[MrG99]

I know a few people have commented on this, I only have KK at the moment and played it after a sesh on gears of war. I ddn't alter the volume on the amp but immediately you could tell the sound was quieter and less dynamic sounding.

What is the issue and will there be a fix? I think I read that if a disc has True HD audio as an option on the discs setup menu, then you can select this and the HD drive will decode and output this via the optical connection to the amp?

I'm really not happy with this as it spoils the experience and I don't want to be limited in the future to buying specific discs that have this extra audio option - they should all sound great - what is going on?

[Dazza]

There a fixes in the pipeline for the way the 360 decodes the HD soundtracks to DD5.1 & apparently DTS will be added. However currently the 360/HD Drive has no physical capability to offer the new HD sound formats.

These are not available through the optical output and unless MS release a HDMI cable they won't be.

[Johnny Utah]

Originally Posted by MrG99

What is the issue and will there be a fix? I think I read that if a disc has True HD audio as an option on the discs setup menu, then you can select this and the HD drive will decode and output this via the optical connection to the amp?

As Dazza said above, the HD-DVD player will never output True HD audio or Dolby Digital + due to the fact that the optical out connection does not have the required bandwidth.

As it stands your HD-DVD's are decoded from their native format and then re-encoded to Dolby Digital 5.1 and sent to your receiver. Therefore no matter what format the particular DVD has, whether it be True HD or Dolby +, you will only have 5.1 sound when played with the xbox player. This could be seen as a step back in terms of audio due to the lack of hdmi connection.

I noticed that when watching king kong, the left and right rear speakers were barely getting sent any sound, i had to place my ear right next to each to make sure they were working at all. The same applied to the Sub, the deep bass sounds during some of the action scenes were not present as you'd expect with 5.1 Dolby (A relatively old format by today's standards). I also noticed like you that the sound was 'flat' and i had to increase the volume substantially before it was at a comfortable level.

I don't yet have any other HD-DVD's to compare with but after reading a few reviews it seems that the HD-DVD player software is not doing a great job of recoding the audio.

Originally Posted by Dazza

There a fixes in the pipeline for the way the 360 decodes the HD soundtracks to DD5.1 & apparently DTS will be added.

Hopefully this future update can resolve this issue (possibly software?) and therefore provide better quality audio!

[T800]

The 360 is adding dynamic compression to the audio tracks which is like "Midnight Mode" that some amps have that make all the sound the same level, an explosion is only as loud as a conversation.

The 360 can decode TrueHD and in theory will sound better than DD+ even through optical. You will only get proper TrueHD if MS release a HDMI cable or a Component/VGA cable with 5.1 analogue outs.

[Johnny Utah]

Originally Posted by T800

The 360 is adding dynamic compression to the audio tracks which is like "Midnight Mode" that some amps have that make all the sound the same level, an explosion is only as loud as a conversation.

Not sure i like the 'sound' of this. There seems no seperation in the channels, almost like 5 channel stereo.

Pointless imho.

[T800]

Originally Posted by strett

Not sure i like the 'sound' of this. There seems no seperation in the channels, almost like 5 channel stereo.

Pointless imho.

Dynamic compression is only used for the "Midnight Modes" so people can listen to a 5.1 track at night or just quietly, the 360 is apparently gonna be updated to operate properly.
Imo the seperation is fine, are you sure your amp is set up correctly, I've read lots of problems with the audio but non about seperation.

[Digicon]

I noticed the sound was flat also on KK although only marginally better was the Superman returns True HD track.

Looks like i am investing in a proper HD-DVD Player unless microsoft pulls its finger out.

[Johnny Utah]

Originally Posted by Digicon

I noticed the sound was flat also on KK although only marginally better was the Superman returns True HD track.

Looks like i am investing in a proper HD-DVD Player unless microsoft pulls its finger out.

Yeah i bought Superman as well just to try it out and it's exactly the same. The sound is flat and the seperation really poor.

I played a SD DVD in my standard player just to make sure that it wasn't the amp.....it wasn't.

The way i understand it (and correct me if i'm wrong) the 360 player uses software to decode the soundtracks rather than a dedicated chip like other generic HD-DVD players. Therefore i guess it would be possible to improve this software.

It's in desperate need of an update!

[Digicon]

Originally Posted by strett

Yeah i bought Superman as well just to try it out and it's exactly the same. The sound is flat and the seperation really poor.

I played a SD DVD in my standard player just to make sure that it wasn't the amp.....it wasn't.

The way i understand it (and correct me if i'm wrong) the 360 player uses software to decode the soundtracks rather than a dedicated chip like other generic HD-DVD players. Therefore i guess it would be possible to improve this software.

It's in desperate need of an update!

Well after many hours of reading on here and various other forums i have decided to Get rid of the 360 drive and buy a dedicated HD-E1 player and new HDMI amp just so i can at least get the Improvement of the Tru HD sound and DD+

Just really dissapointed not picture wise but the sound really makes a difference in a film.

Gonna Keep my 360 for streaming my .TS HD files LOL only thing its good for including playing Games :-)

[T800]

Originally Posted by Digicon

Well after many hours of reading on here and various other forums i have decided to Get rid of the 360 drive and buy a dedicated HD-E1 player and new HDMI amp just so i can at least get the Improvement of the Tru HD sound and DD+

Just really dissapointed not picture wise but the sound really makes a difference in a film.

Gonna Keep my 360 for streaming my .TS HD files LOL only thing its good for including playing Games :-)

The add-on for me was just a stop gap until the XE1 is released, unfortunatly it's not even a good stop gap with the audio issue's.

[jonathanTVTV]

Originally Posted by T800

The add-on for me was just a stop gap until the XE1 is released, unfortunatly it's not even a good stop gap with the audio issue's.

I'm doing the same... the 360 hd dvd drive will tide me over until a proper 1080p player with an hdmi connection becomes affordable. I have to say I'm fairly happy with the 360 drive for the moment. If Microsoft can fix the audio issues I'll probably hang onto it for a bit longer.

[HCK]

Originally Posted by Sanborn
Amir I hate to bother you with this question you probably can't answer - but I must.

When is the 360 addon going to have DTS ?


I realize there is a lot of interest in this. All I can say is that the core development work is finished but we need to roll this up in a console update and that takes a bit of time. So I appreciate your patience on this.

The above was taken from the avsforum.....they have been working on this for over a month now....so hopefully we should get the audio fix jan/feb.

[MacReady]

I have noticed just how flat the sound is and how little the rears seem to be worked when watching MI:III

As others have said, the add on is simply a stop gap for me until I buy a dedicated HD-DVD player and new amp with HDMI v1.3 (when they finally start to appear !) and I am more than happy with the picture it provides....just a bit dissapointed with the sound

[T800]

Originally Posted by HCK

Originally Posted by Sanborn
Amir I hate to bother you with this question you probably can't answer - but I must.

When is the 360 addon going to have DTS ?


I realize there is a lot of interest in this. All I can say is that the core development work is finished but we need to roll this up in a console update and that takes a bit of time. So I appreciate your patience on this.

The above was taken from the avsforum.....they have been working on this for over a month now....so hopefully we should get the audio fix jan/feb.

Quite a few people don't think a DTS update is gonna sort out the problem.

[HCK]

MS are aware of the problem, Amirm who is part of the HD DVD dev team has said that the fix will be in the DTS update.

[Digicon]

Hi Guys,

Correct me if i am wrong but after many late nights of reading and scouring for Info on HD-DVD am i correct in saying that no matter how many software fixes Microsoft bring out the 360 HD-DVD drive will still never be able to reproduce DD+ and True HD and also DTS-HD due to the Limited bandwidth constraints of the Optical output on the lead.

I could be totally wrong but from what i can gather Microsoft will either have to release an HDMI Cable(Highly Unlikely) for the 360 or a cable with seperate analogue outputs for a dedicated amplifier.

This reasoning is what has led me to buy a HD-E1 and a new Amp with HDMI connection so at least i can transfer the Lossless sound through the HDMI cable into the back of the Amp, Then at least i can benefit form near DD+ and True HD Sound and of course DTS-HD

I stand corrected if this is complete Tosh of course can anyone varify.

Thanks

[HCK]

Originally Posted by Digicon

Hi Guys,

Correct me if i am wrong but after many late nights of reading and scouring for Info on HD-DVD am i correct in saying that no matter how many software fixes Microsoft bring out the 360 HD-DVD drive will still never be able to reproduce DD+ and True HD and also DTS-HD due to the Limited bandwidth constraints of the Optical output on the lead.

I could be totally wrong but from what i can gather Microsoft will either have to release an HDMI Cable(Highly Unlikely) for the 360 or a cable with seperate analogue outputs for a dedicated amplifier.

This reasoning is what has led me to buy a HD-E1 and a new Amp with HDMI connection so at least i can transfer the Lossless sound through the HDMI cable into the back of the Amp, Then at least i can benefit form near DD+ and True HD Sound and of course DTS-HD

I stand corrected if this is complete Tosh of course can anyone varify.

Thanks

You are correct but the fix is for the dynamic compression people are experiencing with the audio on the 360 add on. The fix is to allow full rate DTS 1.5 mb.

[MacReady]

Rumours are still floating around about an HDMI cable for the 360 as well...I suppose it could appear at some point assuming it is actually possible?

[T800]

Originally Posted by MacReady

Rumours are still floating around about an HDMI cable for the 360 as well...I suppose it could appear at some point assuming it is actually possible?

I think it's very possible, they could have an extra box coupled via USB and outputting HDMI then you wouldn't have to rely on the A/V output on the 360.
It wouldn't be cheap though.

[MacReady]

Originally Posted by T800

I think it's very possible, they could have an extra box coupled via USB and outputting HDMI then you wouldn't have to rely on the A/V output on the 360.
It wouldn't be cheap though.

So I take it the AV output of the 360 is not capable of outputting a single through an HDMI cable?

The price thing is the issue though...at what point does it become more sensible to just pay for a stand alone player than it does for all the parts needed to make the 360 doe the same job!

[Johnny Utah]

Originally Posted by MacReady

So I take it the AV output of the 360 is not capable of outputting a single through an HDMI cable?

The price thing is the issue though...at what point does it become more sensible to just pay for a stand alone player than it does for all the parts needed to make the 360 doe the same job!

This is a good point! The advantage to the drive is the price tag, bringing out an expensive hdmi cable is not a wise move from MS imo.

I can live with the lack of HD sound for now as long as they sort the DD 5.1 out or provide DTS. Either one will do for now.

[CaPo]

As far as im aware Dolby Digital + is a higher bitrate version of Dolby Digital and is fully compatible with the 360 and optical connections.
Dolby TrueHD is not fully supported due to the lack of analogue connections, but it is downmixed to DD+ and still sounds better.

[Digicon]

Originally Posted by CaPo

As far as im aware Dolby Digital + is a higher bitrate version of Dolby Digital and is fully compatible with the 360 and optical connections.
Dolby TrueHD is not fully supported due to the lack of analogue connections, but it is downmixed to DD+ and still sounds better.

If thats the case well God help microsoft because my SD DVD of king kong played through my pioneer DVD Recorder had far more dynamic sound than the HD-DVD version did through the Xbox 360.

I am afraid to say if you want big screen sound to match the fantastic Picture Toshiba HD-DVD players are the only way to go.

My HD-XE1 order is placed and my 360 HD-DVD is on ebay

[Johnny Utah]

Originally Posted by CaPo

As far as im aware Dolby Digital + is a higher bitrate version of Dolby Digital and is fully compatible with the 360 and optical connections.
Dolby TrueHD is not fully supported due to the lack of analogue connections, but it is downmixed to DD+ and still sounds better.

Dolby Digital + is decoded by the player but not output due to bandwidth issues with the optical connection. It's re-encoded as standard DD 5.1 (after being mixed with the other sound effects like the menus etc)

[T800]

Once it has been updated the add-in will in theory sound better than standard 5.1

[richard plumb]

Originally Posted by T800

Quite a few people don't think a DTS update is gonna sort out the problem.

it should do. Thats what I was using on my Toshiba HD-A1 (DTS 1.5Mb) and it sounded way better than my 360 add-on

[T800]

Originally Posted by richard plumb

it should do. Thats what I was using on my Toshiba HD-A1 (DTS 1.5Mb) and it sounded way better than my 360 add-on

Your Toshiba was taking a correct DD+ signal generated by the player and converting it to DTS letting all it's 1.5mb goodness out where the add-on isn't processing the DD+ signal properly there for it would be converting a poor dynamically compressed track into DTS.

I bet the Toshiba sounded a lot better than the 360 before it was converting everything to DTS.

I hope the DTS update does sort everything out but I can't see how taking what it's out putting now and converting to DTS is going to make it suddenly sound better otherwise why doesn't sound as good as DD 5.1 now ?

[robo989]

Most of what you said is just assumption and not true.

DD+ can be sent over the optical interconnect no problem. DD+ is just DD5.1 at a higher bitrate, the codec is the same.

The reason the KK disc sounds quiet is because IT IS!!!! Its not the 360 or anything, the disc itself is recorded at a very low volume.

I think the player is doing a pretty good job at decoding the sound, TrueHD sounds much better than dolby digital on a DVD even when re-encoded. The dolby plus tracks don't sound much better....But thats because they aren't much better, not the players fault.

Originally Posted by strett

As Dazza said above, the HD-DVD player will never output True HD audio or Dolby Digital + due to the fact that the optical out connection does not have the required bandwidth.

As it stands your HD-DVD's are decoded from their native format and then re-encoded to Dolby Digital 5.1 and sent to your receiver. Therefore no matter what format the particular DVD has, whether it be True HD or Dolby +, you will only have 5.1 sound when played with the xbox player. This could be seen as a step back in terms of audio due to the lack of hdmi connection.

I noticed that when watching king kong, the left and right rear speakers were barely getting sent any sound, i had to place my ear right next to each to make sure they were working at all. The same applied to the Sub, the deep bass sounds during some of the action scenes were not present as you'd expect with 5.1 Dolby (A relatively old format by today's standards). I also noticed like you that the sound was 'flat' and i had to increase the volume substantially before it was at a comfortable level.

I don't yet have any other HD-DVD's to compare with but after reading a few reviews it seems that the HD-DVD player software is not doing a great job of recoding the audio.



Hopefully this future update can resolve this issue (possibly software?) and therefore provide better quality audio!

[robo989]

My god, there's so many ignorant posters in this thread

Learn ya facts!

DD+ is DD - !

There is plenty of bandwidth available on the optical output, do you people even know what bit rate DD+ is? Do you know the bandwidth available over an optical cable....thought not!



The 360 drive costs £130 if you didn't all notice, if you bought it as a stop gap then your not really part of the market the drive was designed for and thus your comments are irrelevent.

The audio problem, with dynamic range compression is a simple fix that ms will do and when its released you will all be singing its praise again...

until something else goes wrong when you will resort back to the incessant moaning and spouting of innacuracies.

But then we all do it, would just be nice if people could actually get the facts right when they post, especially when the post is based around the so called "fact".

Finally, you won't need another USB addon to get a HDMI cable working, it will plug straight into the AV out on the xbox 360 itself. The av out on the 360 is a propietory system, why do you think you can just plug in a component cable and a VGA cable and it work?

Any update on when the fix from MS might be released??