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1 Series - 118D Sport - any good?

w3dal

Distinguished Member
Afternoon,

With the ever increasing price of petrol and a 70 mile round trip communte it looks like ill have to sell the Focus ST and pick up something diesel related.

Just wondered if anyone owns or owned a 1 Series BMW diesel and could give me some pointers.

Looking at the 118 D Coupe in White, with a few options including black alloys, bluetooth etc.

Gonna take a hit on the Focus as its only 9 months old, but im doing around £80 a week in petrol and its only going to get worse. :(

Thanks for looking

Dal
 

colin1984

Active Member
Have a 120D M-Sport, ordered in January and collected on an '11 plate first week in April so had for 6 weeks now and really like it.
I came from a 58 plate Z4 coupe 3.0si, so needless to say it took a little while to get used to (I needed a boot for the dog). After a couple of weeks of 'have a I done the right thing' I need to say i couldn't be happier.
Although the car is obviously a fair bit less powerful than the Z4 it is still nippy enough about town and picks up well on motorway driving. The car is a bit thirstier than I thought it's be, I'm getting an average of 42.1mpg, but seen as I didn't change for economy I'm not that fussed. Although the £0 first year road tax and £120 thereafter is a bonus and my insurance has dropped.
Don't really know what to say, but any questions just fire away and I'll do my best to answer.
 

w3dal

Distinguished Member
Have a 120D M-Sport, ordered in January and collected on an '11 plate first week in April so had for 6 weeks now and really like it.
I came from a 58 plate Z4 coupe 3.0si, so needless to say it took a little while to get used to (I needed a boot for the dog). After a couple of weeks of 'have a I done the right thing' I need to say i couldn't be happier.
Although the car is obviously a fair bit less powerful than the Z4 it is still nippy enough about town and picks up well on motorway driving. The car is a bit thirstier than I thought it's be, I'm getting an average of 42.1mpg, but seen as I didn't change for economy I'm not that fussed. Although the £0 first year road tax and £120 thereafter is a bonus and my insurance has dropped.
Don't really know what to say, but any questions just fire away and I'll do my best to answer.


thats great - thanks very much i would gladly take the 42.1mpg over what i currently get from the Focus which at best is 29.

I borrowed my Dads 520D last week and was amazed that after using it all week i still had over 100 miles left in the take from £50.

Just been on the BMW website are those prices the same as in the dealers as im half way through do a car configurator to price one up.

Dal
 

FZR400RRSP

Banned
Just been on the BMW website are those prices the same as in the dealers as im half way through do a car configurator to price one up.
Dal

The configurator will only give you full RRP prices.
You should be able to get a discount off it once you get face-to-face with a dealer.
Either that or you use any one of the myriad of online brokers to do the haggling for you.
For the sake of argument, What Car Magazine's Target price for a 118d sport is £19492.00
Which is £1573.00 less than RRP (£21065.00)
So a rough guide shows you should be looking at 7%-8% discount, minimum.
 
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w3dal

Distinguished Member
The configurator will only give you full RRP prices.
You should be able to get a discount off it once you get face-to-face with a dealer.
Either that or you use any one of the myriad of online brokers to do the haggling for you.

I have found a couple of local dealers so will be popping down at the weekend i reckon to have a chat - was just doing the config to give me a price to work on when at the dealers.

Dal
 

colin1984

Active Member
As I said, never changed to save on fuel costs but I was happy enough (was getting 25/26mpg from the Z4). If you're looking at a 118D I'd imagine you'd be slightly better than that again. Also I'm only an 8 minute drive from work and only have a short blast on the by-pass, on any longer journeys I've been able to get about 50mpg so if you're a 70-mile round trip to work I'm guessing you have some by-pass/motorway crusing so should be better still.

As for prices. I paid book. Mine's is a 3-door and by the time I picked my spec the car was £28,200....there was a promotion where you could pick £600 worth of complimentary extras so the car cost £27,600. I asked them to clear my finance on the Z4 and just started from scratch (done the same with the Z4, put down £0 and just paid my monthly finance costs for 2-years then asked them to clear whatever was outstanding and took the 1-series with £0 down). My deal is £472 for 47 months and a final payment of £9,200ish. Plan is to keep it maybe 2/3 years and just basically do the exact same again....go to BMW and say 'clear that off, give me one of them please'. Obviously monthly paymets are less if you put down a deposit, but my thinking on cars is that as long as I'm happy with my monthly cost then there's no point in dipping my hand in my pocket, the money is better staying there!
 

FZR400RRSP

Banned
I have found a couple of local dealers so will be popping down at the weekend i reckon to have a chat - was just doing the config to give me a price to work on when at the dealers.

Dal

If you have between now and the weekend, you should email a few online car brokers for quotes for the exact spec you want.
I've used this tactic before, showing the dealer the internet prices and saying that whilst I don't expect them to match it, I expect them to get close.
 

w3dal

Distinguished Member
As I said, never changed to save on fuel costs but I was happy enough (was getting 25/26mpg from the Z4). If you're looking at a 118D I'd imagine you'd be slightly better than that again. Also I'm only an 8 minute drive from work and only have a short blast on the by-pass, on any longer journeys I've been able to get about 50mpg so if you're a 70-mile round trip to work I'm guessing you have some by-pass/motorway crusing so should be better still.

As for prices. I paid book. Mine's is a 3-door and by the time I picked my spec the car was £28,200....there was a promotion where you could pick £600 worth of complimentary extras so the car cost £27,600. I asked them to clear my finance on the Z4 and just started from scratch (done the same with the Z4, put down £0 and just paid my monthly finance costs for 2-years then asked them to clear whatever was outstanding and took the 1-series with £0 down). My deal is £472 for 47 months and a final payment of £9,200ish. Plan is to keep it maybe 2/3 years and just basically do the exact same again....go to BMW and say 'clear that off, give me one of them please'. Obviously monthly paymets are less if you put down a deposit, but my thinking on cars is that as long as I'm happy with my monthly cost then there's no point in dipping my hand in my pocket, the money is better staying there!


I understand im hoping todo similar with the finance, pay off the remainder on the focus with ford and then start a new 2-3 year deal.

Was going to-do 3-5 thousand pound deposit, but i guess when im down at the dealers we can sort out best case monthly figures.

Very helpful post Colin - cheers :smashin:

Dal
 

w3dal

Distinguished Member
If you have between now and the weekend, you should email a few online car brokers for quotes for the exact spec you want.
I've used this tactic before, showing the dealer the internet prices and saying that whilst I don't expect them to match it, I expect them to get close.

Any recomendation on a broker - not a service i have used in the past if im honest.

Thanks

Dal
 

FZR400RRSP

Banned
As for prices. I paid book. Mine's is a 3-door and by the time I picked my spec the car was £28,200....there was a promotion where you could pick £600 worth of complimentary extras so the car cost £27,600. I asked them to clear my finance on the Z4 and just started from scratch (done the same with the Z4, put down £0 and just paid my monthly finance costs for 2-years then asked them to clear whatever was outstanding and took the 1-series with £0 down). My deal is £472 for 47 months and a final payment of £9,200ish. Plan is to keep it maybe 2/3 years and just basically do the exact same again....go to BMW and say 'clear that off, give me one of them please'. Obviously monthly paymets are less if you put down a deposit, but my thinking on cars is that as long as I'm happy with my monthly cost then there's no point in dipping my hand in my pocket, the money is better staying there!

Can I ask why you didn't negotiate a discount?
Going by the above, the dealer managed to get you to pay full book price and sell you PCP.
He'll have gone home happy that day.:eek:
 

colin1984

Active Member
By the sounds of it you're in pretty much the same place as I was.

While the talk of tactics and brokers might sound good on paper and whatcar's target price exists....at the end of the day any car dealer has a margin. He has £X that he can throw at a deal and he doesn't care if £X comes from what he has to make up to clear your finance or what he has to to give you off that new car to do a deal, he doesn't have £X x 2. Meaning that if you want to go in with more outstanding finance than what your car is worth he can make up the difference for you, but he can't also then knock £1500 off the asking price and likewise if he has nothing to make up to clear your finance he can knock £1500 off the asking price....he can't do both.
Personally speaking I think the best poilicy is to work on book prices, that way you walk in with a worst case this car will cost me £20,000 (for arguments sake) and if you walk out having done a deal at £19,000 all the better. I've been there way too many times before where you think you're due this and that and all that happens is you get more and more frustrated because the dealer will not move - more often than not can't move.
 

colin1984

Active Member
FZR400RRSP while there's the chance I come off sounding like a c**k that's not at all my intention, but do you moonlight as a car salesman?
Nobody managed to get me to do anything and nobody sold me PCP.
They sold me a car. I never walked in and handed them £28k meaning the car they sold me had to be finananced, also meaning I had the choice to finance in any which way I chose to do and I chose BMW finance. I am an adult, I made the choice to approch the dealer, I made the decsion on what car I wanted, I made the decsion on how much I put to the deal and I made the decision on how to finance the car. Nobody managed to sell me anything.
 

FZR400RRSP

Banned
FZR400RRSP while there's the chance I come off sounding like a c**k that's not at all my intention, but do you moonlight as a car salesman?
Nobody managed to get me to do anything and nobody sold me PCP.
They sold me a car. I never walked in and handed them £28k meaning the car they sold me had to be finananced, also meaning I had the choice to finance in any which way I chose to do and I chose BMW finance. I am an adult, I made the choice to approch the dealer, I made the decsion on what car I wanted, I made the decsion on how much I put to the deal and I made the decision on how to finance the car. Nobody managed to sell me anything.

I'm just pointing out that in (apparently) not giving you any discount and getting you onto their finance (even of your own free will), they have done very well out of the deal.
I'm just curious as to why you didn't negotiate a discount?
There are suggestions the dealer had to 'top up' the settlement for your existing car instead?
That's fair enough, I just don't like to think anyone pays full book for a run-of-the-mill car.
A supercar, fair enough, you have to pay full book, or even a premium.
 
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sidicks

Banned
It does seem somewhat strange, as from the other indications on here, no discount means the car has cost £1,500 - £2,000 more than it needed to, plus by having a PCP arrangement and not paying a deposit, the finance arrangement is likely to be expensive too.

What APR were you quoted for the finance with BMW?

???
Sidicks
 

colin1984

Active Member
Note 'apparently'.
So if I had said 'nah I'm going to my bank for a loan' (for example) has the nice lady from the bank who sits down and goes through my application with me not also done very well? At the end of the day unless I had £28k in my hip pocket to pay cash then somebody was making comission off me financing a car!
Doesn't really matter if you like to think anyone does or doesn't pay full book on a car, I did and I'm very happy with my deal. My car (like my last car did) cost me £0 upfront, I'm fully aware of how much it will cost me PCM for the duration of my ownership (which I can both afford and are happy to pay), I know that when it comes time to change (obviously have to reach break-even point) I'll be going back and picking another brand new car. As long as it costs me £0 to change car and I'm happy with my monthly payments I don't care.
But for info I managed to negotiate a rate of interest that far outstripped what a bank could offer and do think that has to be considered in the same breath as any apparent discount on book. For examaple, dealing in simple numbers and not going into apr ect. I pay £1,000 for my car and you negotiate to £900, I negotiate and pay a flat 1.12% on my £1,000 and you happy with your £100 discount pay a flat 1.24%, I pay back £1,120 and you pay back £1,116....now if you could negotiate a £100 discount and pay back a flat 1.12% then it only costs you £1,008 and you win, but as said before you don't get both. Same with the salesman's margins, he can give you one he can't give you both.
 

w3dal

Distinguished Member
Thanks for the all input so far.

Will check out those brokers, and then start looking.

Dal

Sent from my iPhone using the AVForums App
 

sidicks

Banned
colin1984 said:
Note 'apparently'.
So if I had said 'nah I'm going to my bank for a loan' (for example) has the nice lady from the bank who sits down and goes through my application with me not also done very well? At the end of the day unless I had £28k in my hip pocket to pay cash then somebody was making comission off me financing a car!
Doesn't really matter if you like to think anyone does or doesn't pay full book on a car, I did and I'm very happy with my deal. My car (like my last car did) cost me £0 upfront, I'm fully aware of how much it will cost me PCM for the duration of my ownership (which I can both afford and are happy to pay), I know that when it comes time to change (obviously have to reach break-even point) I'll be going back and picking another brand new car. As long as it costs me £0 to change car and I'm happy with my monthly payments I don't care.
But for info I managed to negotiate a rate of interest that far outstripped what a bank could offer and do think that has to be considered in the same breath as any apparent discount on book. For examaple, dealing in simple numbers and not going into apr ect. I pay £1,000 for my car and you negotiate to £900, I negotiate and pay a flat 1.12% on my £1,000 and you happy with your £100 discount pay a flat 1.24%, I pay back £1,120 and you pay back £1,116....now if you could negotiate a £100 discount and pay back a flat 1.12% then it only costs you £1,008 and you win, but as said before you don't get both. Same with the salesman's margins, he can give you one he can't give you both.

What APR did you get on your PCP deal?

Normally the margin on the car and the margin on the finance are entirely separate (and they wouldn't write finance at a loss just because they have made a profit on the car)

Indeed, the best tactic is to negotiate the deal on the car first and then you can decide how you want to finance it, either via the dealer or through the bank etc.
;)
Sidicks
 
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colin1984

Active Member
Won't quote what rate of interest I'm on without checking at home - no point in being wrong.
'the finance arrangement is likely to be expensive too' based on what? I had £3.5k set aside as a deposit and for putting that into a deal my rate of interest didn't change at all so then the question is are you better to keep the cash in your pocket and just pay the interest on the full amount or pay £3.5k out and finance less? Don't get me wrong, obviously you are paying more out in interest on that £3.5k than what the money would gain you in savings....but are you better to keep that money yourself and pay out a £ or so extra per month and have £3.5k in hand....to me that's 100% a personal thing.
 

FZR400RRSP

Banned
It's all about getting the best deal, of course.
It's just extremely unusual to hear of anyone paying full book.
I certainly wouldn't suggest the OP goes in with the attitude that he'll get money off the car or money off the APR.
That's defeatist.
I'd suggest he goes in with the attitude he can get both.
And if the dealer doesn't budge, have the courage to leave and shop around.
 

sidicks

Banned
colin1984 said:
Won't quote what rate of interest I'm on without checking at home - no point in being wrong.
'the finance arrangement is likely to be expensive too' based on what? I had £3.5k set aside as a deposit and for putting that into a deal my rate of interest didn't change at all so then the question is are you better to keep the cash in your pocket and just pay the interest on the full amount or pay £3.5k out and finance less?

Finance is likely to be expensive based on:

- the fact that you are so focussed on monthly payments means that the true cost of the finance could be hidden in the APR.

- because a PCP defers the repayment of capital, these schemes are more expensive than normal loans

- the fact you don't know the APR suggests that you didn't take much notice at the time, and hence the salesman won't necessarily have been as competitive as he might otherwise have been

- as you identify, the finance rate is likely to be MUCH higher than the net of tax rate you could achieve on your savings

However, if this payment profile suits you, then that is what matters.

;-)
Sidicks
 

w3dal

Distinguished Member
FZR400RRSP said:
It's all about getting the best deal, of course.
It's just extremely unusual to hear of anyone paying full book.
I certainly wouldn't suggest the OP goes in with the attitude that he'll get money off the car or money off the APR.
That's defeatist.
I'd suggest he goes in with the attitude he can get both.
And if the dealer doesn't budge, have the courage to leave and shop around.

I'll be trying to get some discount, even if it's a full tank of diesel and some nice mats.

It's something I have managed in the past with fords, but BMW seem to not want to discount much. We shall see.

Plenty of dealers around to try and pester :p

Dal

Sent from my iPhone using the AVForums App
 

sidicks

Banned
w3dal said:
I'll be trying to get some discount, even if it's a full tank of diesel and some nice mats.

It's something I have managed in the past with fords, but BMW seem to not want to discount much. We shall see.

Plenty of dealers around to try and pester :p

Dal

Sent from my iPhone using the AVForums App

Well 5-8% discount should get you a fair few tanks of fuel!

:)
Sidicks
 

w3dal

Distinguished Member
sidicks said:
Well 5-8% discount should get you a fair few tanks of fuel!

:)
Sidicks

Indeed - we shall see, don't want to get ahead of myself and expect that sort of discount which may not be there.

Can't face another ford eventhough I do get ex employee discount.

Thanks for your help and advice fella :)

Dal

Sent from my iPhone using the AVForums App
 

FZR400RRSP

Banned
Indeed - we shall see, don't want to get ahead of myself and expect that sort of discount which may not be there.

What Car's target price demonstrates the discount is definitely there!
If your dealer won't match the Target price, What Car will put you in touch with the dealer that gave their mystery shopper the discount.
 

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