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32pf9986 better than new 32pf9830

Discussion in 'LCD & LED LCD TVs' started by rundmc51, Sep 10, 2005.

  1. rundmc51

    rundmc51
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    i work in a local tv shop and have both sets running side by side using the same dvd and philips test disc and was amazed and disappointed with the new one. i bought a 9986 and was wondering if i should have waited, my set is amazing and am glad i did now. the new set has loads more connections, power swivel stand , stereo ambilight (which makes the set look very unbalanced) and a funky if not annoying new menu system but picture quality ? any one else got one would bee interested to here your comments.

    by the way our shop only got 2 systems, sold one same day and the other one was faulty out the box( no sound) selling at £2300 fitted
     
  2. kev00

    kev00
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    i'd be interested to see a 9830 in action as I have the 9986 and it's a stonking set. I was under the impression that the 9830 had an updated version of pp2 on board which was meant to produce an even better picture than the 9986 (hard to believe as the 9986 picture is amazing)
    how were the sets connected to the dvd? have you seen them running a digital source yet via dvi

    Kev
     
  3. rundmc51

    rundmc51
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    both tvs were running via rgb scart and/or composit leads, running on the new philips dvd recorder, using philips new pp2 hd test disc.
    the 9986 was smooth and clear and the 9830 juddered and was pixolating around objects. my own set is connected to a tosh rdx34 via conponent in to the dvi and is fantastic.
     
  4. chambeaj

    chambeaj
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    I had a look at the 32PF930 today (I was interested in getting a 42PF9830).
    I was shocked at how bad the picture is. Pixelating around moving objects, smearing and very processed looking picture. In fairness the source was a Philips demo DVD and connection method was SCART CVBS (as usual shop salesman seemed clueless about RGB, HDMI etc)... but nevertheless even with composite, the picture should not have looked that bad.
    I've gone right off the Philips now.
     
  5. rundmc51

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    my problem is that our shop only stocks philips and tosh and we only have the tosh 350 which is hdmi and is ok for the price but no better than a dvd connected via conponent in to the dvi. we also have the astra hd sat system working on the 9986 which looks fantastic via dvi. but even a dvd using the most low quality cables on cvbs if the tv is set up correct it looks great, compared to the new 9830 which looks dodgy. hopfully a software up date will fix? there is a great option in the menu for updating the system software via the media card slot.
     
  6. Bluestraw

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    I don't think these are necessarily fair comparisons - anything connected via composite doesn't deserve to look good on ANY set, and just because the 9986 may handle such things better is no reason (for me at least!) to worry at all!

    The true tests are in RGB, and especially HDMI. Also worth to note that most stores turn up the 'processing', contrast etc to max, as somehow they think this makes it 'better'. As the 9830 may have more options for processing, possibly this is what's causing the subjective difference right now.

    I'd love to see a decent 3 way review comparing 9986, 9830 and Sony V series. Now THAT would be interesting.......
     
  7. rundmc51

    rundmc51
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    by the way the 42pf9830 and the 37pf9830 are going to use true 1080 pannels(1920 by 1080 p) so hoping for good things from them
     
  8. rundmc51

    rundmc51
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    even thou the tv has a new menu system it has exactly the same options as the 9986 , and the 9830 is no better via quality rgb scart
     
  9. Rolighed

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    I'm receiving my 32PF9830 this wednesday - but during the wait I visited a dealer (today) and saw both the 37" and the 32" in action.

    The 37PF9830 setup was perfect: HDMI all the way... Meaning: HDMI from the new DVP9000S throught the new DFR9000 and the ending in the TV. Viewing Lord of the Rings on DVD I was amazed. WOW! :clap:

    The 32PF9830 setup was more "traditional" I think - I couldn't really get a closer look so I'm not sure how things were connected. It must have been analog anyway! It was showing The Matrix and things still looked razorsharp and "perfect" to me!

    I'm only bothered by the fact that the 37" won't accept a 1:1 pixel mapping input from a HTPC. Otherwise I would surely have picked that one over the 32". Well, guess I'll survive living with "the little brother" (for a while anyway)! :thumbsup:
     
  10. rundmc51

    rundmc51
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    by the way im not trying to put the tv set down in any way i was just hoping for so much more from this set.i love philips sets and work with them every day and find the forums great for tips.i have installed hundreds of lcds and every tv i install i want the best for the customer and i love to see a great install. at present i have not seen a better pic than a 9986 and hope that with a lot of testing i will get to grips with the 9830 and push this set to the best tv ever slot
     
  11. Bluestraw

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    Hi rundmc51,

    Sorry - I didn't mean to argue, it did just sound a bit like Philips bashing!! I'm glad to hear you're also a Philips fan :) I came a little late to LCD Tvs, and I've been waiting and waiting for the 9830 with some big hopes. So I really hope I'm not disappointed!!!

    When you say it was no better on RGB, do you mean it was no better than composite, or no better than the 9986? Also, I wondered if you'd ever seen the Sony V series? A lot of people on here are raving about them...
     
  12. andrewfee

    andrewfee
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    Firstly, I don't know how it could be playing a philips' "HD" test disc through a regular dvd player? They don't support HD.

    Anyway; it may just be that it was going through an upscaling player - the older sets downscaled HD resolutions, did their processing, and then upscaled them back up to 720p. So this setup would have scaled up to 720p, downscaled it to do PP2 processing, then upscaled to the panel's native resolution. Doing this would have probably helped hide artifacting, mpeg compression etc that was already on the disc. However, this will also have removed detail and clarity from the image.

    The new sets would take a 720p image, apply PP2 processing at 720p, and output at the panel's native res. This would keep all the detail intact on the disc, artifacts and all.

    This could perhaps be one reason it looks "worse" - you may have just been looking for artifacting etc, and not noticed the extra detail. Of course not having seen this setup, or either of the two televisions, it's all speculation; but it seems plausible.

    I'm not familiar with both sets' specs, but it could also be that they have different brightness outputs, contrast ratios etc, so for example "100" contrast on both is not the same. It may also just be that one was set up right, and the other wasn't.

    I did wonder about the stereo ambilight though; do you think it looked distracting, or just that you didn't like the idea of it, and didn't really get a good look? (I'm wondering if there's a stereo/mono option)

    "Juddering" sounds strange though; was it the same player being used on both? Were they set up right? Some sets handle 1080i by using a "bob" deinterlacing method, which looks like the picture is "juddering" - so if one was set to 1080i and the other was 720p, it would explain it.

    It may just be that you were more actively looking for flaws on the new set to justify keeping your "old" one. Or maybe you just have yours set up better at home. :)

    I'm not accusing you of lying etc, I'm just throwing out a few ideas as to why it could have looked worse. I find it hard to believe that their new "flagship" model would look worse than the old one.

    I have no bias for/against Philips, I've currently got a Samsung LE32R41BX - just interested in how the new sets are. (selling the samsung, as it's too big for my room and looking at other sets; although I'm not sure if philips do smaller sets with the advanced processing, ambilight etc)
     
  13. kev00

    kev00
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    I totally agree with you there. The only true way to make a comparison on these sets is by comparing them with a rgb signal, and with a digital signal (dvi on the 9986 and hdmi on the 9830)

    The PP2 is stunning on the 9986, but it needs a bloddy good source to get the best from the set.

    Kev
     
  14. tont

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    There is no other HDTV downscaling in 9986 as downscaling from 1080i to 1366x758 regardless of promotional marketing articles about PP2HD is saying. The signal path for SDTV to RGB SCART, Composite and S-video follows trough motion compensated deinterlacing scaler with reduced halo Picnic, Falconic, what makes Philips better than other for SD signals, to Eagle part what is doing PP2 picture processing on natural resolution (1366x758 32PF9986). HDTV and other progressive signals to DVI (Component, VGA) leaving out deinterlacer scaler part and following directly to PP2 part with one exception: 720P signal leaving out PP2 part too. If you compare two TV, one from Scart RGB input and other from DVI (digital, component or VGA) input then you actually comparing deinterlacer-scaler of DVD player to deinterlacer-scaler of TV. Philips has very good deinterlacer scaler, even better than Faroudja and Sil and with good input SD signal picture from Scart RGB maybe better than from DVI.
     
  15. rundmc51

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    the disc i was using is the philips test disc 2005-2006 which is standard res it is great for testing the tvs as it has a great variety of clips which shows of most lcds great. this one is designed for the ambilight 2 pp2hd set , it has loads of clips, stills, and test patterns.
    i had both sets running with there own dvd(the new philips dvd recorder) testing first composite(single phono output via scart adaptor in to ext 1) then both running on fully wired gold rgb scarts in to ext 1(picture looked a lot darker via rgb)
    i only had a short time to test and get familure with the set then i had to go out installing,im of on holiday for a week now and will be testing when i get back,conponent,dvi,hdmi.
     

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