2019 Coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) hits the UK

Sloppy Bob

Distinguished Member
It's done nothing but give oxygen to fringe groups, allowing them to ignore the good of public health over "freedom".

It pushes natural "herd Immunity", we can see where that's going in Brazil and everyone here bar a few can see it is and always has been complete nonsense. The senior scientists involved have been proved wrong at multiple stages across the globe about the pandemic and you still see it as a shining beacon, what you're actually looking at is the fire.

Basically, it promotes us all just living with COVID, develop herd immunity naturally and lock up the old and infirm.

It's bollocks. We needed a vaccine, we have multiple. That's the way forward.
 

starfarer

Well-known Member
The contraceptive pill has a 0.3% risk for context.

I'm a woman of 33 and already had my first dose of AZ two weeks ago. I'm booked in for the second on 10th June and not worried at all. Mass vaccination is both how we get out of this pandemic and how you get further data on potential side effects and if anything needs tweaking. It's the same for all medication, it's just never highlighted in the press to this extent. Even something we consider as mundane as paracetamol comes with a sheet of side effect warnings. This is just the regulator doing their job. Something else could crop up once other vaccines go into mass use to the extent of AZ, nothing comes without risk. But the point still stands that benefits to life far outweigh the random off chance of a severe side effect.

Medication and vaccination has different standard. Vaccines are the most safest medical product. You're wrong on bolded part. You don't wait until vaccine's serious effect (deaths in this case) starts to become statistically significance. Normally you'll have "pauses" if deaths are reported and suspected from directly caused by vaccines.

Risk/Benefit for covid19 so far is very dependent on age and health factor. I just watched BBC news and Fergus Walsh directly compared the risk% from road traffic accident for under 30's :facepalm:. One is measured over very long time.
 

acatweasel

Well-known Member
Yes, we differ in our conclusions, and the scientists we trust.

I believe that life is for living, as a good friend of mine often says, "We are here for a good time, not a long time." I see posters here whose quality of life seems to be measured purely in longevity.

On here there is a majority who agree with "the science" that is being promoted. I was even told that The Great Barrington Declaration "had been completely disproved". I'm still intrigued to know where that happened.
As soon as I read it.
 
Yes, we differ in our conclusions, and the scientists we trust.

I believe that life is for living, as a good friend of mine often says, "We are here for a good time, not a long time." I see posters here whose quality of life seems to be measured purely in longevity.

On here there is a majority who agree with "the science" that is being promoted. I was even told that The Great Barrington Declaration "had been completely disproved". I'm still intrigued to know where that happened.

I fully agree with that. But you ain't gonna have a good time by failing to deal with a pandemic this serious. That's for damn sure.
 

Brian The Dog

Well-known Member
It's done nothing but give oxygen to fringe groups, allowing them to ignore the good of public health over "freedom".

It pushes natural "herd Immunity", we can see where that's going in Brazil and everyone here bar a few can see it is and always has been complete nonsense. The senior scientists involved have been proved wrong at multiple stages across the globe about the pandemic and you still see it as a shining beacon, what you're actually looking at is the fire.

Basically, it promotes us all just living with COVID, develop herd immunity naturally and lock up the old and infirm.

It's bollocks. We needed a vaccine, we have multiple. That's the way forward.

Well you know my plain speaking:

Bring in Covid Passports and insist that they are needed in all the places the kiddies want to go.

There is their freedom of choice: Don't take the vaccine (their free choice) and others must be protected from them.

See how long it takes for them to queue up.
 

SKP

Active Member
Yes for THEM!

What about the risk they pose to OTHERS?

Without the vaccination they can spread it to more people and create more variants.
This is it and there will be many who are on certain medications or have certain conditions that mean they cannot be vaccinated so they are at risk of those who do not wish to be vaccinated.

Its the same with some parents who choose not to have their kids vaccinated say against measles as they do not agree with vaccines, their answer when told it can make others seriously ill or even kill them ( 1 in 1,000 measles cases moves on to cute encephalitis and that very often means permanent brain damage and between 1 and 3 in every 1000 kids who get measles die from respiratory and neurological issues ) well they should get vaccinated so their unvaccinated child is not a risk to them , they have no thought for those who cannot be vaccinated and at the sme time no thought for their own child and what could happen to them
 

Brian The Dog

Well-known Member
This is it and there will be many who are on certain medications or have certain conditions that mean they cannot be vaccinated so they are at risk of those who do not wish to be vaccinated.

Its the same with some parents who choose not to have their kids vaccinated say against measles as they do not agree with vaccines, their answer when told it can make others seriously ill or even kill them ( 1 in 1,000 measles cases moves on to cute encephalitis and that very often means permanent brain damage and between 1 and 3 in every 1000 kids who get measles die from respiratory and neurological issues ) well they should get vaccinated so their unvaccinated child is not a risk to them , they have no thought for those who cannot be vaccinated and at the sme time no thought for their own child and what could happen to them
Yes all of that plus why should even the vaccinated people have to get flu like symptoms from people who refuse to get vaccinated? We need protection from the people who refuse.

Of course the only answer is to get anyone who can be vaccinated, vaccinated.
 

inkinoo

Well-known Member
Your normal, trying to shut down anyone who disagrees.
Given you tried to suggest that Sweden was an example of how to do things, despite it having a much higher death rate than its neighbours who locked down, best you leave discussions on “the science” to those who actually follow it.

The fact you think The Great Barrington plan is viable, despite it being completely disproved, shows you just don’t listen or understand the science.

Stay away from Talk Radio, it will do you no good.
 
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inkinoo

Well-known Member

Wow.

Literally the first post you have made about herd immunity that wasn’t rambling nonsense. Maybe you are learning!

What is most galling is that last year you were insistent in believing Professor Gupta when she said in July 2020 we had reached herd immunity. You were wildly criticised but yet you ploughed on, insisting she was right and there was no need for lockdowns.

Spin forward to now, you are posting about herd immunity again, without any shame for how disastrously wrong you were before.

Staggering.
 
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inkinoo

Well-known Member
B0704F13-51AD-4469-B231-F042BFE27B3A.jpeg


Being told we are following “the science” by someone who thinks wearing a mask weakens your immune system.

None so blind than those who won’t see.

Also I will let you guess which other Ian liked the comment.
 

DarthFenian

Active Member
Wow.

Literally the first post you have made about herd immunity that wasn’t rambling nonsense. Maybe you are learning!

What is most galling is that last year you were insistent in believing Professor Gupta when she said in July 2020 we had reached herd immunity. You were wildly criticised but yet you ploughed on, insisting she was right and there was no need for lockdowns.

Spin forward to now, you are posting about herd immunity again, without any shame for how disastrously wrong you were before.

Staggering.
Don't want to get involved in your argument so I've just a simple question to ask. If that link is correct and the UK will reach herd immunity by Monday would that mean that essentially the pandemic would be over for us ?
 

Iain42

Well-known Member
Stay away from Talk Radio, it will do you no good.

Why? Because it asks questions that you don't like? It isn't "on message"?

Interesting to see what's happening in the like of Tuebingen in Germany.
 

inkinoo

Well-known Member
Don't want to get involved in your argument so I've just a simple question to ask. If that link is correct and the UK will reach herd immunity by Monday would that mean that essentially the pandemic would be over for us ?

There is a minimum level needed for herd immunity, much in the same way there is a minimum level of oil you need in your car.

We need to carry on vaccinating, especially as the age ranges are skewed towards the older population, to have a real shot at effective herd immunity.
 

inkinoo

Well-known Member
Why? Because it asks questions that you don't like? It isn't "on message"?

Interesting to see what's happening in the like of Tuebingen in Germany.

It’s owned by Rupert Murdoch! It couldn’t be any more on message.

You bleat on about MSM and have Murdoch as your news source. Genius!
 

acatweasel

Well-known Member
Don't want to get involved in your argument so I've just a simple question to ask. If that link is correct and the UK will reach herd immunity by Monday would that mean that essentially the pandemic would be over for us ?
If the link was correct, I’d be massively surprised. We have Vaccinated less than 50% of our total population with the first shot.
I hope they are right on their estimates of acquired immunity, but 73% total still leaves a population of over 15m for the virus to run around in.
As usual our media are taking what appears to be a single scientists work and trumpeting it from the rooftops. His work has been submitted to SAGE sub committee along with a few others that are nowhere near as optimistic.
By the way, Professor Friston is a neurologist and an authority of brain scanning. :thumbsdow
 

Sammyez

Well-known Member
Wow.

Literally the first post you have made about herd immunity that wasn’t rambling nonsense. Maybe you are learning!

What is most galling is that last year you were insistent in believing Professor Gupta when she said in July 2020 we had reached herd immunity. You were wildly criticised but yet you ploughed on, insisting she was right and there was no need for lockdowns.

Spin forward to now, you are posting about herd immunity again, without any shame for how disastrously wrong you were before.

Staggering.
Looking beyond the click bait headline...

‘However, UCL’s report warns: ‘Much like long-term weather forecasts, the ensuing predictions should not be taken too seriously because there is an inherent (although quantified) uncertainty about underlying epidemiological and socio-behavioural variables.’

‘The university’s predictions are a stark contrast to the Office for National Statistics’ (ONS) most recent figures stating that around half of Britons now have antibodies’

UK could reach herd immunity 'within days', say scientists
 

Har-One

Member
Medication and vaccination has different standard. Vaccines are the most safest medical product. You're wrong on bolded part. You don't wait until vaccine's serious effect (deaths in this case) starts to become statistically significance. Normally you'll have "pauses" if deaths are reported and suspected from directly caused by vaccines.
We do not wait for drugs' serious side effect to become statistically significant either. Drugs discovery is very often a long process. Testing millions of compounds to get a handful of possible candidates and those candidates will again be subjected to rigorous tests like solubility, toxicity, efficacy etc. It will be used in different double blind trials and if something goes wrong pauses and investigation will be made as well to stablish a possible link.

After they are approved, we keep an eye on them (which I think was her point) just in case a rare side effect manifest itself because it was not seen on the trials. It is something quite possible once the drug or vaccine is mass-used.
 

87gpk

Active Member
You have to weigh that up against getting Covid, and possibly severe symptoms of the disease.
I know and I honestly have been trying to. What are the figures roughly for percentage of positive cases of the population at present? I apologise for not looking, I’m trying to steer away from becoming too emotionally invested and just getting on with my own plans.

I’ve stuck to sanitising, mask wearing and social distancing for over a year now and am fairly sure I haven’t had coronavirus, if I double down on that by staying safe indoors and a form of shielding then my chances become low alongside with the 100% chance of not getting blood clots if don’t take the vaccine. I can’t get blood clots.
 
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87gpk

Active Member
Overall chance for everyone, yea chances increase in circumstances but that’s overall.

Weirdly you are actually more likely to get a blood clot if you don’t have the vaccine. The chance in general population is higher but that’s statistics for you
What are the ways to avoid a blood clot in general? It’s the mention of them that really worries me and I maintain that even a small chance you could be the unlucky one. I can be active enough to avoid being still for any long periods.
 

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