18 Year old with 22 Championship appearances to City for £11m...

Discussion in 'Football' started by Nobbler, Jul 18, 2015.

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  1. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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    So it looks like Man City are going to add to their wealth of English talent sitting on the bench by aquiring 18 year old Patrick Roberts from Fulham for £5m rising to £11m with add ons...as a Fulham supporter this can only be good business for us particularly if we have a sell on clause.
    Roberts has played in 22 championship games (starting only a handful) and played for England U18's several times. It's these england games that got heads turning as thet's where he's done his bit. moving up a level or 2 into the championship saw him struggle with the physicality of it all (he's tiny) and to be honest, I saw nothing that warrants that kind of price tag for him.
    So if a player is worth this kind of money based on potential alone, the soul has finally gone out of the game. Obviously Roberts has been offered a lot more money at City (he was on £800 a week at fulham but was offered £3k on a new contract which he's obviously turned down) but will he even make the bench at City? at least at Fulham he was getting some game time...I know the feeling amongts the Fulham fans is cheers City thanks Pat good luck but this is a lad whose potential will never be achieved now due to complete and utter lack of game time. dare I mention Micah Richards and Scott Sinclair...?
     
  2. Abbeygoo

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    Wow .... where to start with this?

    Criticised for not having enough young English players, we are now being criticised for signing them.

    £5m rising to £11m clearly means there are a lot of appearance based milestones that would have to be reached before that kind of money changes hands.

    As for the sitting on the bench comment, you can mention Sinclair and Richards if you want (and I can chuck in Rodwell too if you like) but we also have had Lescott, Barry, Joe Hart and Milner chalking up loads of appearances between them and plenty of titles too.

    Obviously, he is going to go out on loan somewhere.
     
  3. Abbeygoo

    Abbeygoo
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    And it's to the detriment of the player that he will be joining our Elite Development Squad under the coaching skills of Patrick Vieira, world cup and euro championship winner?

    Bizarre logic some people have.
     
  4. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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    The only criricism (if any) aimed at City is really the "what City wants City gets" type attitude that is obviously getting about a bit now accross the football world. The rule about home grown players applies to ALL clubs but it seems that they think (and abviously can) watch other teams devslop the young English talent and just pluck it from their tree.

    Hell if they are throwing money about, we have a fantasic English prospect goalkeeper in Marcus Bettanelli who actually made over 40 championship appearances last season AND played at England U21 level...Chelsea are sniffing round him so I don't hols out much hope of us keeping him for much longer...

    I love watching football and I love the English national team but the big teams buying up all the young English prospects is going to do nothing for the national team in the long run if that's all they have to do - buy them...they should also have to to have some kind of interest in actually developing them as players and giving them game time...
     
  5. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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    Fulham's development squad is non too shabby either...I'll not go into specifics except to say that the current setup is the same Southampton setup that brought through all their English talent.
     
  6. Munkey Boy

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    He's going to play for the development team (EDS) and he's £2m, rising dependent on progression to the first team.

    But don't let the facts get in the way of a good swipe at City.
     
  7. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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  8. Munkey Boy

    Munkey Boy
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    It's not even you I'm particularly worried about - it's the general tone in the media these days.

    We paid £2m for him. Not £11m. If it does make it to the full amount, it means he's become a regular first team player - and who argues with that?

    The point is now there's a common myth amongst non-Mancunian based journalists that City are systematically ruining the careers of England's best prospects and it stinks. There's no club in the country where England players have won more medals for major trophies than City in the last five years, but you wouldn't guess it.

    Is Man City a graveyard for English players? Just count the medals! - Stuart Brennan - Manchester Evening News

    Was Wenger ruining the game when he signed Walcott for £5m rising to £14m for an untested 16 year old without a Premier League game under his belt?
     
  9. Munkey Boy

    Munkey Boy
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    Damn, the whole point of building one of the best training facilities available is to have some youngsters using it to progress. I mean, do these kids just drop out of the sky?
     
  10. John

    John
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    In any other field, been head hunted is seen as a mark of success. Being a professional footballer is a short career and you're a long time retired. If you have the talent and dedication, there is the chance to make oodles (avf official term) of money. What would of happened if he had got a career ending injury next week at Fulham ? At least now he will have some money to fall back on should it all go wrong.
    I would imagine he thinks he has the talent and dedication to make it, time will tell.
     
  11. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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    Well it seems I haven't plucked the £11m figure out of the sky as it seems Sky are reporting that figure as well...and Fulham have confirmed talks are at an advanced stage.
    There will be some pretty peed of Fulham supporters if the fee is £2M but it's looking more ad more like to be the reported up front fee with add ons...good luck to him.
    And this thread isn't meant to be a swipe at City but at English football in general - though there is a growing dread in the "lower" leagues that bringing any kind of English player through to improve your own squad for its own future will be a complete and utter waste of time. ..the fact is every club apart from the big 4 are selling clubs whether they like it or not.
     
  12. YNWA1892

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    What's the difference between City buying this player and Liverpool buying Gomez.

    I don't understand why this deserved a thread of its own either.
     
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  13. Munkey Boy

    Munkey Boy
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    OK, this I understand more. First off, I wasn't quibbling about the 8 or 11 million, either means the same thing, it was the thread title saying City spent 11m when they spent 2m. It's the constant use of maximums rather than actuals that I was getting at, apologies for the confusion.

    As for the rest of it, well, it's a bit of a pickle we're in isn't it, because the homegrown rule means any club HAVE TO have a certain number of players in their squad to be eligible for competition in either Europe or the Premier League. It is a stated aim of the rules to have more homegrown players at top clubs. This is going to keep happening and aim the fire at UEFA/the EPL to change it.

    As for the general picture, well it's tough. Don't think I don't know what it's like to have players poached year in year out, I've been following City for 25 years, and as long as transfer fees remain a thing, it's going to keep happening. Take solace in the fact that there's only so many players that can go to the clubs at the top, whoever they are.
     
  14. YNWA1892

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    As a footballer isn't your aim to be good enough to end up playing at the top?

    Like any job you start at the bottom and then if you are good enough you get the opportunity to progress to a better level, whether that is with the same company or club or a new one is irrelevant.

    Manchester City have to have a certain number of homegrown players in their squad and like Chelsea they didn't have that many last season and they now have to buy players who they feel are good enough or have the potential to be good enough.

    Just because Richards and Sinclair didn't make it doesn't mean other homegrown players won't make it.
     
  15. John

    John
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    How many former Utd players are plying their trade at other Prem clubs ? They are very much a selling club
     
  16. alan280170

    alan280170
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    Not all players, some want to make money.

    http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/jul/17/asamoah-gyan-shanghai-ghana-sunderland-controversy
     
  17. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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    I'd agree with that to a degree - they have a reasonably new manager who is building a new team. Out with the old in with the new...
     
  18. TayWax

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    But having said that its generally players they deem surplus to requirements rather than selling players they want to keep (with few notable exceptions of course)

    All clubs sell players but the top 4 have an easier time keeping the ones they want
     
  19. alan280170

    alan280170
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    Every club is a selling club, if the right bid comes along as said above it's easier for clubs with UCL spots to hold onto players.
     
  20. Nobbler

    Nobbler
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    I think that the biggest point I'm trying to make here - and I know this is going to upset supporters of the "big 4" is that in the last few weeks, the message is going out that if any team in any league has a decent upcoming English player, don't make him part of your long term plans as we're coming to get him to make up our numbers...the good new for us is that PR was not part of our starting 11 so it doesn't upset our game plan as such...but read the papers this morning about a certain team from West London and an Everton player and you'll see where I'm coming from...
     
  21. TayWax

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    So if City sign Roberts and he goes in to their Elite Development Squad am I right in thinking he won't count as part of their homegrown quota as not officially part of the first team squad? So in this case is being signed for his potential rather than just "making the numbers up"?
     
  22. karlak

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    Unfortunately, while the money keeps flowing into the Premier League like it is, then nothing will change.

    While I think it is not necessarily a foregone conclusion that these young stars will go and warm a bench at a top 4 club, it is a fact that the teams with the wealth can afford to take a punt on the youngsters. If they don't work out then so be it, they will be loaned out and then offloaded at some point. Not all clubs can take that chance, or indeed have the draw to turn the kids head in the first place.

    From the players perspective ? Wealth, Fame and exposure in the press. I guess that depends on the lad himself if that floats his boat. It is true to say that they may earn more on a 3 year contract at a "top" club, than the whole of their career at a lesser team, even if they don't make it.

    Think in our jobs, if someone offered to increase your income by 3,4 or more times, while essentially doing the same job. Who would refuse ? Yes, you may have to move, buy a new house, leave friends behind etc. But, to have got to where these lads have got to already, they and their families have probably already made moves and sacrifices to get there anyway.

    Not saying I agree, like or approve of the big boys coming in with their wallets and influence, but I don't see it changing anytime soon :(
     
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  23. TayWax

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    And the likelihood is that if he doesn't make it at City he will be back playing for a Championship club in a couple of years anyway so for the player as well it must look like a punt worth taking.

    I feel for the fans of those selling clubs, but unfortunately it's just the way football is right now. And can't see it changing anything soon
     
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