2019 Coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) hits the UK

Laureline

Well-known Member
France have handled the pandemic better than the UK throughout.

Ooh I don't know we got off to a poor start, the UK was vaccinating your old people and we were still arguing about supplies of AZ from the EU :)

Macron's comments about AZ being "quasi-ineffective" didn't help the initial uptake of vaccination

Certainly there were a lot of early deaths that might have been avoided. Don't forget we're charging our former Minister for Health for being ineffective

 

Brian The Dog

Well-known Member
France have handled the pandemic better than the UK throughout.
We were leading the world in the vaccination programme and got lucky so many times just by guessing: But as usual, this country has great ideas and then doesn't capitalise on any of them. We keep dropping the ball.
 

Emyj74

Active Member
I did not say that.

But Idefetto those who have more knowledge, for example the CMOs for starters. Plus those public health and medical experts that they admitted they had consulted with over the 10 days.

Do you feel that you have more knowledge, expertise and experience than any of those?
You haven't explained what they said. I haven't seen them say that 1 dose of vaccine will reduce infections by more than 50%.

All I have I seen scientists say is it will reduce infections which it will.

The issue I have is there seems to be an idea that the majority of children getting the vaccine won't be able to catch covid which there doesn't seem any evidence to support.

I see people complaining that their child caught covid which wouldn't have happened if they had the vaccine.

There doesn't seem any evidence to support this
 

D'@ve

Well-known Member
Possibly not quite what you’re after, but this was discussed on the R4 Today programme this morning (@2 hr 50 min): Today - 14/09/2021 - BBC Sounds

Thank you, it is exactly what I wanted to know!

Both experts said wait for about 90 days after a covid infection before having the jab, from first principles to allow the immune system to fully recover from the effects of the infection.

I hope this kind of information is included in the guidance provided for 12-15 year olds vaccinations, assuming that the risk-benefit balance is still sufficiently positive for those previously infected. If not, that needs to be stated too!
 

Vice

Active Member

jamesp26

Well-known Member
There's a good deal of political opposition to the 12-15 vaccing decision with many tory MPs speaking out against it in the commons last night and urging the govt to rethink.

They were quite successful in forcing a rethink on the vaccine passport issue so they might have some luck on this issue as well.

11.03 on the guardian live politics:

Boris Johnson says he will not rule out ‘plan B’ of vaccine passports, masks and homeworking – as it happened

Yes, I watched it last night and was astonished (not) to see it was a certain type of conservative. Iain Duncan smith, Graham Brady, Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, Marcus Fysh. Many on the 1922 committee and the made up CRG. These guys all have form, so pardon me if I find there motives suspicious.
 

Vice

Active Member
Yes, I watched it last night and was astonished (not) to see it was a certain type of conservative. Iain Duncan smith, Graham Brady, Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, Marcus Fysh. Many on the 1922 committee and the made up CRG. These guys all have form, so pardon me if I find there motives suspicious.

I don't usually agree with that wing of the tory party, but in this case I do, and we're lucky in this country that there is effective political scrutiny and pushback on these issues, if not so much from the actual opposition.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
Detailed thread here looking at the "Plan".

Just a pity the "Plan" is lacking in detail.

And he's echoing here what I said a few days back, about introducing lighter measures earlier to try and stave off needing tougher ones later.

Why do I think we'll make the same mistakes yet again....

 

Sloppy Bob

Distinguished Member
That's not very honest.

Boris laid out a firm plan that ultimately, would lead to, you know, if it's not too inconvenient and it can be fitted in, that the government would definitely, maybe, well... possibly, in the fullness of time and pending the results of scientific advice get around to doing something after test leaking it and taking a drive to a Northern castle.

There.
 

jamesp26

Well-known Member
I knew the decision to vaccinate children would be divisive, but i wasn't really prepared for such reporting already.

'Has been' Rachel Elnaugh accuses Chris Whitty of child abuse -
Ex-Dragons' Den star slammed for saying Chris Whitty 'will hang'

This article is particularly disgusting. I know its the Mail but we all have to realise this website has some of the largest reach:


Why are we jabbing millions of kids who are at almost no risk of Covid simply to keep teachers at work after a year of doing almost nothing

A year of almost nothing? Unreal.
 

rustybin

Distinguished Member
Militant teacher unions? They allowed us all to go to work throughout all of this with no PPE and no idea of how it would impact us.

And at no point stopped us working.

I wish they were a bit more militant.

Shame on the Mail for printing that.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
Dan Wootton, nuff said. Couldn't talk more sh*t if he tried, it just rolls off his tongue naturally.

So the truth will be far from anything in that article.
 

Judge Mental

Well-known Member
I don't have the time to respond to everyone's quotes individually but what I'm going to say is if they don't need parental consent to get vaccinated then they shouldn't need parental consent to go on school trips, to name one example.

Edit: and please don't mistake this for me being anti vax, I had both my jabs the very first chance I got.
Totally different issue. With vaccinated the consideration is about whether young people are competent to give informed consent. If they are not then vaccination in the absence of parental consent would be considered assault. Young girls are already allowed to exercise choice about contraception without parental consent and this is no different.
 

AnneZiety

Well-known Member
You haven't explained what they said. I haven't seen them say that 1 dose of vaccine will reduce infections by more than 50%.

All I have I seen scientists say is it will reduce infections which it will.

The issue I have is there seems to be an idea that the majority of children getting the vaccine won't be able to catch covid which there doesn't seem any evidence to support.

I see people complaining that their child caught covid which wouldn't have happened if they had the vaccine.

There doesn't seem any evidence to support this
Chris Smith, "The Naked Scientist" who regularly pops up on the BBC was saying on Radio 2 yesterday that vaccination reduces transmission by 50%-70% due to a combination of (a) people not getting infected and (b) those who do get infected spread it less, but mainly (a). This was effectively repeating something I heard Whitty say a couple of months which I suspected was a pre-delta stat, so it appears not to have changed (much).

However, he was surely referring to double vaccination. So no idea what it'll be for one, but somewhat less. Haven't seen any figures on that, although we can leap to conclusion on trial data and vaccine effectiveness of one jab, which IIRC is not too good for delta.
 

CoolSharpHarp

Active Member
Funny how a ruling establishing medical consent in children since 1985 is suddenly deemed unacceptable by people who are definitely not anti vaccine.
There's a difference between something that is used in limited circumstances versus a nation roll out of vaccine still being used under emergency use, which it's use is quite contentious for children.
 

inkinoo

Distinguished Member
There's a difference between something that is used in limited circumstances versus a nation roll out of vaccine still being used under emergency use, which it's use is quite contentious for children.
It’s been used with MMR and other vaccines since 1985. Yes it was clarified because of contraception but certainly has applied to vaccines.

As for the emergency use line, that doesn’t mean it isn’t safe and the data from the billions of shots administered confirms that it is safe.
 

Ian Thompson

Active Member
just walked past a barber shop and neither the barbers nor the customers were wearing masks. I'm surprised at how little mask wearing there is now in my part of London.
My local barbers in North East England has been the same as well since reopening in 2020 and not wearing masks. So since 2020 I've gone further afield to go to a barbers that do wear masks.
 

CoolSharpHarp

Active Member
It’s been used with MMR and other vaccines since 1985. Yes it was clarified because of contraception but certainly has applied to vaccines.

As for the emergency use line, that doesn’t mean it isn’t safe and the data from the billions of shots administered confirms that it is safe.
Those vaccines have been around for years, which isn't the same as the current crop.

It's not comparable while you still have investigation like the one below. We still don't know the full long term affects, which for kids is much more serious.

 

Morden

Well-known Member
Those vaccines have been around for years, which isn't the same as the current crop.

It's not comparable while you still have investigation like the one below. We still don't know the full long term affects, which for kids is much more serious.

The vaccines are based on ones being developed for Sars and Mers.

The research that helped to develop vaccines against the new coronavirus didn’t start in January. For years, researchers had been paying attention to related coronaviruses, which cause SARS (severe acute respiratory syndrome) and MERS (Middle East respiratory syndrome), and some had been working on new kinds of vaccine — an effort that has now paid off spectacularly.

The lightning-fast quest for COVID vaccines — and what it means for other diseases
 

Maeght

Well-known Member
Chris Smith, "The Naked Scientist" who regularly pops up on the BBC was saying on Radio 2 yesterday that vaccination reduces transmission by 50%-70% due to a combination of (a) people not getting infected and (b) those who do get infected spread it less, but mainly (a). This was effectively repeating something I heard Whitty say a couple of months which I suspected was a pre-delta stat, so it appears not to have changed (much).

However, he was surely referring to double vaccination. So no idea what it'll be for one, but somewhat less. Haven't seen any figures on that, although we can leap to conclusion on trial data and vaccine effectiveness of one jab, which IIRC is not too good for delta.
On the BBC this morning he mentioned 30% after one jab - or at least that was mentioned in a conversation he was involved in (can't remember if he said it or someone else did).
 
Last edited:

CoolSharpHarp

Active Member
The vaccines are based on ones being developed for Sars and Mers.



The lightning-fast quest for COVID vaccines — and what it means for other diseases
You're not comparing apples with apples though. You have the MMR that's actually been used for years, which I didn't think twice about when my kids were offered. Against one that hasn't been used for long and research, such as my link, is still ongoing. I just don't get the rush, when the balance of risk is so finely balanced.
 

The latest video from AVForums

Movies Podcast: Star Trek in 4K. Is the new boxset worth it?
Subscribe to our YouTube channel

Latest News

Roku announces new Streaming Stick 4K and OS 10.5
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
T+A announces high end 200 Series audio components
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Trinnov Altitude update adds new features
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Panasonic TVs welcome Disney+
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published
Audio Research announces I/50 integrated valve amp
  • By Andy Bassett
  • Published

Full fat HDMI teeshirts

Support AVForums with Patreon

Top Bottom