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2½ years on - Long Term Review

Discussion in 'Plasma TVs' started by cadmeister, Jun 2, 2005.

  1. cadmeister

    cadmeister
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    As a break from the information requests I thought I'd post some observations on 2½ years of plasma ownership.

    Take from this what you will...

    * I bought my Panny series 5 42 inch plasma in Nov 2002. It is accompanied by a JS Tech RGB->VGA convertor, a very middle of the road Sony all-in-one system and SKY+.
    * My initial worries (we all have them) were about lip sync and screen burn.
    * The Screen burn paranoia receeded after 2 months and now I have a healthy respect for turning off the screen when not in use, but I am not obsessed. I've never had a screen burn issue and I have two kids who watch cartoon network for hours on end.
    * The Lip sync issue subsided after 3 (slightly obsessive) months, and these days I barely notice sync errors though if I do, I know it's bad transmissions c/o the broadcaster
    * After all this time I finally got the screen wall mounted and it looks beautiful (pedestal for sale in the classified's)
    * I give out a little love to my screen every day - now it's wall mounted it's every hour.
    * Secretly my wife likes having a plasma. She's just never told me in person.
    * I still watch DVDs and get excited about the picture quality.

    If you are a potential newbie, relax, take a deep breathe and purchase. If you are an owner... respect.
     
  2. Enquirer

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    cadmeister i think long term reviews and details of your original concerns is a great idea!
    Posts like this can be helpful in putting potental buyers minds at ease.

    Nothing is better than listening or seeing real world concerns or problems resolved for gaining valuble knowledge.
    Magazine reviews of plasmas only focus on them when new.In What Car? for example they have long term tests and i often hold more credibility to that section of the mag than the first tests.
     
  3. FlyingBig

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    Is lip sync an issue with all plasmas? If so is it only noticeable through sky digital? I tell ya what, i would be raging if i plugged my dvd player in and noticed lip sync on a dvd. I have a dlp front projector in the house so i am aware that sky digital can be abit funny at time and lip sync can go on and off but to be honest i never expercted this to be an issue with a plasma. My front projector also has a very very slight issue with lip sync when connected to a dvd player but considering its a projector it is understandable but i would be very very disappointed if this applied to my plasma. I am buying a plasma tomorrow so quick feedback on this would be appreciated.
     
  4. MAW

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    OK some quick feedback then! Lipsync as a plasma issue as opposed to sky c**king it up before it gets that far, it can be a problem. It is noticeably worse with some screens (try the LG thread) but it can be noticeable on any. Normally in the pro install world where I operate, it's never a problem, cos we always put the sound through an AV amp with lip sync correction (audio delay) built in, like the Denon 2805 or Onkyo 602 as a minimum. Your problems arise with some TV plasmas, where scart connection is the sound and video direct to the TV. You are basically stuck with it then. In my experience, LG, Samsung, Pioneer, Hitachi, in decreasing order, are the usual suspects. As I say, it can afflict any plasma if it feels like it. We ALWAYS take precautions, have a 'get out of jail' card, or the customers get all soggy and hard to light!
     
  5. FlyingBig

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    Ok thanks for the feedback, i never realised it was such a big issue with plasmas, really does disappoint me to be honest but i guess i am stuck with it. You didn't mention Panasonic for whatever reason, so i assume you have no experience with a panasonic set or failed to mention it.
    I have an AV amp but it doesnt have a built in sound delay unless you are talking about the setting to do with speaker distance as this can delay the audio?
     
  6. hornydragon

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    I think you may find that the absence of panasonic is not due to MAW not dealing with them (quite the reverse is true in fact) you will have to ask MAW why he didnt mention panny tho
     
  7. MAW

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    Because they have the lowest incidence of lip sync issues. They are my mainstream product, for this and a whole host of other reasons. People complain at me about being panasonic biased. I am, cos they give me no hassle after sale.
     
  8. FlyingBig

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    ok right about now i have decided to put off my purchase of the pv500 i set my heart on as i just done a search for "lip sync" and found 3 pages full of ppl having problems with it. I have a projector so i know exactly what problem they are having and i have never been able to fix the lip sync issue with sky as it just too tempermental unlike the dvd player that is always out by a very small fraction and is noticable at times so my fear is that the pv500 will suffer from the exact same problem. To be honest i can unerstand a front projector having issues but a TV with integreated speaker? No way, in fact its down right disgrace that it should happen. I can use my Toshiba 20 inch tv and have NO lip sync issues ever yet i am willing to pay over £2000 for a new spanking tv that might have lip sync issues. What to do, what to do.
     
  9. Enquirer

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    What to do! sort out your lip sync problem with your front projector! :D
    So you have a HS30 with a HTPC what external audio amp are you using? Does it have centre channel delay?
     
  10. MarkR

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    Reading through this thread with interest where at the bottom I noticed this sponsored ad for lip sync.

    Click here

    Not really a lot of money for only £139.95, especially when your spending over £2,000 on the screen. There maybe cheaper ones but it is certainly worth looking into. :cool:
     
  11. Piers

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    I would bet that if you get up really close to your 20" TV and deliberately look for lip sync issues with a Sky feed you will see them. Blow the image size up to a 42" plasma or a projector and it will be obvious from a normal viewing distance if you are a critical viewer. To my amazement some people seem almost oblivious to it, but perhaps who am I to talk - I'm not affected by DLP rainbows to any great extent, yet some find them totally objectionable.

    Have to agree with MAW - global audio delay is a must as far as I am concerned - lost 4 ISF calibrations for one client yesterday because the supplier of the kit hadn't specified an amp that could do it - all the customer was interested in was why the sound didn't seem right, totally oblivious to the huge improvement in PQ that had resulted from changing from composite to RGB and a very quick demo of how correct grey scale does the business.

    Whether integrated "TV plasmas" should have variable audio delay built in is another question - adds to the cost and another "control" that some consumers may not want. Panel, not TV, every time for me.
     
  12. FlyingBig

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    Can it be used to delay the sound with the tv speakers or do i have to use my amp? I really dont want to use my amp as i have two big floor standers and i dont want to arrange the whole room around the plasma as its not the biggest room in the world and it would mean i would have to rearrange EVERYTHING in my room.
     
  13. FlyingBig

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    It doesnt have an audio delay, only allows me to set distance i am away from the speakers, will this be enough of a delay? I have a Marantz av amp btw.
     
  14. hornydragon

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    avoidable lip sync (not the stuff that happens when broacaster or disc producers stuff it up) is often less of a problem with Plasma TV's as there Audio and video circuitry should be designed to introduce the same amount of delay, the delay that is prevent able almost always comes from a digital audio feed which is processed faster than the video feed hence the sound is ahead of the picture, if sound is behind the pictures its not really anything you can do about it................often flciking between DD and DTS sound tracks on older amps can remove the lip sync as the older chips sets are faster to decode DD than DTS. It is a potential issue but often what people are complaining of isnt preventable!!!!
     
  15. MarkR

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    Yeah it does only work from an amp, shame you cant run the sound from the floor standers. Extremly frustrating that the intergrated speakers suffer from lip sync, I can fully understand your frustration.

    You could always buy some extra speakers just for the plasma........ :rolleyes:
     
  16. FlyingBig

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    I really need someone to confirm that the pv500 does not suffer from lip sync when using a dvd player.
     
  17. Piers

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    And most people don't worry too much about that. Its when sound is ahead of vision (which you never see in real life) that it looks all wrong.
     
  18. hornydragon

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    PV500 comes with speakers...................
     
  19. FlyingBig

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    I think what he is trying to say is that if the audio is out of sync there is no way of delaying the audio from the speakers attached to the pv500, if i had seperate speakers i could use them with my amp and delay the audio.
     
  20. hornydragon

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    what i am trying to say is this is the least problematic area as audio and video processing is done in the same unit (also easy to test just go to a chain store with one on demo and turn sound up for a bit)
     
  21. FlyingBig

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    Then my question is why is it when you type in "lip Sync" on the plasma forum you get 3 pages of results, there is an obvious problem and ppl in this post have stated there is lip sync issues so the tv internal speakers aren't doing there job properely or ppl on this forum are talking ****. One of the other.
    I was going to purchase the pv500 tomorrow but now i am not as this has raised a few questions that need answered for definate before i fork out £2000 of my hard earned cash. I'll be looking for those answers when i get back from work tomorrow. Thanks everyone for your feedback, you have been most helpful. :smashin:
     
  22. hornydragon

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    I say should! thats why you need to demo the biggest lip sync issue is from broadcasts not kit, or very poorly designed kit ala Tiny i havent looked for it specifically, but if the Panny PV500 has serious lip sync issues then there is an issue manufacturers know about this and should by now have introduced appropriate internal compensation for video processing. As i say you need to demo peoples sensitivity varies a lot.............
    I think we have taken this thread off topic enough
     
  23. John

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    Agree with you MAW , I route the sound from Sky via opt to amp , Dont use any delay , and never had/noticed any lip sync issues . Extra procesing in the amp makes up for the extra processing in the plasma .

    The real reason for the original post ;) :rotfl:

    I'm still happy with my Hit after 12 months , just the amp speakes and DVD player to upgrade (don't tell the wife)

    John
     
  24. cadmeister

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    Okaaaaaaaaay... I seem to have started a lip sync thread. As I said.. I used to be obsessed with it but I'm over it. It was never a problem on DVDs, just SKY and their broadcasting, and my screen is a Panasonic. As stated on one of the threads, if I wonder back to my lil portable in the kitchen the sync problem is there just much harder to spot. For the record, I tried an audio delay unit way back when I was worried about it. It worked, sort of, but was way too much hassle (you'll find my threads on it somewhere). My original point was... I don't even notice it these days.

    :rolleyes:
     
  25. Enquirer

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    I love when you stop checking for flaws and just enjoy the film or programme.

    I watched revenge of the Sith at the Showcase cinema in MCR and the picture was moved up and down for the first twenty minutes or so and the sound was poor,then a week later i watched it again at the Filmworks DLP projector at first i was checking the picture quality out (which is amazing)then after about two minutes i was completely engrossed in the Movie it was like watching a different movie and a whole different experience.

    When i first buy a product i do nit pick and see if i can see or hear the flaws others have.
    Sometimes you can convince yourself they are there even when they are not!
     
  26. MarkR

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    Yes I know it comes with speakers, I was replying to this....
     
  27. chedmaster

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    if i had the opportunity to buy a pv500 right now i would not be on here discussing lipsync!!! think yourself lucky you can afford the dam thing and either

    1) be cheap and dont buy a surround system (like going to a cinema and listening through a shower radio), look for lipsync so much that you trick yourself into thinking you see it, cry, and post the pv500 to me.

    2) buy the tv, dont look for lipsync and you wont find it, and thank god he has graced you with this wonderful bit of kit

    3) buy the tv the sound it deserves, and if you see lipsync without looking for it, delay it!

    it annoys me so much when people dont appreciate what they have/can get and just look for more. I know its your hard earned cash, but after seeing one there is no beating a pv500 so just buy it!
     
  28. chedmaster

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    ps i know the inbuilt speakers are good, just trying to make my point
     

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