happy with. There are a couple of minor faults with this set if you search the forum but I think these are outweighed by its benefits and the flaws of other sets. These flaws though are not evident (I believe) on the 32" set so you're on for a win/win I think.

    Im not expert enought to advise you on amp/speaker combos but would advise you to try to listen to some different sets as much as possible. On the package route if you have a budget of about £600 for the speakers, its no secret im a fan of my KEF Eggs. They retail for about £800 but if you shop about you can pick them up for about £630. I found the sub that came with the Eggs to be okay but after a while left me wanting a little more.

    Hope that helps a little and welcome to the boards

    Regards
     
  4. pointon

    pointon
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    Nice choice with the receiver if you ask me.

    However, forget about all that 'phantom' nonsense. Believe me you need the full 5 speakers (and the .1 sub if you possibly can), to get the true effect.

    'Phantom' speakers sound nice, but they don't sound good.

    Take a look at a decent speaker package, such as Mission's Cinema M72 package, and a decent sub. It's best not to mix makes in the speaker department, as they won't tonally match. You should always try demoing speakers. Don't just buy them from a review or recommendation.

    Agree on the Tosh. Great TV's.
     
  5. Ian J

    Ian J
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    It's fairly important that the centre speaker should match the front stereo pair tonally and you will find it difficult to find something current that will match speakers from 25 years ago.

    Other speakers worth looking at are the Acoustic Energy packages from http://www.soundandvision.uk.com
     
  6. ditton15

    ditton15
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    OK, some backing for the non-speaker choices (Tosh 220 DVD, Yamaha 530, and prompting towards Tosh telly), but little sympathy for the ageing Celestion Ditton 15s as part of the new AV world.

    I guess I have to go along with this, and get a 5.1 package, rather than piddle about with looking for centres and rears to fit.

    My starter comparison for listening tests therefore seems to be:
    1) KEF eggs (sexy at £630 but with suspect sub)
    2) Misson M72 cinema (classic AV with decent sub)
    3) Acoustic Energy packages (boxy best buy bargain)

    I'll leave for some later date that 'music' justification for keeping the Ditton15s, when I have the 5.1 speakers installed and I do some of my own sofa tests. But I would like some sense of where I should pitch to avoid too much disappointment. I know I could lug the 15s into a shop and wire up, but this seems a bit extreme.

    I guess speakers are more subjective that most stuff.


    _______
    have to work on the that witty signature. How about: 'the reason for this is obscure, that's what the higher the fewer'. Maybe not

    :)
     
  7. Desticado

    Desticado
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    Just to clarify on the KEF KHT2005 set

    When I got mine I was over the moon with it all and pleased as punch. After about 6 months of educating my ears a bit more (I have quite a good accoustical sense to make up for lousey smell and taste) I wanted something with a little more oomph... The kind of oomph I wanted came in the form (after a spot of auditioning) of a REL Strata III....

    Guess what im trying to say is that I found the KEF sub to be reasonable but that I personally was after something MUCH better to suit my tastes.

    You might be able to buy just the EGGS if you wanted for about £500, equally I sold my 6 month old Kef Sub for £130 in a couple of days and you could easily buy a different sub that was more to your tastes.

    The missions seem to be VERY popular too although I've not heard them. If you've got any questions on the KEF's feel free to ask. If you're in Kent you can even pop around and have a listen if you like.

    Regards
     
  8. ditton15

    ditton15
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    Thanks Desticado, I over-summarised. Hope I wasn't too rude to our moderator either.

    Just had a browse around the Gallo/Eggs/Bose flame. Couldn't see how much the Gallo's cost for looking.

    I will go listen to the KEF Eggs, with and without sub, and try them against the missions (and note that I should also compare the c1 and c2 mission centres as well).

    thanks for the help. I've been enjoying the 'nice' phantom, so looking forward to the 'good' 5.1

    :D
     
  9. Desticado

    Desticado
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    When you do make the jump from you 2.0 to a full 5.1 or 6.1 system you will be amazed by the difference.

    I used an old steroe amp for ages on a regular TV before I finally graduated (after 10 years) and could afford some decent kit.
    12 months & £5k later im VERY pleased still (and so is the wife :eek: ) although she does keep mentioning we could have used to money to go on holiday.... :confused:

    Regards
     
  10. gringottsdirect

    gringottsdirect
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    Details in Uncle Eric's thread in Power Buys section.
     
  11. Yummy Fur

    Yummy Fur
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    Hi Ditton! My first 'real' pair of Hi-Fi speakers were Ditton 15's also! Everybody above has given you good advice. I think (as Ian suggested) that the sound of speakers now is going to be very different from your 15's. They'll be brighter, more forward and dynamic. This might take some getting used to... Just listen to as many pairs as you can...

    Yummy Fur

    PS. That Pioneer turntable wasn't a PL12D by any chance?
     
  12. ditton15

    ditton15
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    To gringottsdirect,

    My thanks. I have visited the 'bizzare' that is the power-buy place and marvelled. Is there no end to the wonders of this Forum. But, mu sums say that Gallo costs a bare minimum of 5 x £135 = £675 plus about £177 for supports = £852. Mind you they do look grand, even in 'bare minimum' white. Will have to decide how to bring the subject up at home - perhaps Uncle Eric could post me a brochure that I could slip into the Sunday colour supplement.

    And now I know what all that chat about Velodyne is about ... For other newbies, its a sub, rated alongside a REL 150, that can be bought for £325, at least for the CHT 10 model ... there's lots of opportunity to pay even more for better.

    To Yummy Fur,

    Well, I'll go to the top of my stairs! (Infact I have just been to the attic bedroom to check.)

    I sense a kindred spirit, It was indeed a PL12D, powered by a Pioneer RX450 Receiver, to tickle and thump the rubber of my Celestion Ditton 15s. You will know just how fond one can become of those Dittons, even when upgrade time meant that I learnt to love a 2nd hand Systemdek (and discover oodles of music between the grooves) and become a Yammy man.

    Back to the attic ... being bedroom, now vacated, of daughter No.1, who when she became 15 (in 1992) wanted to play music in her room and asked for a micro/musicbox. With all the cunning known to wayward fathers, I persuaded all concerned that it was better that she had the Pioneer set-up, by now joined by Denon Cassette player, so that she could get good quality music at *low* volumes. Of course, I did not pass on the Dittons, but bought some 2nd hand Ancram speakers - with stands, for I am not a mean father!

    That lay the way open for the upgrade, for kit that has kept me happy .....

    ....until the dawning of the widescreen and 5.1, when folk offer advice, kindly meant, that I should forsake my Celestion Ditton 15s, in favour of 'eggs' and 'balls' that are "brighter, more forward and dynamic" and subs that are simply awesome.

    Diiton15 (who may soon have to give up monica ..)

    PS Don't tell me that you were also at the Stones concert in Hyde Park!! 'Cos that would be really scary.
    :cool:
     
  13. Yummy Fur

    Yummy Fur
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    No, I was not at the Stones concert ! But did see an awful lot of live music then, so maybe I was the weirdo in the audience of some gig you went to! :D

    Yummy Fur
     
  14. ditton15

    ditton15
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    I'll resist all temptation to go thru list of gigs, save to say ....:clown:

    So, what did you swap your Dittons for? Should I go the way of the many boxes, or the small but perfectly formed? Did you have to pass this WAF test? Is silver the new black?

    I think I will have that Lagavullen after all. :D

    Ditton

    PS I need to read the documentation about these smilies :blush:
     
  15. Yummy Fur

    Yummy Fur
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    :clown: Indeed!

    The Dittons eventually gave way to pair of Tannoy Berkley's... way to big for my tiny bedroom, but great sound nontheless !

    If WAF is a consideration, then it will have to be small & perfectly formed, but if you can get away with bigger boxes..... I'm lucky I persuaded my wife to move to place where I could have my own 'play' room ;)

    Silver is the new Black! But we can probably remember when Black was the new Silver......

    Lagavullen? Nice! I'm more partial to Ardbeg & Talisker though:)

    Yummy Fur
     
  16. Desticado

    Desticado
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    I thought Gold was the new Silver??? :rolleyes:
     
  17. Yummy Fur

    Yummy Fur
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    Desticado said

    Not sure, when I spoke to Pioneer about getting an AV amp to visually match my 'Champagne Gold' 909 I was told that I as few years out of date and the all the current range was Silver !

    Yummy Fur
     
  18. ditton15

    ditton15
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    apparently, Myrrh has more Watts ...
     
  19. Yummy Fur

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    Ditton15 said
    No, that was just the sound it made when it re-entered the Earth's atmosphere....

    Sorry!:blush:

    Right, probably time for me to go to bed....

    Yummy Fur
     
  20. ditton15

    ditton15
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    Time to report progress, 11 months later:

    1. Toshiba SD510
    2. Toshiba 32ZD26
    3. Denon AVR2802 (second hand)
    4. Gallo Nuclear Micros with D'Avia centre
    + Velo VX10 sub
    + Celestion Ditton 15s, acting as AV rears and as HiFi mains

    and, what took so much longer to get right, on the HiFi side,

    5. Meridian 602 CD transport (second hand)
    6. AudioSynthesis Dax Decade (refurbished)
    7. AudioLab 8000S, as power amp (second hand)

    My thanks to all on this, and other, Forums for help and (sometimes persistent) advice.

    I'm a happy chappie

    ditton

    ps Yes, I know, the Dittons will have to go, sometime ....
     

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