Home Entertainment & Technology Resource

  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Problems with new Onkyo TX-NR809

Discussion in 'Integrated Amplifiers & Receivers' started by KiwiGreg, Jul 6, 2011.

  1. KiwiGreg

    KiwiGreg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +2
    Hi guys

    I've just bought a new Onkyo TX-NR809 (well, actually, this is my second one this week) and I've been having a few issues so I was hoping I could get some advice.

    I have two main problems, and both issues have been the same on both of the new 809's I've had this week.

    Setup is, for the purposes of troubleshooting, as simple as I can get it;

    - Either a Sky+ HD box OR a PS3 as the only HDMI input for A+V to the 809.

    - A Samsung LE40A656 connected to the 809's HDMI Main Out.

    - I have a Wharfedale 10.CS centre and two Diamond 9.1's as fronts.

    Simple.

    ====================

    Problem 1: Intermittent no HDMI video out.

    The source (Sky+) is running, the TV is on, and I power on the 809 (from the remote).

    The 809 displays 'HDMI Start up' for approx. 3 secs, then goes to 'No Signal' briefly, then back to 'HDMI Start up' for another 90 seconds. During all this time I get no output on the TV except the initial Onkyo splash screen immediately after power on.

    After approx. 94 secs, I get audio (finally) thru my speakers. No video ever comes up on the TV screen.

    Occasionally (maybe 1 in 10 times), when I power on the 809 I get the 'HDMI Start up' for approx. 3 secs, then 'No Signal' briefly, then back to 'HDMI Start up' for another few seconds, and lo-and-behold, I get video and audio. But even this takes around 20 secs from power on, way to long it seems to me.

    I've swapped the HDMI cables around, as well as using both the Sky+ and PS3 as the source, and the issue remains the same. Whenever I run the source (Sky+ or PS3) directly to the TV HDMI input there are no problems at all.

    I spoke to the tech-support at JenServe here in London, and the only thing they could suggest is that the 809 and the Samsung TV are having trouble negotiating / handshaking at start-up. But my Samsung is only a couple of years old and has had no problems until the 809 was introduced into the setup.

    ====================

    Problem 2: Low audio volume.

    Out of the box, at first power on, the default 809 volume is 30 on a scale of 0 - 100.

    With either the Sky+ or the PS3 as the source (HDMI only between source and 809), this level 30 is inaudible. To get to what I consider to be my standard TV volume I need to crank the 809 up to around 60 - 65. My mate has a 507 (?) and he agrees this is very different behaviour to his unit, where standard volume is around 25 - 30.

    The guys at JenServe tried to reassure me that this wasn't a problem, but I'm not comfortable running at 70% level at just normal volumes. It doesn't leave me much headroom when I want to crank it up, and I'm concerned that at the very high levels there could be some audio distortion. Te 809 is supposed to put 180W out into 6 Ohms (10.CS and 9.1's), so I'm fairly sure this isn't right.

    Does this sound correct?

    ====================

    As noted earlier, I am now on my second, brand new unit, and both have exhibited identical symptoms. The logical part of me recognises the low likelihood that I have received two different units with the same fault(s), but I can't understand what else it could be. I'm gutted, as I was very excited to be getting a 809, and disappointed that I have had all this trouble. The support I have had from my supplier has been excellent, as they agreed to a swap / return on the first unit no problems. Buy now I need to decide where to go next. Do I try a (final) third unit, or do I just cut my losses, get a refund and go for a different brand / model?

    Any help or suggestions very appreciated

    Cheers

    KiwiGreg
  2. PSM1

    PSM1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    19,092
    Trophy Points:
    171
    Ratings:
    +3,099
    Firstly to get 5.1 sound from SkyHD you need to connect it to the amp via optical. The sky box does not send 5.1 sound via the HDMI, it only sends stereo.
    On the volume issue how have you set your system up? Have you run the auto calibration/setup? Have you set it manually or have you just turned it on? If you have not run the auto setup then run this and see what it gives you.
    What speakers does your friend have with the 507? How does the sensitivity of the speakers compare to your speakers? The volume you hear is not just related to the power of the amp but also the sensitivity of the speakers.
    On the picture front have you tried different HDMI cables? So have you used a different cable say from the reciever to the TV? I doubt 2 units would have identical faults like you say hence it would point to some other part of your equipment.
  3. KiwiGreg

    KiwiGreg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +2
    Thanks for your reply, PSM1

    Firstly to get 5.1 sound from SkyHD you need to connect it to the amp via optical. The sky box does not send 5.1 sound via the HDMI, it only sends stereo.

    - I have an optical cable on order, not too worried about 5.1 from Sky+ right now, but definitely something for another day.

    On the volume issue how have you set your system up? Have you run the auto calibration/setup? Have you set it manually or have you just turned it on? If you have not run the auto setup then run this and see what it gives you.

    - I have run the Audyssey auto-setup, and it has set the speakers up with varying dB levels and got the distances to my chair correct. Didn't help at all with the overall volume.

    What speakers does your friend have with the 507? How does the sensitivity of the speakers compare to your speakers? The volume you hear is not just related to the power of the amp but also the sensitivity of the speakers.

    - I know my Wharfedale Diamond 9.1's aren't anything to write home about, but they rated pretty well from what I read on them. 20 - 100 watts. Sensitivity 86dB. And the 10.CS center is 20 - 150 watts, 89 dB.


    On the picture front have you tried different HDMI cables? So have you used a different cable say from the receiver to the TV?

    - Yes, I have. I've used several cable combinations between both 809 and source and 809 and TV.

    I doubt 2 units would have identical faults like you say hence it would point to some other part of your equipment.

    - The only new component is the 809. The Sky+, PS3 and Samsung TV all worked fine together previously. Very frustrating.

    Cheers

    KiwiGreg
  4. PSM1

    PSM1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    19,092
    Trophy Points:
    171
    Ratings:
    +3,099
    You say you have tried different combinations but have you tried completely different cables? What HDMI cables do you have?
    What levels are the speakers set too in the amp? If you look in the setup on the speakers are they all positive dB values or all negative?
  5. KiwiGreg

    KiwiGreg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +2
    Yes, I tried a completely different HDMI cable that my mate has in his setup. Not sure what type or brand of cables, just bought new off Amazon, description;

    "1.5METER PRO GOLD RED (1.4a Version, 3D, 15.2Gbps) HDMI TO HDMI CABLE WITH ETHERNET,COMPATIBLE WITH 1.3c,1.3b,1.3,1080P,PS3,XBOX 360,SKYHD,VIRGIN BOX,FULL HD LCD,PLASMA & LED TV's AND ALSO SUPPORTS 3D TVS"

    [​IMG]

    After running the Audyssey auto-setup, the individual speaker levels are as follows (from 2.4, Speaker Setup - Level Calibration);

    L: -5.5 dB
    C: -4.5 dB
    R: -5.0 dB
    SR: -10.0
    SL: -9.5

    SR and SL are way down on the others as they are substantially closer to my viewing position. L, C and R are all roughly equidistant from me and so the relative levels look OK. Is there scope for me to bump everything up by 6 dB without upsetting the balance?

    Cheers

    KiwiGreg
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2011
  6. PSM1

    PSM1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    19,092
    Trophy Points:
    171
    Ratings:
    +3,099
    Do you have a sub? If so what it the gain in the amp set too?
    If so it would appear you have the gain on the sub too low (the actual gain control on the back of the sub) which means the amp will have to turn the gain on the sub up and the other speakers down to compensate. Hence turn the gain on the back of the sub up and then rerun the auto setup. If you do not have a sub then there should be no issue with increasing those values by up to 10dB so the lowest value becomes 0db instead of -10dB.
    On the cable front it would appear that the cables are OK so maybe there is a common fault with the reciever.
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  7. KiwiGreg

    KiwiGreg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +2
    Thanks PSM1

    I do have a Sub, but you know the saying...when it rains it pours, and I have a problem with that as well and am awaiting a replacement this Friday. At the moment the sub is not connected. Once I have the replacement in the rig I'll re-run the Audyssey auto-setup and set the lowest speaker value to 0.0 dB as you have suggested.

    I'm hoping someone else that has a 809 will be able to provide some guidance as to their relative volume levels, it just doesn't feel right to me that I've got to boost all these levels above the defaults to get a reasonable (not loud) level out.

    Cheers

    KiwiGreg
  8. PSM1

    PSM1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    19,092
    Trophy Points:
    171
    Ratings:
    +3,099
    If when you say the default settings you mean the one the autosetup has given then these are not default and there is some issue with the autosetup for them all to be set to -dB figures. Hence I would have no issue with turning them up and there is nothing wrong with that.
  9. bccsl

    bccsl Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2002
    Messages:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ratings:
    +6
    For the volume thing Go into the setup and chnage the mode of the volume display to show you a -db scale rather than the 0-100 scale. I don't have an 809 I have a 1007 but I find that a tend to listen at -25db to -30db as a comfotable listening level.

    For the HDMI thing again go into the settings and set your HDMI so it is in full passthrough mode and see if you still have the problem.
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  10. veinhead

    veinhead Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2006
    Messages:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +1
    I have the same amp to replace my 876, it does seem nowhere near as powerful, like yiu say you have to crank it up to 70% for normal listening.

    I did fall foul of the auto setup, where it thought my sub was too low, so it put high -db figures in for the rest of the speakers..

    I have just returned all my speaker values back to 0db, i will retry the auto setup this weekend..

    You might want to try a firmware upgrade on the amp to see if this resolves your handshake issues...
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  11. KiwiGreg

    KiwiGreg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +2
    Hi PSM1

    Regarding the Sub gain setting, when I run the Audyssey auto-setup, one of the earlier things it asks me to do is set the Sub to 75dB. How would I do this without an audio meter? And even if I had a meter, what would I use to generate a test tone for the Sub? Does the Audyssey auto-setup generate the tone for me?

    I have a Wharfedale SW250, all it has is a volume selection from 0 - 100.

    Cheers

    KiwiGreg
  12. scavttt

    scavttt Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2010
    Messages:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Ratings:
    +13
    Hi, I have the 809 and do not have an issue as you describe in the video part. The unit comes on displays Onkyo on the screen, says HDMI start up on the unit, then no signal and comes on - but always works after that. It does take about the same time to boot up, I just think that is the time it takes.

    My volume is really quiet and I have to increase it quite substantially to a greater level than I ever did with my old 605 without any settings - once I turned some settings on, dynamic eq etc it made a great difference and now comfortably fills the room with noise at about 42.

    Did not think this was a problem as the sound is excellent once I fiddled about a bit with the settings.

    You have got me thinking now though? Is this a problem or would this be normal performance?

    The sound setting on the sub part, the db level is displayed on screen during set up, as you change the volume on the sub it changes on the screen as the microphone picks up the audio level. Once the volume is giving a reading of 75 click OK. That's what I did, hope it is right!!!! Somebody correct me if I am wrong.
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. KiwiGreg

    KiwiGreg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2011
    Messages:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Ratings:
    +2
    OK Guys

    First of all, thanks very much for all who posted replies and suggestions, they were a big help.

    Second, all of my issues are now resolved, so time to give some back and explain what my problems and solutions were, and hopefully help someone else down the road once the Google-Borg has indexed this post :thumbsup:

    ==============================

    First, my issues with intermittent or slow video start up.

    After thinking on the HDMI handshaking a bit, I decided to try using my HDMI-enabled computer monitor in place of the Samsung TV. Result was the same slow start-up, but at least it would start up every time - 100% success rate. This indicated to me that there was a negotiation problem uniquely between my 809 and my Samsung TV.

    The Samsung has 3 HDMI inputs on it, so I experimented with plugging the 809 to each of these in turn. Results were as follows (20 test runs per input);

    - TV HDMI 1 - 15 Fails, 5 Successes - 25% Success rate

    - TV HDMI 2 - 20 Successes - 100% Success rate

    - TV HDMI 3 - 14 Fails, 6 Successes - 30% Success rate

    So, it looks like my TV HDMI inputs 1 and 3 have an issue handshaking with the 809. No problem, I'll just use input number 2.

    Problem solved :clap:

    Also, the start-up speed is now in the 8 - 10 second range, much better than before and acceptable to me.

    ==============================

    Second, low volume output levels

    I got my replacement SW250 sub this morning and installed it into my rig. No more problems there.

    I re-ran the Audyssey setup, and after completion inspected the configured audio levels (under 2.4)

    FL: -5.0 dB
    FR: -5.0 dB
    C: -6.0 dB
    SR: -10.0 dB
    SL: -9.0 dB
    SW: +0.5 dB

    Taking PSM1's advise, I manually boosted these levels so that the lowest speaker (SR) was set to 0.0 dB i.e. I added +10.0 dB to every speaker. This took my audio level range from -10.0 dB / +0.5 dB to 0. dB0 / +10.5 dB. This alone made a large difference to the levels. But I wasn't done yet.

    I also adjusted the 4.1 Audyssey settings as follows;

    - Dynamic EQ - On
    - Reference Level - 0 db
    - Dynamic Volume - Light (this one gave me quite a boost)

    Finally, with each source selected / running in turn, I adjusted the 4.2 Intellivolume for each to +6.0 db

    My optical cable had also arrived, so I had also hooked my Sky+ HD box to the 809 via optical for 5.1 Sky.

    With all of the above changes, my 'comfortable, standard room listening' level is now Absolute 25 or Relative -57 dB, much more what I was expecting out of the box.

    SORTED :laugh:

    ==============================

    So, once again, thanks to all who helped out. I'm now very happy with the 809, and very-very happy I don't need to go thru the agonising process of choosing a different brand / model.

    Best regards

    KiwiGreg
    • Thanks Thanks x 2
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2011
  14. PSM1

    PSM1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    19,092
    Trophy Points:
    171
    Ratings:
    +3,099
    Glad you got it all sorted in the end. Enjoy your new amp.
  15. onlinedream

    onlinedream Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2008
    Messages:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    Just got my onkyo 809 and had similar problems with my pioneer lx508d - eventually through trial and error found that input 4 on the pioneer connects 100% and all is now well. So thanks for the discussion here and it's obviously worth trying different hdmi inputs if the above problems arise.

    Am still waiting for my BK sub but when it arrives will also try the low volume level approach suggested above too and will let you know how it goes.
  16. sithesly

    sithesly Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2011
    Messages:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    Hi all,

    I collected an 809 at the weekend and had exactly the same problem as Kiwigreg, also the same setup, 809 into a sammy a656. I noticed that if i plugged the telly in to the secondary output it would work every time, but hardly ever in the main output. Last night i updated the firmware and so far i have had no further problems with start up.

    Cheers

    Si
  17. l34052

    l34052 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    1,155
    Trophy Points:
    51
    Ratings:
    +96
    I cant help with the video problem but i think i can with the sound problem.

    When i got my new amp in jan this year i ran the audyssey setup and everything was sorted ok but then i started fiddling with things and it all went wrong from there.

    Firstly do you have dynamic EQ turned on or not? Audyssey themselves say this should always be on.

    Secondly, there is the option to tweak the input volume levels for all sources individually so if a particular source is quieter than others you can adjust this by (i think off the top off my head) +12db.

    Thirdly, you can change the reference level in the amp this has a huge impact on the sound. It has 4 settings, 0, 5, 10, 15db each having less of an impact on the sound the higher you go I.E. setting the level to 0 tells the receiver the source material was recorded at reference level so it doesnt process the sound and you get the full effect of bass etc. The higher you go up the reference range the less effect you get from the sound interms of bass and overall sound so you should set this to 0 for films to get the maximum impact then use the other settings for music where you dont need the full reference levels for bass etc.

    If you try these you may be hugely surprised by the difference it makes to the sound.

    If you need more advice you should have a look at Audyssey and it should answer all your questions regarding sound.
  18. boksbox

    boksbox Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2003
    Messages:
    545
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Ratings:
    +32
    Does your Samsung support ARC? I notice that my 55D8000 support ARC on HDMI 2 maybe that is the default input to use.
  19. teodoro01

    teodoro01 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2012
    Messages:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    Hi everyone.
    I'm having a HDMI VIDEO OUT MAIN issue with my TX-NR809
    I got my 809 a few weeks ago and hooked up A sony BD 360 and a Cable box via HDMI both.

    Everything were ok till this morning when i tried to watch cable as usual and discovered that the main HDMI out was not sending out VIDEO , i can hear the sound but not video .

    Switched HDMI cable (just in case) , double checked the MONITOR OUTPUT setting (MAIN HDMI OUT selected) , but none video .

    I tried the second MONITOR SUB out and works , but this out doesn't support On Screen Menu.

    Any ideas about this issue ?, is it my MAIN HDMI OUT broken?

    Any advise will be welcome.
    Thanks
  20. AalesundTrooper

    AalesundTrooper Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2013
    Messages:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    i HAVE THE SAME ISSUE....
  21. PSM1

    PSM1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    19,092
    Trophy Points:
    171
    Ratings:
    +3,099
    Probably the common HDMI board issue. If you are handy with a soldering iron then just need to change a few capacitors and there is a utube video showing how to do it.
  22. AalesundTrooper

    AalesundTrooper Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2013
    Messages:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Ratings:
    +0
    Ok. Then i will deli er my onkyo to the store. Thank you for the answer.:)

Share This Page