NAS Drive Advice

Butters, It's the BIG day today :thumbsup:

Good luck and let us know how you get on :smashin:
 
Anyone know what the operational difference between the Synology DS409 and DS409+ is? One costs nearly £80 more than the other, appears to have a bit more ram and a faster processor. For streaming BluRay iso rips, is this necessary?

Benefit of using a 4 drive NAS over a 2 drive NAS is that you can use RAID 5. This means you protect your data with maximum disk efficiency. They only way to do it on a 2 drive NAS is mirroring, which means half the capacity is wasted. RAID appears to be well worth it, considering the cost of the content. Hence I'm going for a 4 bay NAS.

If I go for a Synology DS409 what other software will I need to add to it, to make it work. I don't yet have a streamer so that's next obviously. Not terribly impressed by the limitations of the current streamer generation! Where is the gigabit ethernet for goodness sake!??
 
If you have a hardware failure, or multiple disk failure, Raid 5 will not help you.

The important piece of any NAS/SAN is a backup to a separate device, be it Tape/DLT or another HD.

Mirroring is a good compromise, but as you say, you lose half of your capacity, whereas Raid 5 is around 1 of the total number of disks, so if you have 4 500 GB disks, you end up with 1.5TB of space available.
 
yes, lets not forget that a NAS is not a backup, unless of course you have a copy of the data on a PC elsewhere

the NAS/RAID thing is just a protection against disk failure

I use my NAS as a backup of all our work and private laptops and my home PC and also as a central media storage place, the media has to be backed up elsewhere ...there is simply too many TB for me to pay for offsite in the cloud, so I choose the important stuff and just do that - I can rip a DVD again if the house burnt down ;)


backup is another term altogether and can mean many things, from simple tape copy of the data on different media, to full replicated and hot swap mirrored hardware at a remote location that switches over seamlessly

you just need to decide what/how/where/when process for yourself, but remember, just sticking it all on a NAS, does not mean you have a secure way of recovery if your house burns down........
 
I can tell you from bitter experience that a solid backup regime may cost you initially, but will pay dividends if you ever have a problem.

My NAS has irreplaceable Camcorder Footage, Thousands of photo's and documents.

I have a nightly Backup to a separate USB HDD, AND periodically I backup to DVDR's and store in a separate location.

If money was no object, I would have 2 NAS's and a DLT Backup Drive. One NAS would backup to the 2nd NAS, which would then be backed up on DLT

DLT's can hold significant amounts now, (I think the latest is SuperDLT holding around 500GB)

However, until I win the lottery I have to make do with my limited backup, but it's still better than no backup.
 
In all honesty, if the house burnt down, I'd have other things to worry about. I think we all would.

If I go through this process, then I have no doubt my mirror would be at the folks house. So either one would have a back-up good and ready. Would sync every 6 months I expect. That should work well!

Looking like the Synology DS409 on cost at the moment. It's a good performer for a very fair price. 2 x Seagate and 2 x Samsung drives.

Thanks for all your help everyone!
 
Not sure if this is the right place, but.......

I have a 1tb external drive connected to my PC, is there any way i can turn this into a NAS?

Leading on to my next question...

Can i connect the NAS to my router using homeplugs?

Thanks if anyone can help :)
 
Not sure if this is the right place, but.......

I have a 1tb external drive connected to my PC, is there any way i can turn this into a NAS?

Leading on to my next question...

Can i connect the NAS to my router using homeplugs?

Thanks if anyone can help :)

yes you can buy adapters that will turn a USB drive into a NAS with an ethernet port ...however, they are nearly as expensive as a standalone real single bay nas anyway

yes you can connect via powerline adapters just fine too

just be aware that most low end NAS, particularly if you start connecting with slow methods like powerline adapters, the performance will be waaaayyy slower than a modern direct attach USB drive and you may be disappointed
 
oh, and something like this convert it?
 
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Butters, It's the BIG day today :thumbsup:

Good luck and let us know how you get on :smashin:

Far too busy to report back on just how much i like the new toy whilst copying over my 250gb of photos and 18000 iTunes tracks :rotfl:

An instant win has been the ability to share a single printer between the family. Kids got in from school and rather than drop memory sticks and emails full of attachments for me to print off - i got to say bugger off and do it yourself :cool:

Getting a bit nervous though on re-pointing iTunes at the NAS and trying to get that all working. anyone with any tips?? gratefully recieved.

i was suprised at how loud the fan was when going through the initial set up but it's near silent now...

Need to get my head around how to set up private areas for each of the users as well. Not got my head around how all that malarky works :rolleyes:
 
hi spy and butters
out of interest what are you putting your seagate drives on ebay for.

one site is offering duo and 2 drives plus still the freebie so you end up with 3 500gig seagates.

cheers

john
 
I will probobly keep mine and shove it in my PC as additional storage to be honest as it only has a single drive at present.

That means i can really go over the top on backing up my photo's!! I don't know what the drives are worth on the open market or if they are the more expensive enterprise drives (whatever they are :rolleyes:)

Just tested out the photos via email facility and viewed via the web on my iPhone. Its pretty cool :cool:
 
Hi all

Mind if I jump in and cause a big splash? I'd be really grateful for some URGENT help because I'm trying to decide whether or not to buy a ReadyNAS Duo and if so it has to be today whilst they're still doing their free drive offer! (Can't see anywhere that it's been extended beyond today, 30th Sept.) If you have a ReadyNAS or any other NAS, please read on and chime in...

It seems lots of people use their NAS as just storage and not part of their backup plan. I have a 1TB USB external disk that I backup to occasionally and keep outside of my flat, but regular automated backups of what I'm working on (I'm a graphic designer) would be very useful.

I currently use Genie Backup Manager to make multiple incremental backups on other hard drives within my main PC, and my thoughts have grown: 1) get a NAS for RAID which I can backup to rather than use drives in same PC - 2) learnt they can also share media with our 2 laptops and PS3 - 3) learnt some can also share remotely, so I can give files to families and friends, and get to all my files from anywhere? Brilliant.

So, from reading these very useful forums I naturally have got more questions than I came here with! In relation to my buying a ReadyNAS Duo I'd be very grateful for quick help/confirmation on any of these...

1) The whole pre-defined shares of backup, media etc. confuse me, are these basically folders on the ReadyNAS that can be as big as you like up to the drive's capacity?

2) If I set a backup job to backup a folder (say M:\My Pictures), does it intelligently automatically include new subfolders I might later create within My Pictures?

3) Does the NAS monitor the folders or does the PC push files to it through Shadow, and if the latter does Shadow take up many resources running in the background? I hate sofware running in the background and slowing everything else down.

4) My iTunes library is in a My Music folder and all the music I haven't yet tagged is in another folder. Ditto all the photos I have tagged are separate to the ones I haven't processed yet etc. My idea is to backup everything to the ReadyNAS, and share the folders of tagged music and photos to our laptops, PS3 and (for photos) anyone else I choose externally over the net. So none of the other devices or people will modify anything, just play music or view pics. As I add music to iTunes (when it gets copied to the My Music folder) and tag it, other devices must be able to see and play it. But I'm basically sharing my backup (albeit read only) - is that a good idea?

5) Won't the automatic (Shadow or otherwise) backups go to a different share (/backup) than the one the PS3 will access - isn't that /media?

6) Why does the ReadyNAS need to be scanned to pick up changes? Is this true for all client devices or just the PS3, and/or every file change or just some, e.g. deletions/modifications/adding new ones?

Sharing Photos:

7) So I can set distant relatives up with read access to see and download photos (or other files), without giving them access to all our other photos and files? I read that there is a way which does this without duplicating the photos that have already been backedup to the ReadyNAS?

8) I gather I can host a website on it so maybe I could use Adobe Lightroom to make a different photo gallery and host that? Extending this idea, I'd like to put a different site on there and host it so I don't need to pay for hosting space. It wouldn't be big and would get very little traffic. Won't need SQL databasing or shopping facilities, Can it host more than one site (i.e. a photo gallery and something else)? I have no server experience so would like this to be simple to work out of the box (something the Synology DS209j does). Could I use the ReadyNAS to give clients FTP access to download files I've made for them?

Hardware:

9) Apparently the ReadyNAS Duo can take SATAII drives but runs them at SATA-1 speed?

10) Apparently the USB print functionality isn't "full" and is different to connecting a printer directly to a PC. I have a Canon iP4500, what might be affected? I do graphic design with a colour managed workflow so don't want anything affecting print settings.

I know it's a lot of asking, any answers to any of it would be more than appreciated! Sounds like you guys Butters and Spy are very pleased with what you've got, I'm still wavering having read lots of complaints on other forums etc.

Really appreciate your shared ;) experiences and help everyone
DM
 
Hi Dancingmatt

i cant help with techno as new myself, but didint someone say a few posts back the free drive offer is extended till crimbo?

cheers

john
 
Hi
thinking of getting apple tv as well now. As i am having multiroom put in, apparently ps3 cant provide an audio feed and video/movie at the same time?

Any one running an atv with a readynas?

cheers

john
 
Hi all

Mind if I jump in and cause a big splash? I'd be really grateful for some URGENT help because I'm trying to decide whether or not to buy a ReadyNAS Duo and if so it has to be today whilst they're still doing their free drive offer! (Can't see anywhere that it's been extended beyond today, 30th Sept.) If you have a ReadyNAS or any other NAS, please read on and chime in...

<snip>

Hi

I'm a happy ReadyNAS Duo user but I'm afraid I use a Mac so I can't answer your questions. I just wanted to say that if you need an urgent answer you might have more luck over at the ReadyNAS forums (just google it).

There is a dedicated presales forum there and you should get all the answers you need.
 
Hi DM,

I will try and help.
Firstly, the free drive promotion is extended to 31 December, see here FREE Hard Drive Promotion :thumbsup:

Here are some responses to your other questions:

1) The whole pre-defined shares of backup, media etc. confuse me, are these basically folders on the ReadyNAS that can be as big as you like up to the drive's capacity?

Yes, these are folders that are already setup for you. Like any other folder, you can create sub-folders and fill them with as much data as your hard drive size will allow

2) If I set a backup job to backup a folder (say M:\My Pictures), does it intelligently automatically include new subfolders I might later create within My Pictures?

I am not sure here, but I suspect it is dependent on the backup program you use. Basically, the NAS is a shared drive on the network which your backup software can access to store the backup. Some NAS drives come with free backup software (I don't think the Duo does though). If not, you can continue using Genie.

3) Does the NAS monitor the folders or does the PC push files to it through Shadow, and if the latter does Shadow take up many resources running in the background? I hate sofware running in the background and slowing everything else down.
Similar to my response on Q.2, I think the PC pushes as opposed to the NAS monitoring

4) My iTunes library is in a My Music folder and all the music I haven't yet tagged is in another folder. Ditto all the photos I have tagged are separate to the ones I haven't processed yet etc. My idea is to backup everything to the ReadyNAS, and share the folders of tagged music and photos to our laptops, PS3 and (for photos) anyone else I choose externally over the net. So none of the other devices or people will modify anything, just play music or view pics. As I add music to iTunes (when it gets copied to the My Music folder) and tag it, other devices must be able to see and play it. But I'm basically sharing my backup (albeit read only) - is that a good idea?
I don't see a problem with sharing a read-only backup. If it it was writeable then I would say no.

5) Won't the automatic (Shadow or otherwise) backups go to a different share (/backup) than the one the PS3 will access - isn't that /media?
I don't think this is an issue. The Media folder doesn't have any special properties other than being scanned and the content shared by ReadyDNLA, the media server. As long as your backup software is pointed to teh media folder, it should be able to save the backup there.

6) Why does the ReadyNAS need to be scanned to pick up changes? Is this true for all client devices or just the PS3, and/or every file change or just some, e.g. deletions/modifications/adding new ones?
All DNLA servers scan the target folder. They pick up the files and store their references in a database, like a phone directory. They then make that directory available to the remote devices which you then choose from as a menu.

I should say that the ReadyNas Duo automatically picks up newly added media files - you don't need to constantly re-scan. The only time you need to re-scan is if its Database index goes out of sync with the contents and you need to refresh it

Sharing Photos:

7) So I can set distant relatives up with read access to see and download photos (or other files), without giving them access to all our other photos and files? I read that there is a way which does this without duplicating the photos that have already been backedup to the ReadyNAS?
Yes the ReadyNAS can do this but the application that does it is not on the Dup from teh factory. You will need to download and install it separately. I haven't done it but it looks easy enough. There is a button to download and set it up in FrontView (the Duo's browser based interface).

A couple of caveats though:
- You will need to mess around with settings on your router (to get it to allow external people access to the NAS) and also ensure you have a fixed IP address so that your family know where to go for the photos.
- You may see a degradation in performance if you have a few family members browsing the photos whilst you are trying to do other things at the same time.
I would consider upgrading teh memory as this may help.

8) I gather I can host a website on it so maybe I could use Adobe Lightroom to make a different photo gallery and host that? Extending this idea, I'd like to put a different site on there and host it so I don't need to pay for hosting space. It wouldn't be big and would get very little traffic. Won't need SQL databasing or shopping facilities, Can it host more than one site (i.e. a photo gallery and something else)? I have no server experience so would like this to be simple to work out of the box (something the Synology DS209j does). Could I use the ReadyNAS to give clients FTP access to download files I've made for them?
Yes, the Duo can do this (lots of free applications available here Add-ons (Community) : NETGEAR ReadyNAS Community)
In all honesty though, if you are planning on doing all these things, you may find that the Duo is under-powered, I would recommend looking at the ReadyNas NVX range which is much more powerful and fully capable of doing all this without blinking.

Hardware:

9) Apparently the ReadyNAS Duo can take SATAII drives but runs them at SATA-1 speed?
Yes, it is SATA II compatible but runs tehm as SATA

10) Apparently the USB print functionality isn't "full" and is different to connecting a printer directly to a PC. I have a Canon iP4500, what might be affected? I do graphic design with a colour managed workflow so don't want anything affecting print settings.
I haven't tried this but I believe any limitations are not specific to the Duo but to all USB shared printers that are not connected directly to a PC.

I know it's a lot of asking, any answers to any of it would be more than appreciated! Sounds like you guys Butters and Spy are very pleased with what you've got, I'm still wavering having read lots of complaints on other forums etc.
Before buying, I read loads of reviews and went on to many forums. As with many things, there are people who have issues and those that do not with all of the products. What I realised is that you need to be sure how you will use it and then assess which product is best. There may be issues with products that you will never encounter because you won't use them in that way. I believe that in general, the Netgear products are very good and come with a great warranty and support (which was a big deciding factor for me). Saying that, as I have pointed out, the Duo's performance is limited but then again the NVX is more than powerful enough having won many awards. The downside is that it is more expensive than the equivalent Synology and Qnap products (but then again, they come with one year warranty and the NVX comes with 5 years). If you want to consider the NVX, you may be interested in this free drive promotion just launched by Netgear FREE Hard Drives Promotion

Whatever you decide, I am sure it will be much better than what you have today :thumbsup:
 
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butters/spy
the deal is done, be here tommorow. I paid 218 which sounds a lot but getting 3x 500 gig drives.

so with a bit of ebaying and assorted sundays at garage sales probably end up with what i wanted. if you know any one who needs a drive point them my way.

dilemma is whether to get up and running on 500 gig raid or of load the lot and get samsungs like yours.

how you both getting on with yours?

can i ask what connections you have made to ps3 and are you running into a receiver or your sb/sonos?

regards

john
 
butters/spy
the deal is done, be here tommorow.

how you both getting on with yours?

can i ask what connections you have made to ps3 and are you running into a receiver or your sb/sonos?

regards

john

Congrats John - I hope you enjoy your new "toy"

My PS3 is connected to my Duo via wired Gigabit switch. The media streaming works fine - I watched a 2 hour streamed movie using it last night :thumbsup:

Haven't used with my Sonos yet as I haven't switched the Sonos config yet to point at the Duo
 
Hi DM,

I will try and help.
Firstly, the free drive promotion is extended to 31 December, see here FREE Hard Drive Promotion :thumbsup:

Here are some responses to your other questions:



Yes, these are folders that are already setup for you. Like any other folder, you can create sub-folders and fill them with as much data as your hard drive size will allow



I am not sure here, but I suspect it is dependent on the backup program you use. Basically, the NAS is a shared drive on the network which your backup software can access to store the backup. Some NAS drives come with free backup software (I don't think the Duo does though). If not, you can continue using Genie.


Similar to my response on Q.2, I think the PC pushes as opposed to the NAS monitoring


I don't see a problem with sharing a read-only backup. If it it was writeable then I would say no.


I don't think this is an issue. The Media folder doesn't have any special properties other than being scanned and the content shared by ReadyDNLA, the media server. As long as your backup software is pointed to teh media folder, it should be able to save the backup there.


All DNLA servers scan the target folder. They pick up the files and store their references in a database, like a phone directory. They then make that directory available to the remote devices which you then choose from as a menu.

I should say that the ReadyNas Duo automatically picks up newly added media files - you don't need to constantly re-scan. The only time you need to re-scan is if its Database index goes out of sync with the contents and you need to refresh it

Sharing Photos:


Yes the ReadyNAS can do this but the application that does it is not on the Dup from teh factory. You will need to download and install it separately. I haven't done it but it looks easy enough. There is a button to download and set it up in FrontView (the Duo's browser based interface).

A couple of caveats though:
- You will need to mess around with settings on your router (to get it to allow external people access to the NAS) and also ensure you have a fixed IP address so that your family know where to go for the photos.
- You may see a degradation in performance if you have a few family members browsing the photos whilst you are trying to do other things at the same time.
I would consider upgrading teh memory as this may help.


Yes, the Duo can do this (lots of free applications available here Add-ons (Community) : NETGEAR ReadyNAS Community)
In all honesty though, if you are planning on doing all these things, you may find that the Duo is under-powered, I would recommend looking at the ReadyNas NVX range which is much more powerful and fully capable of doing all this without blinking.


Yes, it is SATA II compatible but runs tehm as SATA


I haven't tried this but I believe any limitations are not specific to the Duo but to all USB shared printers that are not connected directly to a PC.


Before buying, I read loads of reviews and went on to many forums. As with many things, there are people who have issues and those that do not with all of the products. What I realised is that you need to be sure how you will use it and then assess which product is best. There may be issues with products that you will never encounter because you won't use them in that way. I believe that in general, the Netgear products are very good and come with a great warranty and support (which was a big deciding factor for me). Saying that, as I have pointed out, the Duo's performance is limited but then again the NVX is more than powerful enough having won many awards. The downside is that it is more expensive than the equivalent Synology and Qnap products (but then again, they come with one year warranty and the NVX comes with 5 years). If you want to consider the NVX, you may be interested in this free drive promotion just launched by Netgear FREE Hard Drives Promotion

Whatever you decide, I am sure it will be much better than what you have today :thumbsup:

Spy, is in not the case that the ReadyNas NVX only come with a five year warranty if you buy it already loaded with discs, if you buy it without the discs it only comes with 3 years warranty?
 
its 5 years warranty on an NVX with or without drives

if you buy the drives elsewhere though, they only have their manufacturer warranty - 1,2,3 years etc

if you buy from Netgear (or get them free) they have a 5 year warranty ...hence there being a list of tested/approved drives for use

the idea is that these are business products for a network of resellers to install for customers - you go on site and its loaded with drives, ready to go immediately, and you as the reseller can honour a 5 year warranty with your customer...it also means that the extra labour cost of installing the drives, building the array, and extending the warranty on them is built into the price . The other issue is that hard drive pricing is volatile. Hardware will be in production for a couple of weeks, then 6 weeks shipping, 2 weeks distribution maybe ....if they drives are bought at X price, then 3 months later are on the shelves for x -10%, and youve shipped 100K units ....well, you would lose a lot of money

...hence people have always moaned "I can buy the drives cheaper myself" kind of thing, if they dont understand the business model ....

for consumers, its nearly always cheaper to buy the bare model......unless there are some creative offers on from various places ...

if you are a reseller, the £50 extra is passed onto the end customer, and you save 3-4 hours labour...
 
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bogie, sea surfer,

Just to clarify, the NVX is only available with drives and carries a 5 year warranty.

The NVX Pioneer is a diskless version and comes with a 3 year warranty as Netgear perceive it to be a consumer model
 
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butters/spy
the deal is done, be here tommorow. I paid 218 which sounds a lot but getting 3x 500 gig drives.

so with a bit of ebaying and assorted sundays at garage sales probably end up with what i wanted. if you know any one who needs a drive point them my way.

dilemma is whether to get up and running on 500 gig raid or of load the lot and get samsungs like yours.

how you both getting on with yours?

can i ask what connections you have made to ps3 and are you running into a receiver or your sb/sonos?

regards

john

John, I was just thinking, did you buy the Duo ?
If so, why did you buy 3x 500Gb drives ?
 
hi spy
broadband stuff where doing it with two drives 500gig then theres the freebie from netgear.

still deciding whether to flog the lot and get samsungs like you.

my maths is 218 plus 140 for f2 1.5 t so 358.00 but the 500gig needs to raise 60 quid to be on par with you i would of thought but might be wrong that brand new seagates would fetch me 20 quid each?

however as we previously discussed these drives would do me for now i only have 20gig of data so iam and up and running for a couple of hundred not bad?

on the samsungs did you get 16 or 32 cache models.

still trying to get the router to the media point so iam ready.

do you use flac and do you rip them with eac?

of to buy a gigabit switch, dont know what iam doing but its fun?

john
 

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