2019 Coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) hits the UK

Well Boris, if only you'd taken decisive action sooner, rather than you and Cummings toying with your herd immunity/eugenics theories.

Presumably you won't be bothering with any of those obviously inferior EU respirators that you turned down the offer of for the rest of the country and will wait for your mate Dyson to finish designing his respirators on the nice juicy government contract you awarded him.

Still - thoughts and prayers, etc. ;)
 
Are there any other countries in the world where the senior government leaders have tested positive or been hospitalised? I know the Italian chief medical officer has but I can't recall hearing of any others
 
Just watching the BBC breakfast show. They are showing a hotel where hospital staff are being given rooms. This is because a member of their family has shown symptoms. They could either stay at home for 2 weeks and not work or move to the hotel and continue working.
So I don’t get that everyone in the country has been told they have to self isolate for 2 weeks if a household member shows symptoms.
Surely the nurses can be carriers now and still going into the hospital working?
 
The Bronx zoo are reporting their big cats are showing symptoms and that one tiger has been tested and found positive. This is believed to be human to animal transmission.


Cheers,

Nigel
 
Have the news reported this correctly.
Because I was told weeks ago, that NHS staff may have to move into hotels during this time to protect family members from potential virus infection.
 
Have the news reported this correctly.
Because I was told weeks ago, that NHS staff may have to move into hotels during this time to protect family members from potential virus infection.
Yes. One of the nurses was talking and she had a daughter with symptoms. So the mother left the house. She has to stay in the hotel for 14 days though before they can go back home.

Last paragraph here.
 
Other people on bbc breakfast twitter are asking the same question as me regarding why they are not self isolating.
 
So I don’t get that everyone in the country has been told they have to self isolate for 2 weeks if a household member shows symptoms.
Surely the nurses can be carriers now and still going into the hospital working?

Am pretty convinced patients have picked up infections from staff in our hospital. But the reason why health care staff cannot self isolate for 14 days is because if they did we will literally have no one left on the wards. This goes from cleaners all the way to consultant staff.

The fact healthcare staff have to stay at work almost regardless of what's on going might explain why we are lossing fit and health staff to this virus. Though not proven, repeated exposure to patients with heavy viral load may be contributing to how sick some healthcare staff are getting, and why there is so much anger (still) amounts healthcare staff about PPE :(.

Any sane person given the choice between going to work or sitting at home right now would choose sitting at home every time, but that's not how most healthcare staff think. If we don't go how work, who's going to look after those people sick in hospitals?
 
Am pretty convinced patients have picked up infections from staff in our hospital. But the reason why health care staff cannot self isolate for 14 days is because if they did we will literally have no one left on the wards. This goes from cleaners all the way to consultant staff.
Same at our school. We had two confirmed cases... Pretty much everyone in the school, myself included, would have come into contact with the children and their parents. We couldn't have the entire staff / children self-isolating for 2 weeks.

It's easy to see how this thing spreads like wildfire.
 
Am pretty convinced patients have picked up infections from staff in our hospital. But the reason why health care staff cannot self isolate for 14 days is because if they did we will literally have no one left on the wards. This goes from cleaners all the way to consultant staff.

Not being critical, just curious.

Absolutely understand why they can’t apply the 14 day rule otherwise, as you say, every staff member would have to self isolate for 14 days, and then when they return clear, another 14 days and so on.

Curious about how hospitals are being arranged. Maybe naively, I imagine that all non-serious treatments are cancelled and that coronavirus and non-coronavirus staff and patients are kept apart. I guess even so there will be common areas that can’t be avoided.

When frontline staff are not at work are they isolating. For example, grocery shopping, what do you do, do you sit at home and get someone to do it for you (as the public are instructed) or do you go to the supermarkets yourselves?

This has puzzled me for a few weeks. Started when we saw videos of nurses crying saying that they couldn't get toilet rolls - I saw one following one tired nurse who had just come iff shift going into a series of stores and coming out empty handed and crying. I was torn between heartfelt sympathy and “hey you have just come off a C-19 ward you shouldn’t be going in those crowded shops”.


Cheers,

Nigel
 
This is just a suggestion, but would it not be a good idea to release the recovery stats from hospital to discharge as part of the 5pm briefing. If those stats are poor then maybe it’s a good thing to not disclose, however if they are positive, then I feel this will add a touch of balance to the reported rates of serious infection..........and ultimately the doom/gloom.
 
But again, the whole government policy is to slow the spread, not to 100% eliminate it. That's why we're seeing what appears to be contradictory behaviour.

I'm not in work now for 2 weeks. Then I've got to go in for a day, surrounded by children who're very likely to have the virus. No masks or anything. Seems a little silly, but it means I won't be getting it for at least 2 weeks.
 
This is just a suggestion, but would it not be a good idea to release the recovery stats from hospital to discharge as part of the 5pm briefing. If those stats are poor then maybe it’s a good thing to not disclose, however if they are positive, then I feel this will add a touch of balance to the reported rates of serious infection..........and ultimately the doom/gloom.
That might give a false sense of security.
 
Am pretty convinced patients have picked up infections from staff in our hospital. But the reason why health care staff cannot self isolate for 14 days is because if they did we will literally have no one left on the wards. This goes from cleaners all the way to consultant staff.

The fact healthcare staff have to stay at work almost regardless of what's on going might explain why we are lossing fit and health staff to this virus. Though not proven, repeated exposure to patients with heavy viral load may be contributing to how sick some healthcare staff are getting, and why there is so much anger (still) amounts healthcare staff about PPE :(.

Any sane person given the choice between going to work or sitting at home right now would choose sitting at home every time, but that's not how most healthcare staff think. If we don't go how work, who's going to look after those people sick in hospitals?


Yes. We had a 65 year old female patient who had NO visitors and was in our hospital for weeks. The only way she could have caught COVID-19 was from a member of staff sadly.

I think the answer to increased viral load lies in shorter shift patterns and better PPE. However the NHS are moving towards longer shift patterns and less PPE. I'm planning to escalate and bring this up at a local level but I'm personally frustrated staff haven't been informed and discussed with prior to plans being drawn up. Therefore the odds of them changing the rotas and shift pattern are very low and I fear they're set in stone.

0000-0800, 0800-1600, 1600-0000 shift patterns. 3 Handovers. Consultants will all stay for the entirety of their 8 hour shifts (no way in hell are they staying for 12.5 hour shifts). This minimises exposure and viral load, maximises handover. Sure, staff will have to cover MORE patients per shift but I think people would take a more intense but shorter shift over a long shift. Also every shift is fairly 'normal' for what we do: (night shift, day shift, twilight shift).

I fear we are waiting for evidence to build up (dead health care professionals) before making a decision on the viral load vs severity of symptoms issue. I think its much wiser to just assume it is a potential health and safety issues and adjust the rota pattern. A pandemic is one case where waiting for evidence is really detrimental when you can just adjust practice to what is safest.

The con is that either people end up working more days or we work less hours. I think it makes sense during a pandemic to work less hours but work more intensely. Most 12.5 hour shifts end up being very non-productive near the end anyway IMO. Also this method does not cover for sickness as efficiently but when we have staff going off sick left, right and centre, maybe trying to prevent it with a less consuming rota is the answer.
 
I was torn between heartfelt sympathy and “hey you have just come off a C-19 ward you shouldn’t be going in those crowded shops”.
They're not working in infections disease units wearing Jeans and T-s, hence the call for sufficient PPE.

Have seen plenty of home care workers in gloves and masks in the shops and not one instance of hysteria.

Keep your (social) distance and don't burn 2/3/4/5G masts.
 
This has puzzled me for a few weeks. Started when we saw videos of nurses crying saying that they couldn't get toilet rolls - I saw one following one tired nurse who had just come iff shift going into a series of stores and coming out empty handed and crying. I was torn between heartfelt sympathy and “hey you have just come off a C-19 ward you shouldn’t be going in those crowded shops”.
What I don't get is why they don't bring the shops to the key key workers. Why make them go indeed go to a supermarket, only at certain times. Why not when leaving the hospital hand them a box of goodies, with some chocolate and a nice bunch of flowers. And "would you like red or white with that?".

I know I say it jokingly, but I'm very serious. Bring the shop to them, provide quality essentials, pop in some goodies, some flowers, and give it away for free. If I was running a supermarket that is what I would do.

PS. And the same for all the supermarket / petrol station / warehousing staff as well.
 
This is just a suggestion, but would it not be a good idea to release the recovery stats from hospital to discharge as part of the 5pm briefing. If those stats are poor then maybe it’s a good thing to not disclose, however if they are positive, then I feel this will add a touch of balance to the reported rates of serious infection..........and ultimately the doom/gloom.

They aren't good.

A couple of days ago, 10,000 were admitted when the death toll stood at 2,800. There are not many medical conditions outside of ischaemic bowel with a mortality rate that high if you get hospitalised.


Edit:

Up to date stats from yesterday's conference:

'Mr Gove says
15,073 of those have been admitted to hospital with Covid-19 symptoms'...
The total number of deaths, of patients who were hospitalised after testing positive, now stands at 4,313'


So of the 15,000 admitted with COVID-19 symptoms, 4,313 have died. Thats about 28% mortality rate which is quite severe for a hospitalised condition.
 
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What I don't get is why they don't bring the shops to the key key workers. Why make them go indeed go to a supermarket, only at certain times. Why not when leaving the hospital hand them a box of goodies, with some chocolate and a nice bunch of flowers. And "would you like red or white with that?".

I know I say it jokingly, but I'm very serious. Bring the shop to them, provide quality essentials, pop in some goodies, some flowers, and give it away for free. If I was running a supermarket that is what I would do.

PS. And the same for all the supermarket / petrol station / warehousing staff as well.


Mate, they can't even give us proper PPE. You really think they're going to dish us out wine and chocolate?
 
 


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Mate, they can't even give us proper PPE. You really think they're going to dish us out wine and chocolate?
Are you sure that's not a specific trust problem, because my social media is showing plenty of hospital staff fully kitted out. With some staff claiming there is NO problem with ppe, this is a North Yorkshire Trust.
 
Are you sure that's not a specific trust problem, because my social media is showing plenty of hospital staff fully kitted out. With some staff claiming there is NO problem with ppe, this is a North Yorkshire Trust.


Its widespread. I have colleagues all over the UK who are stating the same things in regards to PPE.

Certain departments have enough and they seem to be the ones who have pictures taken of them for social media.

My colleague in ITU was given knickers to wear over her head as they ran out of the protection for your head.


This app has been opened by DAUK on the PPE situation. You can reach out to them for numbers and you'll be shocked.


DAUK seem to be heading the fight for PPE (the BMA have been less pro-active despite having more resources). You can read about it here:


Huge thanks to Rinesh DAUK Chair stepping in last minute on Sophy Ridge, putting your concerns about PPE directly to the Health Secretary, you legend Rinesh!

“It’s been two weeks since the health secretary said that he’s pledging to ensure that the right equipment gets to the right doctor, the right hospital and the right GP practice and we’ve seen that sadly that is still not happening”

“Doctors have been left with no choice but to take matters into their own hands. At the Doctors’ Association UK we’ve been working with Messly and we’ve created an app called NHSppe.com. Since Thursday we’ve been surveying hundreds of doctors in over 150 hospitals.”

43% of doctors without ANY eye protection
20% of doctors without ANY eye protection for aerosol generating procedures (AGPs)
37% of doctors without FFP3 masks for aerosol generating procedures (AGPs)
“Doctors have said that they’re having to re-use masks that should be single use only….They’re talking to nurses doing some of these high-risk procedures are holding their breath as they’re unsure and unaware of whether the mask they have been provided is going to offer them adequate protection”
“We have seen in certain centres that supplies are getting to the frontline, but we’re hearing every day of more and more cases particularly with General Practitioners who simply don’t have the eye protection and basic equipment they need…We’ve seen doctors resorting to accepting donations from local schools, of using science goggles that children would normally be using in their labs and repurposing them for use in their surgeries. We’ve seen a tremendous effort from the local community to try and get personal protective equipment to doctors”




Doctors & Public taking matters into their own hands







________

And finally, just to take the mick a little more and might give you some insight into why you see what you see on social media but don't see the PPE-less doctors and nurses.


There is LOADS more on the PPE issue. Its pretty much flooded the doctor's group facebooks and this is just a microcosm of whats available on there as material to highlight the issue.
 
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