2021 Model TV's - Which software would improve SD Channels?

[Saxo Appeal]

Hi guys,

I've been looking at some of the 2021 Model TV's which are being released, and one which has just caught my eye is the Sony with their XR upscaling.

Along with 4K and HD Sky Channels, we all on the odd occasion watch the Music Channels, and when viewing these channels with the HZ1000 it was shockingly terrible.

So the question is: With all the new 2021 model TV's, which software do you think, or have read, that will do an impressive upscaling (to SD) so for example Sky Music channels will look far better than a complete blurry mess, or is this something that can't be rectified?

Sony XR
From this

to this

 

[mikej]

Those channels are often broadcast at a lower resolution and bitrate (even by SD standards) on Freeview and I can't imagine they're any better on Sky so, while the upscaling abilities of some TVs might be better than others, they have so little to work with in the first place that it's just not realistic to expect miracles and this isn't too surprising considering the TV has to make up around 95% of the SD picture you're seeing on a 4K TV. In terms of your examples, 'XR Clarity' is just marketing nonsense and photos like that are usually simulated.

Personally, I look forward to the day when SD channels are a thing of the past but, sadly, the majority seem to prefer quantity over quality.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

I obviously want miracles to happen, or programes to be broadcast at higher resolution (looking at Music Channels)

It's such a shame because we are missing out on programmes which are just unwatchable, although some do look ok, the majority of them look bad and just a blurry mess!

So bascically the way to correct this is either not view them, or watch on a less spec TV

 

[Rodders53]

Many such channels are 544x576 in resolution (Full SD is 720x576i) so have very, very stretched horizontal pixels in 16:9.

Some material would originally be 4:3 (still originally 720x576) but perhaps zoomed in to fill a 16:9 screen and chopping off top/bottom?

Some archive stuff was recorded on analogue videotape and transferred to digital in a less than ideal way, possibly as well.

Complain to the Music Channel broadcasters?

Complain to Ofcom for not deprecating the 544x576 practice?

Or...

Sit or stand further from the large screen you have so you don't see the flaws of the SD images when upscaled after being mangled by MPEG compression and reduced resolution so obviously?

 

[EndlessWaves]

It's not miracles, it's just automating what could be done by artists going over the video frame by frame. You're not trying to restore the original detail as accurately as possible, just replace unnatural artefacts with more natural and fitting textures and shapes.

The technology is getting there. I gather it's gotten to the point of being used on making higher quality versions of films and series filmed in low quality.

That's a less demanding application than this, because a human can spend time tuning it to get optimal results for each scene and there's a lot more processing power available


Have Sony managed to run something within the spare capacity of the weak processor inside a TV that will work on a wide variety of different programs in real time?

I don't know, but don't be surprised if the first implementations are a bit spotty and inconsistent.

 

[Boostrail]

With slight trepidation have ordered bigger than current TV - Sony XH9505 today.
But am still concerned about SD upscaling??
For example on current Panasonic 1080x1960 TV wife was watching Vicar of Dibley today I think on the Gold channel SD . Whilst PQ was perhaps just a bit soft it was very acceptable. This was via VM Tivo STB . What should I expect on new TV?
Should I swap Ttvo for V6 currently in bedroom?

 

[PICKY737]

Almost a quarter of the way into the 21st century and some TV companies use HD channels as a cash cow transmitted as a premium product when it should be the standard. Don't think there will ever be a time when 4k is the standard for normal TV watching!

 

[Rodders53]

This is a suck it and see using Mk1 eyeball on the combinations. IF the VM box(es) output material in original format and don't insist on doing some scaling, then the TV rescaling again?

My 1920x1080p GT60 panny does a better job of upscaling and deinterlacing 720/704/544x576i than my Humax Foxsat-HDR.

It noticeably better but not so much that it's worth the delay and vision bumps when 'channel surfing' on freesat (101 sd, 102 HD, 103 was SD now HD, 104 SD, 105 & 6 HD etc.,.) so I have the -HDR set to output 1080i rather than 'original'.

 

[Boostrail]

This is a suck it and see using Mk1 eyeball on the combinations. IF the VM box(es) output material in original format and don't insist on doing some scaling, then the TV rescaling again?

My 1920x1080p GT60 panny does a better job of upscaling and deinterlacing 720/704/544x576i than my Humax

Thanks at present cable box is upscaling to 1080i so tv is just deinterlacing.

 

[Rodders53]

Thanks at present cable box is upscaling to 1080i so tv is just deinterlacing.

Question is does the box support 'original format' to avoid the scaler inside it?
i.e. o/p 576i on SD TV channels, o/p 1080i on HD ones?

If yes: see if you can tell the difference on your current TV between the VM scaling and the TV scaling?

If no: then a UHD set is gonna be scaling from a scaled up 1080i signal...
The same UHD set with its' Freeview tuner input (or sat tuner) would do the scaling/deinterlacing fully internally. It may do a better job.

But then VM do their own coding of material collected from the broadcasters (to agreed/contracted standards)... The broadcasters code their own for broadcast emission... so there will be differences?