180m cable run help

Discussion in 'Satellite TV, Sky TV & FreeSat' started by tmsjns, Feb 23, 2014.

  1. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    So I have a cable run of 180m from dish to box and its been working fine until recently, As its not a standard install sky said they wont touch it so im going to have to replace the cable myself.
    my question is, Im going to buy 200m of wf125 and split that in two then the extra bits will be wf100 with inline signal booster at the joins, will this work or should i just fork out the extra cash and get it all wf125?
     
  2. kevkbuk

    kevkbuk
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2011
    Messages:
    5,988
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    133
    Ratings:
    +1,170
    Would it not be easier, cheaper and more reliable to install a second dish a little closer?
     
  3. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    the only place i can get any signal is where the dish is now, I live on the side of a tree covered mountain on north wales and the dish needs to point over the mountain!
     
  4. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
  5. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    Www i didnt think of that, but how would it be powered?
     
  6. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    A single 12V wire provides the power

    optical lnb - Google Search
     
  7. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    So that would need to be plugged into mains whoch i dont have down near the dish, Could i use a low quality coax to carry the power supply and then send the signal back down an optical cable?
     
  8. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    would i only need one fibre optical cable to the virtual splitter or wpuld j need two seperate cables as i have sky+?
    Sorry about all the questions im new to this! and thanks for the help!
     
  9. Trollslayer

    Trollslayer
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Messages:
    26,066
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Poole
    Ratings:
    +10,917
    The signal problem isn't just about signal loss but dispersion (smearing) which optical seems to handle much better than coax.
    For example this company supply ready made optical leads up to 200m:
    Fibre Optics
    You may need to run a higher supply voltage (e.g. 48V) over power cable then regulate down to 12V near the dish.
     
  10. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    Just one. You will also need a new dish if you have a Sky Minidish as the lnb is a non standard size (it's a smaller diameter than a standard 40mm one). It won't be cheap but neither is 360 metres of WF125.
     
  11. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
  12. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    the sky guy said he would give me a zone 2 dish would that be conpatible with a optical lnb?
    Its is quite expensive but around that same price as wf125, im guessig the optical would eb more reliable?
     
  13. Trollslayer

    Trollslayer
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Messages:
    26,066
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Poole
    Ratings:
    +10,917
    But coax cable still leaves the dispersion risk at that distance.
    I used SDI cable for large scale distribution and that was rated for up to 100m.
     
  14. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    No the lnb fittings are the same and the oval shape of the dish requires a lnb with the correct shape feedhorn.

    Guessing here (Trollslayer will have a better idea) a 54/60cm round dish should do the job.

    eg

    Satellite dishes. Transparent satellite dishes. Sky dish, freesat dish, mobile dish, Large satellite dishes 54cm - 4.5m. Prime focus. Fixed satellite dishes, Low prices. UK.

    The optical solution will also allow you to add extra receivers should you want more than 1 satellite box.
     
  15. Trollslayer

    Trollslayer
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Messages:
    26,066
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Poole
    Ratings:
    +10,917
    Dish size is based on location, looking at signal strength maps Wales is within the 54cm area, in fact within 40cm:
    Dish Size Guide
    Maplin stock an adapter to fit a standard LNB:
    SKY LNB Adaptor Clip | Maplin
    One minor point - if it's on a mountain side make sure it has a solid mount!
     
  16. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    You just need a thin copper insulated wire run alongside the optical fibre. The current required is quite small but as Trollslayer says voltage drop might be an issue. Very simple to fit a DC voltage regulator at the dish end and use a higher voltage at the other end. A 12V DC regulator chip is a standard item.

    L78S12CV 2A Positive Fixed Voltage Regulator | Maplin
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2014
  17. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    Won't the feedhorn shape be an issue ?
     
  18. Trollslayer

    Trollslayer
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Messages:
    26,066
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Poole
    Ratings:
    +10,917
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2014
  19. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    on so im thinking along the lines of an optical lnb would i need a different dish for that even if its a "universal lnb"?
     
  20. Trollslayer

    Trollslayer
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Messages:
    26,066
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Poole
    Ratings:
    +10,917
    Check with the guy supplying the dish?
     
  21. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    Universal doesn't mean it will fit any dish, it means it's capable of receiving signals from the whole Ku band. To do this a conventional lnb has to operate in one of 4 modes (it's switched by the tuner).

    See

    LNB mysteries explained - part 1

    Note the notes on the specific shape of a skydish and the associated lnb required.
     
  22. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    it would be a standard sky issued zone 2 dish does that help?
     
  23. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    another question, would a quatro virtual conveter work to a single sky+ box? or would it have to be a quad virtual conveter
     
  24. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    Read the notes at the link. The optical lnb will be a standard 40mm collar designed to work with a dish that looks round from the offset lnb location. You can bodge such a lnb onto a Sky dish but it won't work as well as it should, it could for instance pick up unwanted interference as it looks past the Sky dish edges.

    The Maplin adaptor isn't cheap (£12.00) and a Triax 54/60 cm dish only costs about £30.00 or so. The larger dish will give you more bad weather margin (I guess you get plenty of this in Wales). If it was me I would buy the proper dish.
     
  25. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    Best to seek advice from the supplier of the kit. They should be able to advise exactly what you need.
     
  26. Trollslayer

    Trollslayer
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    Messages:
    26,066
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Poole
    Ratings:
    +10,917
    Good idea.
     
  27. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    Good news

    Fibre satellite distribution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  28. tmsjns

    tmsjns
    Novice Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    ok so im going for a 60cm dish with optical lnb then use the old coax cables to power the lnb but i cant get my head round where i would plug the coax into to run the power for the lnb from? did that make sense?
    then a attenuator a quad virtual converter and coax lines to the sky box, all speted except the power for he lnb, Any ideas on that?
     
  29. grahamlthompson

    grahamlthompson
    Distinguished Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2006
    Messages:
    24,544
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    166
    Location:
    Redditch
    Ratings:
    +4,187
    A power supply with a f connector output is supplied with the lnb according to the blurb. Presumably you just need a barrel connector to connect the power supply output to the cable end you are sending the power from. (You only need one cable).

    According to this picture you get the barrel connector as well

    Optical lnb power supply - Google Search
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2014
  30. MartinPickering

    MartinPickering
    Well-known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2009
    Messages:
    4,953
    Products Owned:
    0
    Products Wanted:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    136
    Location:
    Greek Island
    Ratings:
    +507
    Provided that your coaxial cable is copper-cored and not steel-cored, the voltage drop will be tolerable. Be sure to waterproof the connection to avoid electrolytic corrosion.
     

Share This Page

Loading...