2019 Coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) hits the UK

rustybin

Distinguished Member
Where is the reference to 'anyone who doesn't 100% follow Boris's interpretation of the data'?
OK, if we're being pedantic. Any one who questions the current state of affairs. Which are a direct result of Boris's interpretation of the data.
 

Maeght

Active Member
OK, if we're being pedantic. Any one who questions the current state of affairs. Which are a direct result of Boris's interpretation of the data.
It's what you said, it's not being pedantic. I don't know what Johnson's interpretation of the data is, and we won't really know what that is until Monday, but I know that a number of scientists are concerned about the trends. If you look at the definition of not looking beyond the end of your nose it refers to a lack of foresight, seeing only immediate events or problems and not specifically that someone is stupid.
 

rustybin

Distinguished Member
It's what you said, it's not being pedantic. I don't know what Johnson's interpretation of the data is, and we won't really know what that is until Monday, but I know that a number of scientists are concerned about the trends. If you look at the definition of not looking beyond the end of your nose it refers to a lack of foresight, seeing only immediate events or problems and not specifically that someone is stupid.

I said (sorry, wrote) 'increasing suggestion that'. Not '100% definitely said someone was'.

As to call a fellow member stupid is against the rules.

And we do know what his current interpretation of the data is. As it's the situation today.
 

IronGiant

Moderator
"Can't see further than the end of their nose" is not a comment on intelligence, dim witted-ness or stupidity but that's not the comment rusty referred to.
 

Marellak

Active Member
Apologies, in fairness I would be better off not even defining a gender (although that quickly becomes a whole other topic) as I don't really tend to view a poster in any particular way. Much like age, it's easy to misconstrue with out a face. Hopefully my point though is fair regarding the overwhelming of the nhs. I've seen your posts as being incredibly insightful and sometimes they seem to be glazed over. It's almost like people avoid responding when you have pointed out that they are incorrect as it doesn't fit their point.

May i ask what your thoughts are on the potential for a short delay on removing all restrictions?
That's okay, it's just something I was surprised about on DS as I automatically think that my name alone reveals my gender, let alone my job (most nurses are female, even in ICU). I'm beginning to think I must post in a masculine style.

I don't have a personal opinion on the removal of all restrictions, except that I trust the government's medical and scientific advisers to make that call. If they believe and advise that we need a delay, from the data coming through, then we need a delay.

It won't particularly affect the way we currently work in the NHS, one way or the other, we will still need the various admission pathways (green, amber, red) because we are still regularly admitting covid patients, we still need to abide by all the strict infection control precautions which make us less efficient.

I don't feel like I'm in lockdown at the moment, I have a lot of personal freedom. I have no desire for a foreign holiday. I would like to get to Ireland to see my folks without the need for an expensive and uncomfortable PCR test but I can book a flight there at the moment if I chose to. The problem is that Ireland's restrictions are only being very gradually lifted and they currently have less freedom than we do (but things are slowly opening up there now too, it seems). There is no urgency since my folks are fine - my 87 year old dad has been on his tractor mowing meadows (he's a farmer with two farms to manage), he seems to have more energy than I do.

We certainly don't want to get into a third surge. We are at a manageable workload at the moment but we wouldn't cope well with a return to the way we work when numbers surge. Enhanced PPE was bad enough in winter but it's almost unbearable to wear in summer (very few wards have air conditioning, the new ICU that we opened last year hasn't closed - the old one is now closed - but not all the bays in the newer unit have air con).

Hopefully, the government will abide by what the expert advisers say.
 
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richp007

Distinguished Member
One can assume then given all the conversation that has taken place here, that if the data does indeed show that an extension to June 21st is prudent, there'll be no quibbles from anyone?

As people seem to be in agreement now that we should follow the data, wherever it leads.
 

The Thorne

Active Member
One can assume then given all the conversation that has taken place here, that if the data does indeed show that an extension to June 21st is prudent, there'll be no quibbles from anyone?

As people seem to be in agreement now that we should follow the data, wherever it leads.
You can dream but it goes both ways, no moaning when we do open by end of July as c'mon a betting man knows its going to be extended 2 weeks at least.
 

rustybin

Distinguished Member
One can assume then given all the conversation that has taken place here, that if the data does indeed show that an extension to June 21st is prudent, there'll be no quibbles from anyone?

As people seem to be in agreement now that we should follow the data, wherever it leads.
It'll be the same people interpreting data which allowed India to stay open, and which allowed holidays to Portugal 2 weeks ago etc. People seem to be happy to support the government's interpretation of the data IF it directly correlates with their own opinion.
 

mitch

Distinguished Member
It'll be the same people interpreting data which allowed India to stay open, and which allowed holidays to Portugal 2 weeks ago etc. People seem to be happy to support the government's interpretation of the data IF it directly correlates with their own opinion.
The data was nothing to do with India and was everything to do with Bozo flying out there to try and secure a trade deal.
 

richp007

Distinguished Member
It'll be the same people interpreting data which allowed India to stay open, and which allowed holidays to Portugal 2 weeks ago etc. People seem to be happy to support the government's interpretation of the data IF it directly correlates with their own opinion.

The data didn't allow India to stay open, that was a political decision because Johnson wanted to play jingo with the EU over trade deals. He owns that and what's happened since.

Personally I'll be looking to the likes of Murdoch and Ward to see if their data supports whatever the government decide. But right now it appears to be heading the same way, so I'm not anticipating a problem with interpretation this time around.

The picture should be a lot clearer.
 

rustybin

Distinguished Member
The data didn't allow India to stay open, that was a political decision because Johnson wanted to play jingo with the EU over trade deals. He owns that and what's happened since.

Personally I'll be looking to the likes of Murdoch and Ward to see if their data supports whatever the government decide. But right now it appears to be heading the same way, so I'm not anticipating a problem with interpretation this time around.

The picture should be a lot clearer.
I didn't say the data did allow that!!!

I said that the people interpreting the data allowed India to stay open.
 

D'@ve

Active Member
It'll be the same people interpreting data which allowed India to stay open, and which allowed holidays to Portugal 2 weeks ago etc. People seem to be happy to support the government's interpretation of the data IF it directly correlates with their own opinion.
Some of us just follow the data ourselves, read what the scientists say... and judge the government and its decision making accordingly. They've mostly done well so far this year (except IMO on foreign travel) but If they do get it wrong again, like last year, they will be suitably and harshly criticised, you can be sure of that.
 

Platelet

Well-known Member
One can assume then given all the conversation that has taken place here, that if the data does indeed show that an extension to June 21st is prudent, there'll be no quibbles from anyone?

As people seem to be in agreement now that we should follow the data, wherever it leads.
I'll complain. I'm sick of people suggesting June 21st is extended, moved, postponed etc

June 21st should happen on June 21st and should run for the normal 24hrs. Buggering with it will probably wreck all sorts of calendars. :rolleyes:

Quite happy if they want to move the lifting of the restrictions to a different date of course
 

rustybin

Distinguished Member
Some of us just follow the data ourselves, read what the scientists say... and judge the government and its decision making accordingly. They've mostly done well so far this year (except IMO on foreign travel) but If they do get it wrong again, like last year, they will be suitably and harshly criticised, you can be sure of that.
And therein lies the point re: 'follow the data / science'.

You've followed it and (presumably) believe the Govt shouldn't have allowed / allow foreign travel.

The Government has followed it and decided it should be allowed.


Mr Lundgren revealed a study commissioned from epidemiologists at Yale University's school of public health that indicated that unrestricted travel to some of the most popular holiday destinations would increase hospital admissions by 4%.
(this is pre-variant)

The data / science is completely up for debate and interpretation. And some of it can be completely ignored depending on what people personally believe.
 

Doctor Wibble

Active Member
...

Mr Lundgren revealed a study commissioned from epidemiologists at Yale University's school of public health that indicated that unrestricted travel to some of the most popular holiday destinations would increase hospital admissions by 4%.
(this is pre-variant)

The data / science is completely up for debate and interpretation. And some of it can be completely ignored depending on what people personally believe.
For anyone confused, that's Johan, not Dolph.
 

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